**UPDATED 3** Recent examples of a collapsing club scene:

[Guest pod]

If I knew of a way of vetting new sign-ups without seeming overly controlling, I'd implement it.

Just kidding. The nice thing about communities like ours, it tends to sort out the riff-raff automatically.

[BobbyTrendy]

vipguestlist is dead

cooljunkie numbers are dying fast, I put them on warning that after march they may need cpr, so they need to fix it well before march.

njguido has about 1% club content on it and is pretty much dead.

clubplanet is a freaking ghost town, what ass clown thought it was a good idea to spend money and redoing that site which launches soon? They should call it CP Beta Max.

Local djs schedules are done, all except RR and Cedric. I swore I saw OG and Ralph working at 7/11 the other day, maybe this is why OG grew that beard?

Tiesto at Mansion "broke even" which means he will never play Miami again outside of WMC.

Is WMC even happening this year?

Are the Bang guys really selling blood and semen to pay off their huge debt? The promoters should have printed fake tickets.

Did LP pay off that 500k he lost on GG last year? Maybe this explains why he booked Parantula and the door guy to dj, times are tough!

GG is done, they won't have it this year, Nick should take GG off the forum headers already so the "punters" don't get confused. I nor UMF or the rest of the planet is fooled into thinking it's happening.

UMF is so lost, 2 days and they booked the Cure? The guys who booked the Cure probably decided to re do CP, lol Only way they make money is by a few of the promoters printing fake tickets and selling them again like they did a few years ago. BTW, Eddy and V run print shops, give them the business. If they can't make UMF profitable on one day, why do they think two is better??? Maybe because they don't use their own money to fund it?

BTW, some good news, Rok Bar reopened.

Space had the door guy djing, I guess LP felt bad after those 12 year olds kicked his ass last year. BTW K man, I'm pissed at you, im me for details.

Bling has turned his back on: Glass, Grass, Blue, that Laundry Mat, Space, deep house, trance, techno, dating, females.

Ramon bought a Beemer and no longer listens to techno, he's too busy doing fantasy football.

I hear A3TV has a new reality show called, Survivor Cameo. Viewers get to vote on who gets tossed out of the Cameo first, Emi, LP, Kenny, Cal, Grutman?

BTW Buster, who left the Hummer unlocked? Better check Ebay!!!

The jackasses who made an internet movie, Clubland to promote their clubs, that's how bad it has gotten.

Space is on the chopping block come summer, so the beach's crime rate should top Gary Indiana's soon, congrats Sobe, you worked hard at getting the title. The only person who deserves to be fired more than Sobe's Top Cop is Matt Milen, but luckily for Matt he works for Ford! 24-79! Wow what a record!

Mansion charged 100 bucks to see Morillo and wait it gets better, they text the entire country about it!

Dade went to China to "site see", yea right, he was over there selling shares of Shadow Lounge which some one tried to re open with that name in Sobe and thought it was a great idea!

The good news?

Gary Indiana will once again only be known as the home town of Joe Jackson and his merry band of fuck tarts.

lmfao nick you kill me

[Guest Marina22]

btw when i refered to nyc, san fran, dallas, etc. i am refering to the underground scene.

we all know that san fran, nyc and chicago will always have a really strong mainstream nightlife industry.

to me underground is exactly what it is. BYOB.. warehouse parties where people go for the music and if they break even or even make some sort of profit.. thats just an added bonus...

only ones i see in this city that at least is mentioned on this board is

joe's warehouse parties........and the residence parties

i also want to highlight something marina said a while back about mansion when she went to hear timo maas

I can comprehend it from both sides of the coin

VIP crowd spends the $$$ so Mansion ropes off most of the main room to cater to that crowd. Is that bad? Nope..

They bring in an underground dj to satiate the headz and bring in the cash at the same time by having a large VIP area

the problem is the undergound headz want to dance and when you have no dancing room available except at the far corner of the room behind the couches. which is a veritable clusterfuck of people going in and out of vip.. or the stairs in front of the ivy room then yeah people will voice their opinion.

personally this is why i go to small hole in the wall places and avoid larger venues.

