U.S. Islamic Schools Teaching Homegrown Hate

[igloo]

U.S. Islamic Schools Teaching Homegrown Hate

February 27, 2002

By Kenneth Adelman

NEW YORK — Can it be true? That Islamic schools in the United States teach hatred towards American Christians and Jews?

The Washington Post on Monday revealed that one such school outside Washington, D.C., uses textbooks teaching 11th graders that "the Day of Judgment can't come until Jesus Christ returns to Earth, breaks the cross and converts everyone to Islam, and until Muslims start attacking Jews."

Other accredited Islamic schools in America have world maps on classroom walls that exclude Israel. Some such schools promote class discussions that portray Usama bin Laden as "simply the victim of … prejudice" against all Muslims in America.

These astonishing facts were broken by Post reporters Valerie Strauss and Emily Wax in their front-page piece, too tepidly entitled, "Where Two Worlds Collide: Muslim Schools Face Tension of Islamic, U.S. Views."

But their reporting was anything but tepid.

Americans generally assume Islamic hate teaching resided "out there" — in Cairo or Riyadh. And yet it's right here — in the elite Islamic Saudi Academy just outside Washington, D.C. "At stake," the two ace reporters say, "is how the next generation of Muslims coming of age in the United States will participate in the country they live in."

As with all educational institutions, the stakes are high. But the prospects here are low.

I don't know precisely what new immigrant schools taught when waves of Catholics or Jews first flocked to America. But I suspect they adopted and spread the basic American values — tolerance, freedom and patriotism.

Surely not the hatred propagated in many Islamic studies classes. At the Al-Qalam All-Girls School in Springfield, Va., seventh graders learn that Usama bin Laden may be not a villain but a victim of Americans' biased views toward great Islamic leaders. Hence "some students question the government's claim that bin Laden is responsible for the terrorist attacks — disputing that videotapes actually show him taking credit."

The Post reporters questioned "Fawzy, a 19-year-old who will graduate from George Mason University in 2003, [who] … wonders whether the United States just needed someone to blame and picked a Muslim. 'A lot of the students can't make up their minds if [usama] is a good guy or a bad guy,' Fawzy said. 'The thing is, we don't have any real proof either way. I think a lot of people feel this way.'"

Classrooms of the Washington Islamic Academy, which teaches kindergarten through fourth grade, feature world maps without Israel. "Upstairs in Al-Qalam girls school, the word is blackened out with marker, with 'Palestine' written in its place."

When the reporters asked about this, academy officials "defended the maps, pointing out that some of the students are refugees from Palestine and want their heritage represented."

These school officials attempt to delegitimize Israel. I would delegitimize them — removing them from any role in shaping the beliefs and instilling knowledge in young Americans.

With the massive immigration of Muslims over recent decades — primarily because of the wretchedness of most native Islamic states — these parochial schools are increasing. Throughout America now are 200 to 600 Islamic day schools, teaching at least 30,000 full-time students and thousands more on weekends. The Washington Islamic Academy, outside the nation's capital, teaches some 1,300 kids, including children of Arabic-speaking diplomats.

It may rank among the worst of these academies, as it is funded by Saudi money. Its high school textbook, in the reporters' words, "says one sign of the Day of Judgment will be that Muslims will fight and kill Jews, who will hide behind trees that say: 'Oh Muslim, Oh servant of God, here is a Jew hiding behind me. Come here and kill him.'"

According to Strauss and Wax, "Several students of different ages, all of whom asked not to be identified, said that in Islamic studies, they are taught that it is better to shun and even to dislike Christians, Jews and Shiite Muslims.

"Some teachers 'focus more on hatred,' said one teenager … 'They teach students that whatever is kuffar [non-Muslim], it is okay for you' to hurt or steal from that person."

What can be done about this outrage?

First, reveal it, for which Valerie Strauss and Emily Wax and the Post deserve a Pulitzer Prize. Other reporters and top media outlets should follow in their steps.

Second, stop the accreditation of these hate schools. This, too, the reporters investigated when contacting an official at an accrediting agency of the Islamic Academy. His response was typical bureaucratese: the Secondary and Middle School Commission of the Southern Association of Colleges and Schools "does not delve into curriculum extensively but … would be 'concerned' about such material being taught."

