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t0nythelover

is bush losing support for war?

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seems to me like bush is finally starting to listen to the rest of the world and back off. internationally there has always been dissent about the war in iraq(the coming iraq war only), and on the homefront it seems like congress is growing some balls. will they pass the war resolution, or has it been past already. ive been reading up on stuff for school so i havent been really into the news.

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From what I have read Congress is close to passing the Use of Force resolution. Saddam's latest back pedaling will probably sway some support Bush's way, but Russia, France and China are still oppossed to war or any new UN sanctions. So that is where the problem lies bacause of their veto power.

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Actually we are closer to war now than we were a month ago. Congress is finally showing a united front, (as they should). and as far as Rusia, France, China are concerned, they really cant stop us from attacking Iraq. Rusia from what I hear is one of Iraqs supporters, but when shit hits the fan they'll have no other choice but to back us or at least stay neutral. Remember Rusia just sign a deal for oil with Iraq. If a new regime would take power that might void any deals they got with the current regime. Once again oil comes into play, people talk about the US being after oil, when the only reason Rusia if opposing an attack on Iraq is cause they are after Iraqs oil too.

The French well what can I say bout them, we save their ass numerous of times and when we need them they try to play the peace makers. Call us again when Germany starts acting up.....

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true no one can stop us from attacking, but as far as the UN is concerned Russia, France or China can veto any proposed action they wish to take be it new restriction or militray intervention. That's a good point you brought up about Russia. talk about agendas.

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i think the war is going to happen, whether the world likes it or not, since when did the US actually listen to its allies and others in matters like this.

not to mention we have a chimpanzee for a president.

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Originally posted by dnice35

Actually we are closer to war now than we were a month ago. Congress is finally showing a united front, (as they should). and as far as Rusia, France, China are concerned, they really cant stop us from attacking Iraq. Rusia from what I hear is one of Iraqs supporters, but when shit hits the fan they'll have no other choice but to back us or at least stay neutral. Remember Rusia just sign a deal for oil with Iraq. If a new regime would take power that might void any deals they got with the current regime. Once again oil comes into play, people talk about the US being after oil, when the only reason Rusia if opposing an attack on Iraq is cause they are after Iraqs oil too.

The French well what can I say bout them, we save their ass numerous of times and when we need them they try to play the peace makers. Call us again when Germany starts acting up.....

You bring up alot of good points but Russia opposes us attacking Iraq because of a debt owed to them for arms sold to Iraq in the past (tanks, jets and such not nukes). Russia is actually a very big exporter of oil and they are just protecting the I beleieve 6 to 8 billion debt Iraq owes them. Vladimir Putin has become very cozy to our president in the past and when he realizes thet Russia stands to make more then the debt owed he will drop Iraq like a hot potato.

Good post especially the Fawking French I hate the french...

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Originally posted by igloo

\

intelligence.....insight.... thought provoking.........

What a future you have.....

Moron

well, if you put it that way, in this country i would have a very good chance of becoming president if i am a moron, can't read or talk for shit, and have very slanted, onesided views.

wouldn't you agree, dear igloo?

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Originally posted by sassa

well, if you put it that way, in this country i would have a very good chance of becoming president if i am a moron, can't read or talk for shit, and have very slanted, onesided views.

wouldn't you agree, dear igloo?

Since when is a persons leadership skills graded on how they gave a speech When it should be judged on delivering what the speech says

To name a few,

-1.3 trillion tax cut

-winning a war on terror

- keeping Al Gore out of office

:D

Clinton was a excellent speaker and we all know where that got

us. :laugh: :laugh:

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Originally posted by bigmahs

Since when is a persons leadership skills graded on how they gave a speech When it should be judged on delivering what the speech says

To name a few,

-1.3 trillion tax cut

-winning a war on terror

- keeping Al Gore out of office

:D

Clinton was a excellent speaker and we all know where that got

us. :laugh: :laugh:

ever heard of SARCASM

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Originally posted by bigpoppanils

former US generals Schwarzkopf and Zinni (multiple spelling errors) have denounced Bush's Iraqi invasion plan

when i wrote that schwarzkopf was against the war someone told me he wasnt "or else itd be all over tv"

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I've said this before and I'll say it again....FUCK THE UN.....It has become a bitch to Iraq and it stands to become powerless....Iraq has broken UN resolutions countless times and the UN does nothing because they want peace in the world....Right.....I wanna see how long that's gonna work for.....Pretty soon they'll become useless.....Whats the point of passing resolutions if countries are free to break them at will with no consequence's whatsoever....As far as Russia is concerned...They brokered the deal that let Iraq designate over 1000 area's as "presidential sites"....Well these presidential sites cant be inspected without advance notice so I wonder Saddam will be doing there once he gets word inspectors are coming....The French...Always have been pussies and always will.....The Germans....After some of the recent comments they have made I have zero respect for them and their relationship with the US is severely deteriorating....I wanna see what's gonna happen when they ask the US for help in the future.....One last thing....I say America look at West Africa....Alot of struggling nations there that could use our help...We could use their oil...Fuck the Middle East...We have no allies there.....