Hell I like Roger Sanchez but i havent gone to see him at space only because i like to actually have dancing room. being shoved around from one corner of the patio to the other because its slammed is not my idea of a good time.

blame my old ass i guess.... so be it.. yeah i said it im OLD lol

yah i wont see a PVD, Tiesto or Danny Tenagalia play at Blue or Laundry bar but at least ill have room to dance..

course these venues bring in djs that cater more to the music heads as well becuase they can (they dont have the high overhead costs that pod has mentioned before... etc)

space will always pack it in...... cameo will pack it in..... mansion will continue to dominate the hip hop scene on sobe.

life goes on.......

HUH?!?!?!:

underground?

warehouses?

byob?

Dallas?

underground headz?

room to dance?

mainstream nightlife industry?

commercialization?

Bling...are you serious?!?

if it wasn't for the very things you criticize...you wouldn't even be aware of this scene you claim alliegeance to...

When you discovered EDM a few years back...and you were listening to PVD, Armin, Tiesto etc... at Ultra with 20,000 people smashed up against you and you had your hands in the air worshipping while wearing your custom "I love Trance" t-shirt....you had no fucking clue about these things you speak of now..BUT, thanks to that scene, you found this music and this scene.....so why knock it?

the way I see it is....

The Tiestos, PVDs, Morillos etc......are a very important part of this...they are the gateway drug...They are an introduction to a culture which at this point is pretty rich with talent...

I love this music...and as an artist I want EVERYONE to experience my music...I dont care who they are or how underground they claim to be..

If they are on the floor while Im playing house music...they're cool with me!!

Very true! I am the same age as Bling so we weren't clubbing back in the Warsaw days.. I got into the music/scene by way of partying with friends and trance was popular then so that's what we first heard. This introduction to EDM/raving was in 1996-97, after I had been listening to U2, grunge, hippie music, some hip-hop, punk and reggae.. It was a welcome change but it wasn't till 2000 that I began to wonder more about the music and it's roots.

To put it in perspective how clueles I was :-[, I went to go see PVD in '01 at the old Space and I heard someone mention that OG was spinning that night.. I had heard your name before but I didn't know what kind of talent you were and didn't know if you compared to PVD. So going back to your point, if it wasn't for me going to see PVD, I wouldn't have heard or known how good you were till later. It's funny living in Miami, you'd think I would have heard more of you before some German dj..

I still love dance music to this day, and now if it weren't for Radio one I wouldn't know what I know now about dance music. It's a lifelong journey for me, I'm a lifer. Also, as far as the worldwide scene, I recently realized that the scene in South America is huge and for techno too. It's not just in Berlin, Ibiza, or England.. As far as Saleen enjoying himself and making the best of a night.. From what I recall, he said the talent sucked at the locals party (Voodoo on December 1st) but I think he must have been at the wrong party because all the djs I saw that night kicked ass. :

[Guest myles hie]

Entertainment value, yeah. But definitely people should take a lot of what has been discussed here into consideration. The dance scene isn't dead, but it does need our help.

Not to play devil's advocate here, but I'd like to think Barbarino has the best interests of clubland at heart. I've seen him out before, and unlike a lot of people, he tends to make the best out of any situation and enjoy himself. "Shit Pod, this DJ is horrid, but the bitches are hot, let's get a beer..."

OK, I've got a question to pitch here. What would it take for everyone to lighten up and have fun? I'll be honest, I miss the days where this forum community would go out and have a good time. I'm talking like 2 years ago here. Nowadays it seems a lot of us are marred in (to bastardize a term) sectarian disputes, if you will.

Take a look at the older galleries for some pointers.

Edgar V @ Crobar.. nuff said.......

or the massive meetups at Nerve

you need to go back to warsaw, groovejet, la bain, parragon, even bash in the early 90's to see the scene we are referring too... ! (groovejet)

back when it was called "Euro House", eek!