Well, he can stop being "concerned" and start de-accrediting the place.

Third, stop the Saudi funding. After Sept. 11, we were shocked to realize that "our friends, the Saudis" gave us Usama bin Laden, 15 of the 19 terrorists of Sept. 11 and more than 100 of the 150-plus terrorist leaders now confined in Guantanamo Bay cells. They also fund the Islamic schools spreading hate around the world towards Christians, Jews, America, freedom, and our sacred values.

Now we learn that Islamic hatred is being spread here at home, molding young American minds in what is shaping up as a real fourth column.

Kenneth Adelman is a frequent guest commentator on Fox News, was assistant to U.S. Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld from 1975 to 1977 and, under President Ronald Reagan, U.N. ambassador and arms-control director. Mr. Adelman is now co-host of TechCentralStation.com.

[normalnoises]

Christian fundamentalist schools teaching home-grown hate.

Igloo teaching home-grown hate.

Kenneth Adelman teaching home-grown hate.

Bill O'Reilly teaching home-grown hate.

Fox News teaching home-grown hate.

I get a kick out of you using the opinion of an individual spewing hate-based, KKK style journalism and passing it off as a reliable source.

You're a fucking retard.

[mr mahs]

It's the no spin zone bitch ass. What would you rather watch Real time with Bill Maher??? His only argumant against the war is what has sadam done to us lately???

I would pay 50 bucks to see Bill Oreilly or Sean Hannity on that show to teach that little whinning bitch boy Maher the real thraet we are facing.. I sware I would give a limb to watch someone tear into that asshole!!!!

[igloo]

Originally posted by normalnoises

Christian fundamentalist schools teaching home-grown hate.

Igloo teaching home-grown hate.

Kenneth Adelman teaching home-grown hate.

Bill O'Reilly teaching home-grown hate.

Fox News teaching home-grown hate.

I get a kick out of you using the opinion of an individual spewing hate-based, KKK style journalism and passing it off as a reliable source.

You're a fucking retard.

Wow--great logic--another sign of your lack of intelligence, and again, ignoring the topic....

Truth be told--you are the hate-monger here----look at yourself retard....

And shouldn't you be leaving the country!

[normalnoises]

Originally posted by igloo

Wow--great logic--another sign of your lack of intelligence, and again, ignoring the topic....

Truth be told--you are the hate-monger here----look at yourself retard....

And shouldn't you be leaving the country!

Why don't you come here and try the slightest to throw me out racist fag?

[normalnoises]

Originally posted by mrmhs

It's the no spin zone bitch ass. What would you rather watch Real time with Bill Maher??? His only argumant against the war is what has sadam done to us lately???

I would pay 50 bucks to see Bill Oreilly or Sean Hannity on that show to teach that little whinning bitch boy Maher the real thraet we are facing.. I sware I would give a limb to watch someone tear into that asshole!!!!

I hope Maher brings a gun with him so he can blow what little brain they have left, live and in color and saves two more bullets for you and igloo.

I have every reason to boycott the corporate media.

I find the independants to be far more reliable.

[normalnoises]

A Hip Hop Magazine Attacks O'Reilly For Criticizing Thug Rappers

Wednesday, February 19, 2003

This is a partial transcript from The O'Reilly Factor, February 18, 2003. Click here to order the complete transcript.

Watch The O'Reilly Factor weeknights at 8 p.m. and 11 p.m. ET and listen to the Radio Factor!

BILL O'REILLY, HOST: In the Personal Story segment tonight, a hip-hop magazine called "The Source" personally attacks me in an article called "Five Reasons Bill O'Reilly Can Never Come to the 'Hood." The piece is the usual propaganda, that I didn't have a working-class upbringing, that I'm against blacks, that I'm a bully, blah, blah, blah.

Now the reason this kind of personal stuff is put out there is that those who sell and condone the selling of mind poison in the form of anti-social rap cannot win the argument. The stuff hurts unsupervised children, many of whom are poor.

With us now is the founder and CEO of The Source, David Mays, a Harvard graduate.

So, you know, two Harvard men here. You know. Let's have a civil discussion.

