Why should we have to? I frankly could care less what anyone says about SF or the people that go there--it's not gonna stop me from going there. People take this way too seriously which is why I don't normally participate in these "my club is better than your club," "your crowd is ruining my club" threads (and after this post I won't any further). I enjoy myself when I go to SF and that's all that matters. Don't lump all people that go to SF in the same boat. If you or anyone else goes there on a regular basis, you'd see that the people you claim are "ruining" "your" club are a small segment of the SF crowd--that's right, asshole sauceheads and pretentious silicone breasted beauty queens do not comprise the majority of the SF crowd. Neither I, nor girly, nor nychic, nor neena16 nor djdanfury, nor piro8, nor bmw4jay, nor any of the other Factory heads I've met from this board fall into the pretentious asshole category. So be a little more narrow in your characterizations and don't try to make us guilty by association. And before you call Factory a crack den, check yourself. Although I've never been there, I have friends that are regulars at Vinyl who tell me the drug prevalence is bad there too. My two cents.