[Guest pod]

As far as Saleen enjoying himself and making the best of a night.. From what I recall, he said the talent sucked at the locals party (Voodoo on December 1st) but I think he must have been at the wrong party because all the djs I saw that night kicked ass. :

That's a bit biased right there. I didn't go to this party as I had other obligations to attend to, but isn't it OK if these locals weren't Mr. Barbarino's kettle of fish? Two way street and all. Or does the fact that he's enemy number one on here make his opinion, which that's all it was, invalid? I understand if they're your friends, but even friends can have bad nights. I wasn't there so I can't say anything. But if I was, would I be attacked for saying someone had a bad night?

That's something I've noticed a lot of too. Being a "local" in the sense of not being signed to a major club, agency, or record label, automatically places you above and beyond reproach. You are the undiscovered golden gods of dance music. Grant it, there is unsigned DJ talent in this town that would do well to have a solid residency somewhere, but it's certainly not a universal condition. I've heard piss poor sets from globally recognized DJs, and piss poor sets from local, unsigned DJs.

But the minute you get signed to Space, Mansion, Twilo, Pawn Shop, etc, it's all over. Then it's time to attack.

Even these local DJs get tired of the universal adoration on the forums. They want to hear it like it is, so they can improve themselves as artists and progress.

[Guest redman]

Wow, too much reading to catch up : | >

[Guest pod]

It's worth it, there's some real gems in there.

[Guest vaughan]

OK... I WILL POST ONE MORE THING ABOUT ALL OF THIS....

The boy has everyone's panties in an uproar... JUSt to see themin an uproar...

HE HASN'T POSTED SINCE PAGE 2!!! ;D

[Guest ANARCHYP]

OK... I WILL POST ONE MORE THING ABOUT ALL OF THIS....

The boy has everyone's panties in an uproar... JUSt to see themin an uproar...

HE HASN'T POSTED SINCE PAGE 2!!! ;D

hehe...lol

[Bling]

i didnt realize he posted again after the original post.. mind u i wouldnt have even jumped into this thread but when i saw my name involved in saleen's original post. i just had to ;D

[Guest pod]

Well duh. Frankly, this thread has been the most entertaining and informative one I've read on here in weeks.

Posting events and reviews of events is one thing, but what I like to think separates us from the other forums of the internet clubbing universe is the fact that we have a coherent dialog between the people in positions to make things happen in the industry, and the clubgoers themselves.

Is it as bad as Mr. Barbarino makes it out to be? No. Is it as good as people like Bling, Major, Lyrik, etc, make it out to be? No. It's somewhere in the middle with a trend towards the worse right now.

However, by bringing these issues to light, even for entertainment purposes, hopefully people can see where things could go, and help take steps to fix them.

One of the reasons a lot of people don't like this guy is because he's telling them things they don't want to hear. Most people see a crowd, and assume all is well. They don't see the lack of intake at the bar, they don't see the fact that the promoters might be walking away with what little the club brings in, etc. You all know the problems by now, and you know the possible solutions. I know a lot of y'all have the attention span of an amoeba, but I hope you put down your crack pipes for a few minutes, because there's some real gems in here. Shit, I wish there was a "flag as classic" function for some posts.

[Bling]

we need to bump this thread a yr from now to see how miami has progressed or regressed.....

[Guest pod]

Here's a challenge, let's keep it alive the whole year. There's always something.

[Guest JustDade]

Well duh. Frankly, this thread has been the most entertaining and informative one I've read on here in weeks.

Posting events and reviews of events is one thing, but what I like to think separates us from the other forums of the internet clubbing universe is the fact that we have a coherent dialog between the people in positions to make things happen in the industry, and the clubgoers themselves.

Is it as bad as Mr. Barbarino makes it out to be? No. Is it as good as people like Bling, Major, Lyrik, etc, make it out to be? No. It's somewhere in the middle with a trend towards the worse right now.

However, by bringing these issues to light, even for entertainment purposes, hopefully people can see where things could go, and help take steps to fix them.

One of the reasons a lot of people don't like this guy is because he's telling them things they don't want to hear. Most people see a crowd, and assume all is well. They don't see the lack of intake at the bar, they don't see the fact that the promoters might be walking away with what little the club brings in, etc. You all know the problems by now, and you know the possible solutions. I know a lot of y'all have the attention span of an amoeba, but I hope you put down your crack pipes for a few minutes, because there's some real gems in here. Shit, I wish there was a "flag as classic" function for some posts.