We had a couple of high school teachers in here from poor neighborhoods in New York City, and they spun a harrowing tale about how 10-year-old boys are now calling 10-year-old girls in their class hos and bitches and al of that and how the impact of the rap and hip-hop music has changed the behavior of grammar school students. Do you dispute that?

DAVID MAYS, CEO, THE SOURCE: Yes, I do. I dispute that.

O'REILLY: So these teachers are lying?

MAYS: I think that, you know, we can find different teachers that would give you lots of different opinions about what the problems are with young people around the country and educating them, in the inner cities in particular.

You know, there are issues as far as what rap music's impact is in the sense of, you know, rap music that is allowed to get to kids that is adult-oriented music or adult-oriented material, and, you know, those are some issues within the hip-hop community that we discuss.

Now, in your opening piece, you made the point that the only reason that we have to attack you is because we can win the argument no other way.

O'REILLY: You can't win the argument.

MAYS: Well, it's very simple. The reason we can't -- the reason we have trouble winning the argument -- we will win the argument because what we speak is the truth and it touches, you know, human beings out there who are not racist and don't promote racist points of view, but...

O'REILLY: Like me?

MAYS: Like you, yes.

O'REILLY: OK.

MAYS: And...

O'REILLY: So, you know, why don't -- let me stop you right there.

MAYS: Hold it. Let me finish my thought...

O'REILLY: Whoa, whoa. I'll let you...

MAYS: ... because I'll let you...

O'REILLY: ... finish your point, but just the fact that you say that, all right, and you use that argument because I criticize this pernicious industry, OK, cheapens you. It makes you look small because you don't -- you're not rebutting my argument based upon facts and testimony. You're saying, because I make the argument, I'm a racist.

MAYS: No, that's not correct.

O'REILLY: All right.

MAYS: The reason...

O'REILLY: Well, what do you base that thought or statement on?

MAYS: OK. First, the point I was making is that the reason we have trouble defending ourselves against arguments like the ones you make is because you represent a very powerful force, which is the media industry in this country, and the media industry, like yourself, has a way of promoting imagery and stereotypes that program people's minds to allow the continuance of racial -- racism and racist beliefs and white supremacy...

O'REILLY: You can say that about anything.

MAYS: ... in this country.

O'REILLY: That argument is...

MAYS: OK. Well...

O'REILLY: ... so specious and shallow.

MAYS: ... it's not specious at all.

O'REILLY: You could say that about anything. Well -- oh.

MAYS: The things that you do appeal to middle America's fear of blacks, and the -- and by continuing to promote these images...

O'REILLY: Oh, listen to this.

MAYS: ... what you do is you rile up middle America...

O'REILLY: Look...

MAYS: ... you rile up people that are afraid of black men, that are...

O'REILLY: ... you want to hear -- you want to hear why your argument...

MAYS: ... afraid because of the...

O'REILLY: Wait. Hold it. Just hold it. You made your argument, and I'm going to rebut the argument. Then you can rebut my rebuttal. That's how gentlemen behave.

If I were fabricating this stuff, you'd be right. If I were pulling stats that were wrong or telling you that the teachers -- I'm making the teachers up, that they weren't real teachers, then you can have an argument.

But everything that I say and do here is based on fact. We know what the lyrics that Ludacris puts out are. We know what the lyrics Eminem puts out are. We know what -- the lyrics Jay Z put out. We know them. They're down on paper.

MAYS: Do you know the lifestyles of these young men?

O'REILLY: Don't care about the lifestyles...

MAYS: Do you know the backgrounds?

O'REILLY: Couldn't care less about it.

MAYS: Well...

O'REILLY: It doesn't matter.

MAYS: It does. It does. You're reducing them to a lyric on a page. You're taking a lyric...

O'REILLY: I'm...

MAYS: ... one person's lyric from a song...

O'REILLY: ... taking...

MAYS: ... and you're reducing that human being...

O'REILLY: Correct because...

MAYS: ... to represent something, OK.

