normalnoises Posted April 4 Report Share Posted April 4 http://apnews1.iwon.com//article/20030403/D7Q696O00.html?PG=home&SEC=newsAnti-Bush Remarks Stir Pearl Jam ConcertApr 3, 3:02 PM (ET)DENVER (AP) - Dozens of fans walked out of a Pearl Jam concert after lead singer Eddie Vedder took a mask of President Bush and impaled it on a microphone stand.Several concertgoers booed and shouted Tuesday night for Vedder to shut up as he told the crowd he was against the war and Bush. He impaled the mask during the encore of the band's opening show of a U.S. tour."It was like he decapitated someone in a primal ritual and stuck their head on a stick," fan Keith Zimmerman said.Vedder used a Bush mask in Australia and Japan to perform the song "Bushleaguer," from the band's latest album, "Riot Act." The song's lyrics say, "He's not a leader, he's a Texas leaguer."During the show, Vedder said: "Just to clarify... we support the troops.""We're just confused on how wanting to bring them back safely all of a sudden becomes non-support," he said. "We love them. They're not the ones who make the foreign policy .... Let's hope for the best and speak our opinions."Pearl Jam manager Kelly Curtis could not immediately be reached for comment Thursday.The Dixie Chicks were the target of boycotts and bans after their lead singer made anti-Bush statements on a London stage last month.__________I agree with him that just because you're anti-war does not mean you're anti-soldier. People who use that against the anti-war contingent are lame. Lame by assuming the anti-war contingent are anti-troop and pro-terrorist, when the anti-war contingement are pro-troop and anti-terrorist, lame by assuming the anti-war contingent are anti-American and anti-government and the Anti-war contingent must "leave it if you don't like it", when the anti-war contingent are pro-American and anti-government ("It's America I like, it's the government I hate") because it has screwed the country over by dragging us into war and rather stay here and change the system by generating solutions to the nations problems and using the power to vote, lame by assuming the Anti-war contingent is pro-Saddam just because the Anti-war contingent is anti-Bush when the anti war contingent is anti-Bush and anti-Saddam and lame by some of the people who went to see Eddie Vedder perform to shut up when he was using his right to free speech to announce he is anti war and anti-Bush.Why can't some people understand this simple concept? If you don't like what he said, fine. that's his right to be that way and say it. If you wanna boo him and leave the concert, go ahead, nobody's gonna stop you. It's your right to be that way. If you insist on telling him to 'shut up", go ahead. You have the right to say "shut up" to him but that does not mean he is obligated to "shut up" and agree to what you say because he has the right to say it, and say it like it or not.He said that in Denver, unlike the Dixie Chicks who recently made their anti-war announcement at a London venue. For Eddie Vedder to announce he is anti-war and anti-Bush in a country where the majority are pro-war and pro-Bush publicly at a rock concert in Denver, that takes alot of courage and that shows his bravery when he outs himself against the war inside an American based arena and in front of a sold out crowd.Now that is courage. GO EDDIE!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr mahs Posted April 4 Report Share Posted April 4 You think it matters to a serviceman that Eddie Veder supports them.. but in the same breathe talks trash about the gov't andthe President.. What do you think drives those serviceman to be willing to fight??? The love they have for this country stupid, they don't give a shit about you tree huggers that protest the war but are so dellusional that they can't come up with another solution...You and Eddie vedder can take your "I support the troops" cop out and GO FUCK YOURSELF!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dnice35 Posted April 4 Report Share Posted April 4 Originally posted by mr mahs You and Eddie vedder can take your "I support the troops" cop out and GO FUCK YOURSELF!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siceone Posted April 4 Report Share Posted April 4 you support the troops doing what? whether you like it or not attacking someones Boss and the person giving them orders makes troops question them. when you question orders on the battle field people die needlessly. All it does is lower morale.also I can't stand this half measures you're either for something or against it not Half for something. Im glad mr Veder appreciates his freedom to slander people, I just wished he wanted the same for the Iraqi people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ou812 Posted April 4 Report Share Posted April 4 Originally posted by mr mahs You think it matters to a serviceman that Eddie Veder supports them.. but in the same breathe talks trash about the gov't andthe President.. What do you think drives those serviceman to be willing to fight??? The love they have for this country stupid, they don't give a shit about you tree huggers that protest the war but are so dellusional that they can't come up with another solution...You and Eddie vedder can take your "I support the troops" cop out and GO FUCK YOURSELF!!!! Well let me ask you this. Do you think every troop over there in the Gulf supports this war? I can assure you that some don't. If the majority of the rest of the world does not support the war, just by reason of statistics it's a pretty safe bet that there are plenty of soldiers over there fighting, that do no support the war. It sucks that as part of basic military training you lose some of that ability for free thinking.The point is that the soldiers are just pawns of this government, they took an oath to serve so they must abide by it. I feel bad for them because no matter what they feel they have no say in their own destiny. The government says jump, all they can say is how high. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dnice35 Posted April 4 Report Share Posted April 4 Originally posted by ou812 The point is that the soldiers are just pawns of this government, they took an oath to serve so they must abide by it. I feel bad for them because no matter what they feel they have no say in their own destiny. The government says jump, all they can say is how high. Its part of being a soldier, an army would crumble if it was full of individuals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ou812 Posted April 4 Report Share Posted April 4 Originally posted by dnice35 Its part of being a soldier, an army would crumble if it was full of individuals. Well, that's the reason why someone would support the troops, who know no better, and are opposed to the government who can sit in their plush little offices while they send the sons and daughters of this country to go fight and die for their crooked policies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dnice35 Posted April 4 Report Share Posted April 4 Originally posted by ou812 Well, that's the reason why someone would support the troops, who know no better, and are opposed to the government who can sit in their plush little offices while they send the sons and daughters of this country to go fight and die for their crooked policies. thats a soldiers job, fortunate for us this is a voluntary millitary, in other countries its mandatory for individuals to join the armed forces and fight for what you call.... "crooked policies". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siceone Posted April 4 Report Share Posted April 4 Originally posted by ou812 Well, that's the reason why someone would support the troops, who know no better, and are opposed to the government who can sit in their plush little offices while they send the sons and daughters of this country to go fight and die for their crooked policies. How do you know none of the wealthy in this nation served in our military how dare you make a baseless accusation. how the hell do you know what goes on in basic unless you have been there I would like to know what our service men think of your statements about thier percived diminished capacity to think. I mean if you want to disent fine you can have a different opinion but for gods sake at least be honest about it. if you're gonna make wild, insensitive, False, and uninformed comments, please include the words in my opnion at the begining of your statements. So we know to Ignore what you're about to say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ou812 Posted April 4 Report Share Posted April 4 Originally posted by siceone How do you know none of the wealthy in this nation served in our military how dare you make a baseless accusation. how the hell do you know what goes on in basic unless you have been there I would like to know what our service men think of your statements about thier percived diminished capacity to think. I mean if you want to disent fine you can have a different opinion but for gods sake at least be honest about it. if you're gonna make wild, insensitive, False, and uninformed comments, please include the words in my opnion at the begining of your statements. So we know to Ignore what you're about to say. Do you know any millionaires that are going off to battle? Do you know any affluent well to do families that are sending their first born sons off to Bagdad? Because I sure don't, and I live right near Franklin Lakes and Wyckoff, 2 of the most affluent communites in all of Jersey. What's one of the major things the Army tempts young kids with to get them to enlist: Money for college. Rich families don't need money for college. Do you think most people join the armed forces because it's their goal in life, or because they don't have many other options.And as a matter of fact I've had many friends that have gone off to boot camp and they assured me that speaking their minds and trying to be an individual was not looked highly upon. In fact many of them that had left being outspoken and outgoing, and returned from it being reserved and introverted, I don't think that that was just coincidence.My opinions aren't a blanket statement of every person that is in the military, but I'm sure it applies to alot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cintron Posted April 4 Report Share Posted April 4 I happen to know many well-to-do individuals who are in the military and are serving their country in that capacity. It is NOT only made up of middle-class sons and daughters and the "exploited" workers of the social class. no thank you, Karl Marx.It's like any other JOB anywhere else, except it deals with the real world, not with the small little world you'd experience in a cubicle.There is a LOT of room for initiative and personal freedom in the military. It's all too easy to view soldiers as automatrons that are allowed no personality, no freedom and must follow everything to the letter without regard for individuality.sorry, but that's not the way things are. If you don't know, don't assume. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nycmuzik Posted April 4 Report Share Posted April 4 Originally posted by ou812 Do you know any millionaires that are going off to battle? Do you know any affluent well to do families that are sending their first born sons off to Bagdad? Because I sure don't, and I live right near Franklin Lakes and Wyckoff, 2 of the most affluent communites in all of Jersey. What's one of the major things the Army tempts young kids with to get them to enlist: Money for college. Rich families don't need money for college. Do you think most people join the armed forces because it's their goal in life, or because they don't have many other options.And as a matter of fact I've had many friends that have gone off to boot camp and they assured me that speaking their minds and trying to be an individual was not looked highly upon. In fact many of them that had left being outspoken and outgoing, and returned from it being reserved and introverted, I don't think that that was just coincidence.My opinions aren't a blanket statement of every person that is in the military, but I'm sure it applies to alot. In a few months I'm finishing a four year college and I'm getting my degree. I dont have any loans that need to be paid off. I dont need any money. I wasnt born in this country. But yet I'm still joining....Going into the Armed froces isnt for everyone. You either want to do it or you dont. I could go on and tell you the reasons I want to join but you'd probably just look at me and ask why.....As far as the soldiers over in Iraq supporting this war is concerned....If anyone of them joined the Armed Froces for one reason or another and expected not to see combat for one reason or another then I feel sorry for them....I'm not gung-ho or anything but if the leaders of this country ship me out to some foreign country to engage in a conflict then guess what, I signed up for it....Its not my job to question what I'm doing because I awknowleged the fact that I might see combat when I signed up.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cintron Posted April 4 Report Share Posted April 4 Originally posted by ou812 And as a matter of fact I've had many friends that have gone off to boot camp and they assured me that speaking their minds and trying to be an individual was not looked highly upon. In fact many of them that had left being outspoken and outgoing, and returned from it being reserved and introverted, I don't think that that was just coincidence. they came back changed, right?chances are, they learned that strength and confidence don't always come from being talkative and outspoken all the time. same thing happened to my cousins. Now they have a calm, cool and collected, strong air about them. That's discipline. Something i regard very highly in a person. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sassa Posted April 4 Report Share Posted April 4 Originally posted by siceone How do you know none of the wealthy in this nation served in our military how dare you make a baseless accusation. how the hell do you know what goes on in basic unless you have been there I would like to know what our service men think of your statements about thier percived diminished capacity to think. I mean if you want to disent fine you can have a different opinion but for gods sake at least be honest about it. if you're gonna make wild, insensitive, False, and uninformed comments, please include the words in my opnion at the begining of your statements. So we know to Ignore what you're about to say. out of all the 520+ senators and congressmen in office, only one congressman from north or south dakota, i believe, has a child in the armed forces.only one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr mahs Posted April 4 Report Share Posted April 4 My best freind went into the marines about 5years back when all of us were either in college or persuing other careers.. This kid was 21 years old and had nothing going for him , I mean he would sit home and rot on his couch.. He goes to the Marines after bootcamp came home completely diffrent. One thing I noticed was 2 days out of bootcamp we were the mall and he thought a group of kids were trying to abuse his haircut. He didn't scream like a goon or say what's your promblem but you can see the look in his eye.. His shoulders were slightly raised trying to observ the next move of his possible prey.. just crazy. He eventually returned back to the original kid personality wise but he works for the TSA, engaged and waiting to get into the FDNY so to say it was the best thing for his future is an understatment Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sassa Posted April 4 Report Share Posted April 4 Originally posted by mr mahs My best freind went into the marines about 5years back when all of us were either in college or persuing other careers.. This kid was 21 years old and had nothing going for him , I mean he would sit home and rot on his couch.. He goes to the Marines after bootcamp came home completely diffrent. One thing I noticed was 2 days out of bootcamp we were the mall and he thought a group of kids were trying to abuse his haircut. He didn't scream like a goon or say what's your promblem but you can see the look in his eye.. His shoulders were slightly raised trying to observ the next move of his possible prey.. just crazy. He eventually returned back to the original kid personality wise but he works for the TSA, engaged and waiting to get into the FDNY so to say it was the best thing for his future is an understatment i'm touched. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siceone Posted April 4 Report Share Posted April 4 Originally posted by sassa out of all the 520+ senators and congressmen in office, only one congressman from north or south dakota, i believe, has a child in the armed forces.only one. Why does it matter anyway do you think that people shoudl be forced into service ? aso what if thier children don't want to serve there are plenty of other ways to serve your country than going in the armed services. I don't have a problem with the sons of senators and such not going into the armed services because THEY DON'T have too NO ONE DOES. I think it's your collectivist socialist mentality thinking that people who join up are forced into it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dnice35 Posted April 4 Report Share Posted April 4 last I heard millitary service is voluntary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sassa Posted April 4 Report Share Posted April 4 Originally posted by siceone Why does it matter anyway do you think that people shoudl be forced into service ? aso what if thier children don't want to serve there are plenty of other ways to serve your country than going in the armed services. I don't have a problem with the sons of senators and such not going into the armed services because THEY DON'T have too NO ONE DOES. I think it's your collectivist socialist mentality thinking that people who join up are forced into it. that's not the point! the point is, these assholes are the same ones who authorize this to happen, yet at the same time that they're calling for bloody murder against their enemies, they are keeping their own children away from it....interesting isn't it...why wouldn't you want your children or someone close to you to fight in a war that YOU believe is just and fair? if that isn't the case, then don't create this stupid war in the first place. or don't be a hypocrite....but at this point, i think this would be an impossible thing to follow for most of the congress and senate.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dnice35 Posted April 4 Report Share Posted April 4 Originally posted by sassa that's not the point! the point is, these assholes are the same ones who authorize this to happen, yet at the same time that they're calling for bloody murder against their enemies, they are keeping their own children away from it....interesting isn't it...why wouldn't you want your children or someone close to you to fight in a war that YOU believe is just and fair? if that isn't the case, then don't create this stupid war in the first place. or don't be a hypocrite....but at this point, i think this would be an impossible thing to follow for most of the congress and senate.... LIKE I SAID MILLITARY IS VOLUNTARY.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr mahs Posted April 4 Report Share Posted April 4 Originally posted by sassa i'm touched. He wasn't as fortunate as you to attend diffrent schools around the world.. What is your major anyway???? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siceone Posted April 4 Report Share Posted April 4 Originally posted by sassa that's not the point! the point is, these assholes are the same ones who authorize this to happen, yet at the same time that they're calling for bloody murder against their enemies, they are keeping their own children away from it....interesting isn't it...why wouldn't you want your children or someone close to you to fight in a war that YOU believe is just and fair? if that isn't the case, then don't create this stupid war in the first place. or don't be a hypocrite....but at this point, i think this would be an impossible thing to follow for most of the congress and senate.... honey Being in the military is a JOB !!!! you agree to follow orders gotta love free enterprise Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sassa Posted April 4 Report Share Posted April 4 Originally posted by mr mahs He wasn't as fortunate as you to attend diffrent schools around the world.. What is your major anyway???? International relations/communications. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pumavisor808 Posted April 4 Report Share Posted April 4 To all these fucking celebrities.....If I'm at your concert, I paid to hear you sing your songs. Not preach to me about anything... I don't give a shit if you're for the war or against it. I want to hear you sing your songs and get the hell off stage....I'm paying alot of money and If I wanted to be preached to I would go to Church....So Keep the fucking politics out!!!!!!!! Pearl Jam:peeleft: Dixie Chicks:peeleft: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dnice35 Posted April 4 Report Share Posted April 4 Originally posted by pumavisor808 To all these fucking celebrities.....If I'm at your concert, I paid to hear you sing your songs. Not preach to me about anything... I don't give a shit if you're for the war or against it. I want to hear you sing your songs and get the hell off stage....I'm paying alot of money and If I wanted to be preached to I would go to Church....So Keep the fucking politics out!!!!!!!! Pearl Jam:peeleft: Dixie Chicks:peeleft: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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