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Originally posted by bigpoppanils

former US generals Schwarzkopf and Zinni (multiple spelling errors) have denounced Bush's Iraqi invasion plan

I like to see where you saw that please. I am not denying it just want to see it.

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Shwartzkoff (sp?) stated that the US should not go it alone, that they should get UN support. He never stated that attacking Iraq in general was a bad idea. He supports a regime change if it is supported by the international community.

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The UN are starting to sound like a bunch of peace loving hippies, If they are NOT gonna help then they should just back the fuck up and let us do what we gotta do. Rusia is the top exporter of oil from Iraq and know once the US goes in, we will probably be taking their piece of the pie. So whatever hidden agenda they have they can forget about it. and like I said before I hope France calls us again when someone starts picking on their pussy ass.

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Gen. Zinni Says War With Iraq Is Unwise

By MIKE SALINERO [email protected]

Published: Aug 24, 2002

TALLAHASSEE - One of President Bush's top Middle East trouble- shooters warned Friday against war with Iraq, saying it would stretch U.S. forces too thin and make unwanted enemies in the volatile region.

Retired Marine Gen. Anthony Zinni, the president's special envoy to the Mideast, made some of his strongest comments to date opposing war on Iraq. Speaking to the Economic Club of Florida in Tallahassee, Zinni said a war to bring down Iraqi strongman Saddam Hussein would have numerous undesirable side effects and should be low on the nation's list of foreign policy objectives.

``I can give you many more [priorities] before I get to that,'' Zinni said when asked if the United States should move to remove Saddam.

Zinni said the country should instead concentrate on negotiating a peace accord between Israel and the Palestinians, and on eliminating the Taliban in Afghanistan and the al-Qaida terrorist network that launched the Sept. 11 terror attacks.

``We need to make sure the Taliban and al-Qaida can't come back,'' he said.

Much more important to Mideast stability than Iraq is Iran, Zinni said. Iran has been one of the leading financiers of Islamic terror organizations such as Hezbollah since followers of the Ayatollah Khamenei took American hostages in 1979.

Now, opportunities exist for the United States to encourage a peaceful transition in Iran where young people are increasingly challenging the power of the Islamic theocracy.

Zinni said an Iraqi war would be expensive and would draw down the armed forces' manpower, which is already ``stretched too tight all over the world.''

Worst of all, Zinni said, a war against Iraq would antagonize America's friends in the Middle East.

``We need to quit making enemies that we don't need to make enemies out of,'' he said.

Efforts to get the White House to comment on Zinni's remarks were unsuccessful.

When Zinni commanded the Army's Central Command at MacDill Air Force Base in Tampa, he publicly trashed a plan spawned in the White House to train 200 Iraqi exiles. This group would train another 5,000 men who U.S intelligence forces would insert into southern Iraq. The plan envisioned the small force capturing an air base and triggering massive defections from the Iraqi army.

Zinni derided the plan as ``Bay of Goats,'' a sarcastic reference to the failed U.S.- backed invasion by Cuban exiles at the Bay of Pigs in 1961.

Bush administration hawks, including Vice President Dick Cheney and Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, have tried to keep the possibility of war with Iraq at the forefront of U.S. foreign policy.

Zinni took a shot at the hawks, noting their lack of military experience. He ticked off several prominent military men who have expressed reservations about the war: Secretary of State Colin Powell, former chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff; Gen. Brent Scowcroft, former national security adviser under former President Bush; and Gen. H. Norman Schwarzkopf, commander of operations in the Persian Gulf War.

``It's pretty interesting that all the generals see it the same way,'' he said, ``and all the others who have never fired a shot and are hot to go to war see it another way.''

Zinni was picked by Powell late last year to negotiate a cease fire between Israel and the Palestinian Authority. Any progress Zinni made dissolved when Palestinian terror organizations launched a wave of suicide attacks against Israeli civilians. The attacks in turn brought retaliatory incursions into Palestinian territory by Israeli Defense Forces.

http://tampatrib.com/News/MGA65V9295D.html

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Zinni was picked by Powell late last year to negotiate a cease fire between Israel and the Palestinian Authority. Any progress Zinni made dissolved when Palestinian terror organizations launched a wave of suicide attacks against Israeli civilians. The attacks in turn brought retaliatory incursions into Palestinian territory by Israeli Defense Forces.

Ok and why should we listen to this loser? He obviously failed in the peace talks between Israel and Palestine.

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