O'REILLY: Do you think a 9-year-old kid has any idea where these guys come from, what they do? He hears or she hears these insidious lyrics that they -- some of them, unsupervised mostly -- adopt in their presentation, sir, all right. And, once they do that, that hurts them, it stigmatizes them, and they can't fight the battle they need to succeed.

MAYS: Those same 9-year-old impressionable kids are being more oppressed by the eurocentric school curriculums that many of them are put through...

O'REILLY: Oh.

MAYS: ... OK, by the media, like yourself, that, again, continues to promote...

O'REILLY: Yes, I know. It's my fault. It's my fault.

MAYS: ... continue to promote negative stereotypes to play up to people's...

O'REILLY: OK. All right.

MAYS: ... fears of black people, which, essentially, at the end of the day, amounts...

O'REILLY: It's ridiculous.

MAYS: ... to racism, Bill. That's what it comes down to.

O'REILLY: Look, you...

MAYS: You can believe...

O'REILLY: You can point -- you can hide behind this racism argument, but you can't -- you can't deny the stats. You can't deny the damage. You sell -- you sell mind poison. You've gotten rich off that. You should be on my side.

MAYS: I sell and promote a culture that empowers people, that creates entrepreneurialism. Hip-hop has created a generation of -- those same 9-year-olds that you're thinking -- that now believe that they can build...

O'REILLY: How many of them are there?

MAYS: ... build -- that they can build businesses...

O'REILLY: How many of them are there?

MAYS: ... that they can start their own -- that they can overcome the way society programs them, the way people like you, who want to impose your point of view and your way of thinking, a paternalistic way on everybody else, that we're supposed to listen to you because you think you know everything, when you haven't spent a day in the 'hood, you haven't spent a day...

O'REILLY: That's -- I've done more reporting from the 'hood than you'll ever do, all right.

MAYS: Yes, like what? When was the last time you were in Brooklyn in the projects...

O'REILLY: Come on.

MAYS: ... let's say or...

O'REILLY: I have 28 years reporting...

MAYS: ... maybe in Compton or maybe some...

O'REILLY: ... in the worst neighborhoods in this country.

MAYS: Really?

O'REILLY: Yes.

MAYS: Really?

O'REILLY: I've seen more than you'll ever see. But I'm not going to -- look, I'm not going to go tit-for-tat with you. That's ridiculous.

Your point of view is that we are the oppressors, OK, and that we are the reason there's poverty and there's stereotypes.

My point of view -- and then the audience can make up their own mind -- is that people like you, all right, get rich -- just like a drug dealer, OK -- selling an image to children that will hurt them if they corporate that image into their presentation.

And here's an example. If you call...

MAYS: If we allow people like you to reduce it to an image, yes. If you, on the other hand...

O'REILLY: No. If you call a teacher or anybody in authority the F word, if you call 10-year-old girls hos, if you're disrespectful, if you cover yourself with tattoos, if you take and sell narcotics, all of those things will doom you to failure in this country.

MAYS: Yes, yes.

O'REILLY: You will not acknowledge that.

MAYS: And all of us who care about human beings should address why those problems exist, but the problem is not rap music, unfortunately.

O'REILLY: That's right, and you're exacerbating those problems.

MAYS: When you reduce rap music to an image and to a statement and you don't appreciate the cultural, you know, ramification -- you know, the cultural influence of this movement...

O'REILLY: I do.

MAYS: This is a movement that works to destroy...

O'REILLY: I know the influence very well.

MAYS: ... for 20 years. It's worked to bring white Harvard people like myself together...

O'REILLY: Do you know a guy named Heavy D?

MAYS: ... together with young...

O'REILLY: Do you know a guy named Heavy D? Do you know Heavy D?

MAYS: Of course I know...

O'REILLY: He agrees with me, Mr. Mays.

MAYS: Really?

O'REILLY: Yes.

MAYS: Well, maybe we should get him here and see if he agrees. He...

O'REILLY: I'm just going to tell you that you ought to look at this.

MAYS: Heavy D respects hip-hop culture, and he understands...

O'REILLY: You're hiding behind...

MAYS: ... that hip-hop has created entrepreneurs. It's created a generation of kids that have self-esteem now...

O'REILLY: Look, Will Smith and all those guys...

MAYS: ... that believe in them self. Will Smith...

O'REILLY: I'm down with that, too.

MAYS: Sure.

O'REILLY: I'm down with that.

MAYS: Heavy D...

O'REILLY: But the poison stuff that you guys not only put out but justify...

MAYS: Then we should all be concerned about the poison. We should all get together, focus on...

O'REILLY: Right.

MAYS: ... the few negative...

O'REILLY: We've got to go.

MAYS: ... things, yes.

O'REILLY: Now it will be interesting to see the e-mails, Mr. Mays, all right. You had your say, right. Two Harvard guys batting it around.

Click here to order the complete transcript

[mr mahs]

That's the best you can come up with

WEAK!!!!

[igloo]

Originally posted by mrmhs

That's the best you can come up with

WEAK!!!!

How fucking retarded was his post....there is really no limits to his stupidity

[mr mahs]

Who cares about the Source and Ludicriss that just filler so they seem well rounded.

[normalnoises]

So this is how you rebute to this?? Insults. You only proven me right idiots.

BTW That was an actual transcript from one of HIS SHOWS!!

FOOLS!!

[mr mahs]

This was not obtained from the Fox news archives. How do I know it's authenticity?? You and your but buddy Moonbeam could have rewrote this!!!!

moonbeam:peeright: ..normal

[normalnoises]

Originally posted by mrmhs

This was not obtained from the Fox news archives. How do I know it's authenticity?? You and your but buddy Moonbeam could have rewrote this!!!!

moonbeam:peeright: ..normal

Right here loser:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,79029,00.html

Believe me, it's authentic and that's the link (above).

A Hip Hop Magazine Attacks O'Reilly For Criticizing Thug Rappers

Wednesday, February 19, 2003

This is a partial transcript from The O'Reilly Factor, February 18, 2003. Click here to order the complete transcript.

Watch The O'Reilly Factor weeknights at 8 p.m. and 11 p.m. ET and listen to the Radio Factor!

BILL O'REILLY, HOST: In the Personal Story segment tonight, a hip-hop magazine called "The Source" personally attacks me in an article called "Five Reasons Bill O'Reilly Can Never Come to the 'Hood." The piece is the usual propaganda, that I didn't have a working-class upbringing, that I'm against blacks, that I'm a bully, blah, blah, blah.

Now the reason this kind of personal stuff is put out there is that those who sell and condone the selling of mind poison in the form of anti-social rap cannot win the argument. The stuff hurts unsupervised children, many of whom are poor.

With us now is the founder and CEO of The Source, David Mays, a Harvard graduate.

So, you know, two Harvard men here. You know. Let's have a civil discussion.

We had a couple of high school teachers in here from poor neighborhoods in New York City, and they spun a harrowing tale about how 10-year-old boys are now calling 10-year-old girls in their class hos and bitches and al of that and how the impact of the rap and hip-hop music has changed the behavior of grammar school students. Do you dispute that?

DAVID MAYS, CEO, THE SOURCE: Yes, I do. I dispute that.

O'REILLY: So these teachers are lying?

MAYS: I think that, you know, we can find different teachers that would give you lots of different opinions about what the problems are with young people around the country and educating them, in the inner cities in particular.

You know, there are issues as far as what rap music's impact is in the sense of, you know, rap music that is allowed to get to kids that is adult-oriented music or adult-oriented material, and, you know, those are some issues within the hip-hop community that we discuss.

Now, in your opening piece, you made the point that the only reason that we have to attack you is because we can win the argument no other way.

O'REILLY: You can't win the argument.

MAYS: Well, it's very simple. The reason we can't -- the reason we have trouble winning the argument -- we will win the argument because what we speak is the truth and it touches, you know, human beings out there who are not racist and don't promote racist points of view, but...

O'REILLY: Like me?

MAYS: Like you, yes.

O'REILLY: OK.

MAYS: And...

O'REILLY: So, you know, why don't -- let me stop you right there.

MAYS: Hold it. Let me finish my thought...

O'REILLY: Whoa, whoa. I'll let you...

MAYS: ... because I'll let you...

O'REILLY: ... finish your point, but just the fact that you say that, all right, and you use that argument because I criticize this pernicious industry, OK, cheapens you. It makes you look small because you don't -- you're not rebutting my argument based upon facts and testimony. You're saying, because I make the argument, I'm a racist.

MAYS: No, that's not correct.

O'REILLY: All right.

MAYS: The reason...

O'REILLY: Well, what do you base that thought or statement on?

MAYS: OK. First, the point I was making is that the reason we have trouble defending ourselves against arguments like the ones you make is because you represent a very powerful force, which is the media industry in this country, and the media industry, like yourself, has a way of promoting imagery and stereotypes that program people's minds to allow the continuance of racial -- racism and racist beliefs and white supremacy...

O'REILLY: You can say that about anything.

MAYS: ... in this country.

O'REILLY: That argument is...

MAYS: OK. Well...

O'REILLY: ... so specious and shallow.

MAYS: ... it's not specious at all.

O'REILLY: You could say that about anything. Well -- oh.

MAYS: The things that you do appeal to middle America's fear of blacks, and the -- and by continuing to promote these images...

O'REILLY: Oh, listen to this.

MAYS: ... what you do is you rile up middle America...

O'REILLY: Look...

MAYS: ... you rile up people that are afraid of black men, that are...

O'REILLY: ... you want to hear -- you want to hear why your argument...

MAYS: ... afraid because of the...

O'REILLY: Wait. Hold it. Just hold it. You made your argument, and I'm going to rebut the argument. Then you can rebut my rebuttal. That's how gentlemen behave.

If I were fabricating this stuff, you'd be right. If I were pulling stats that were wrong or telling you that the teachers -- I'm making the teachers up, that they weren't real teachers, then you can have an argument.

But everything that I say and do here is based on fact. We know what the lyrics that Ludacris puts out are. We know what the lyrics Eminem puts out are. We know what -- the lyrics Jay Z put out. We know them. They're down on paper.

MAYS: Do you know the lifestyles of these young men?

O'REILLY: Don't care about the lifestyles...

MAYS: Do you know the backgrounds?

O'REILLY: Couldn't care less about it.

MAYS: Well...

O'REILLY: It doesn't matter.

MAYS: It does. It does. You're reducing them to a lyric on a page. You're taking a lyric...

O'REILLY: I'm...

MAYS: ... one person's lyric from a song...

O'REILLY: ... taking...

MAYS: ... and you're reducing that human being...

O'REILLY: Correct because...

MAYS: ... to represent something, OK.

O'REILLY: Do you think a 9-year-old kid has any idea where these guys come from, what they do? He hears or she hears these insidious lyrics that they -- some of them, unsupervised mostly -- adopt in their presentation, sir, all right. And, once they do that, that hurts them, it stigmatizes them, and they can't fight the battle they need to succeed.

MAYS: Those same 9-year-old impressionable kids are being more oppressed by the eurocentric school curriculums that many of them are put through...

O'REILLY: Oh.

MAYS: ... OK, by the media, like yourself, that, again, continues to promote...

O'REILLY: Yes, I know. It's my fault. It's my fault.

MAYS: ... continue to promote negative stereotypes to play up to people's...

O'REILLY: OK. All right.

MAYS: ... fears of black people, which, essentially, at the end of the day, amounts...

O'REILLY: It's ridiculous.

MAYS: ... to racism, Bill. That's what it comes down to.

O'REILLY: Look, you...

MAYS: You can believe...

O'REILLY: You can point -- you can hide behind this racism argument, but you can't -- you can't deny the stats. You can't deny the damage. You sell -- you sell mind poison. You've gotten rich off that. You should be on my side.

MAYS: I sell and promote a culture that empowers people, that creates entrepreneurialism. Hip-hop has created a generation of -- those same 9-year-olds that you're thinking -- that now believe that they can build...

O'REILLY: How many of them are there?

MAYS: ... build -- that they can build businesses...

O'REILLY: How many of them are there?

MAYS: ... that they can start their own -- that they can overcome the way society programs them, the way people like you, who want to impose your point of view and your way of thinking, a paternalistic way on everybody else, that we're supposed to listen to you because you think you know everything, when you haven't spent a day in the 'hood, you haven't spent a day...

O'REILLY: That's -- I've done more reporting from the 'hood than you'll ever do, all right.

MAYS: Yes, like what? When was the last time you were in Brooklyn in the projects...

O'REILLY: Come on.

MAYS: ... let's say or...

O'REILLY: I have 28 years reporting...

MAYS: ... maybe in Compton or maybe some...

O'REILLY: ... in the worst neighborhoods in this country.

MAYS: Really?

O'REILLY: Yes.

MAYS: Really?

O'REILLY: I've seen more than you'll ever see. But I'm not going to -- look, I'm not going to go tit-for-tat with you. That's ridiculous.

Your point of view is that we are the oppressors, OK, and that we are the reason there's poverty and there's stereotypes.

My point of view -- and then the audience can make up their own mind -- is that people like you, all right, get rich -- just like a drug dealer, OK -- selling an image to children that will hurt them if they corporate that image into their presentation.

And here's an example. If you call...

MAYS: If we allow people like you to reduce it to an image, yes. If you, on the other hand...

O'REILLY: No. If you call a teacher or anybody in authority the F word, if you call 10-year-old girls hos, if you're disrespectful, if you cover yourself with tattoos, if you take and sell narcotics, all of those things will doom you to failure in this country.

MAYS: Yes, yes.

O'REILLY: You will not acknowledge that.

MAYS: And all of us who care about human beings should address why those problems exist, but the problem is not rap music, unfortunately.

O'REILLY: That's right, and you're exacerbating those problems.

MAYS: When you reduce rap music to an image and to a statement and you don't appreciate the cultural, you know, ramification -- you know, the cultural influence of this movement...

O'REILLY: I do.

MAYS: This is a movement that works to destroy...

O'REILLY: I know the influence very well.

MAYS: ... for 20 years. It's worked to bring white Harvard people like myself together...

O'REILLY: Do you know a guy named Heavy D?

MAYS: ... together with young...

O'REILLY: Do you know a guy named Heavy D? Do you know Heavy D?

MAYS: Of course I know...

O'REILLY: He agrees with me, Mr. Mays.

MAYS: Really?

O'REILLY: Yes.

MAYS: Well, maybe we should get him here and see if he agrees. He...

O'REILLY: I'm just going to tell you that you ought to look at this.

MAYS: Heavy D respects hip-hop culture, and he understands...

O'REILLY: You're hiding behind...

MAYS: ... that hip-hop has created entrepreneurs. It's created a generation of kids that have self-esteem now...

O'REILLY: Look, Will Smith and all those guys...

MAYS: ... that believe in them self. Will Smith...

O'REILLY: I'm down with that, too.

MAYS: Sure.

O'REILLY: I'm down with that.

MAYS: Heavy D...

O'REILLY: But the poison stuff that you guys not only put out but justify...

MAYS: Then we should all be concerned about the poison. We should all get together, focus on...

O'REILLY: Right.

MAYS: ... the few negative...

O'REILLY: We've got to go.

MAYS: ... things, yes.

O'REILLY: Now it will be interesting to see the e-mails, Mr. Mays, all right. You had your say, right. Two Harvard guys batting it around.

Congratulations, you've been de-ignorized.

Now Tell me it was not obtained from the fox news archives!

Doesn't it suck to be proven wrong??

[mr mahs]

To be honest didn't even read it at first but what does it prove??

That Bill O'reilly disagree's with rap lyrics? don't you beleive they can harm a child..

Below he proves his point.. It is the rap industry trying to play the race card

O'REILLY: Do you think a 9-year-old kid has any idea where these guys come from, what they do? He hears or she hears these insidious lyrics that they -- some of them, unsupervised mostly -- adopt in their presentation, sir, all right. And, once they do that, that hurts them, it stigmatizes them, and they can't fight the battle they need to succeed.

Oh and I give too shits about the rap industry.. This is nonsense

ooh you really caught me you really showed me up thanx I don't know what I would have done if I didn't know O'reilly argued with some rap mogul

[igloo]

normalnoises...

what is your point, other than proving your extreme weirdness........I saw this O'reilly show---it was a good debate--but what is your point wacko?

I mean this sincerely--get some professional help, a job and a hobby---