You see it's all a matter of perspective. From where Saleen sits, (watching the Jets lose and getting fatter by the minute), it looks like the scene is dead. Oscar's point is very true...people grow out of clubbing. From Oscar's viewpoint, as a DJ with a steady gig in a great club, the scene looks very different. However, if Oscar's being honest he'll tell you that the Dance music business is not what it once was and certainly not what we thought it would be today. Maybe he's right and these are natural cycles. I don't know and I'm the oldest guy in this conversation.

[Guest pod]

It falls somewhere between what OG says and what Mr. Barbarino says.

We're not doing so hot, but we're not dead yet. 2007 is a telling year.

[Guest LiquidX]

George Acosta & EdgarV becoming Friday residents @ Spirits mean anything ? ???

[Guest pod]

It means someone is willing to take a chance on dance music still.

Go on and support.

Here, I'll make it easy for you:

Complimentary admission courtesy of this website. Click here.

[Guest swirlundergrounder]

All I have to say is whenever Oscar posts on here, he crushes people.. LOL

[Guest lyrik]

Is it as bad as Mr. Barbarino makes it out to be? No. Is it as good as people like Bling, Major, Lyrik, etc, make it out to be? No. It's somewhere in the middle with a trend towards the worse right now.

Hey you leave me out of this - you do know I only post on here to break the gaps when I am not drifting about in my desk chair staring into the texture on the ceiling panels.

Seriously...a lot of these clubland theorists that try to one up each other on a daily basis with their advanced clubbing knowledge and prowess need to realize there is no place like you have there...from the ocean...to food, clubs and people and everything in between...come on to take a cruise out is a drive away. One thing I tell people back there when speaking about Miami is that I miss the culture and diversity...that bold latin attitude and the outgoing nature of everyone. I can honestly say I haven't found a place like it and if it weren't for the simple economics of living there and trying to raise a family I'd still be there. To say that Miami has made an impression on me is to say the least...I may bullshit ya here and there...but in all honesty I can't complain for my time there and wouldn't trade it for anything. I made some of the best friends I could possibly ask for there and though I may not prefer some venues and music - the people never let me down.

[Guest DJ Box-of-Rocks]

i love lamp!

[Guest coach]

Oscar's point is very true...people grow out of clubbing.

Qualify that. *Some* people, you could probably even say *most* people, turn into stay-at-home couch potatos. Others continue to enjoy the nightlife.

I don't know and I'm the oldest guy in this conversation.

Are you sure about that?

[Guest swank]

Oscar's point is very true...people grow out of clubbing.

Qualify that. *Some* people, you could probably even say *most* people, turn into stay-at-home couch potatos. Others continue to enjoy the nightlife.

+1

I don't know and I'm the oldest guy in this conversation.

Are you sure about that?

I was thinking the same thing... :

[Guest Marina22]

As far as Saleen enjoying himself and making the best of a night.. From what I recall, he said the talent sucked at the locals party (Voodoo on December 1st) but I think he must have been at the wrong party because all the djs I saw that night kicked ass. :

That's a bit biased right there. I didn't go to this party as I had other obligations to attend to, but isn't it OK if these locals weren't Mr. Barbarino's kettle of fish? Two way street and all. Or does the fact that he's enemy number one on here make his opinion, which that's all it was, invalid? I understand if they're your friends, but even friends can have bad nights. I wasn't there so I can't say anything. But if I was, would I be attacked for saying someone had a bad night?

That's something I've noticed a lot of too. Being a "local" in the sense of not being signed to a major club, agency, or record label, automatically places you above and beyond reproach. You are the undiscovered golden gods of dance music. Grant it, there is unsigned DJ talent in this town that would do well to have a solid residency somewhere, but it's certainly not a universal condition. I've heard piss poor sets from globally recognized DJs, and piss poor sets from local, unsigned DJs.

But the minute you get signed to Space, Mansion, Twilo, Pawn Shop, etc, it's all over. Then it's time to attack.

Even these local DJs get tired of the universal adoration on the forums. They want to hear it like it is, so they can improve themselves as artists and progress.

Yes, you weren't there but according to Saleen (or anyone that barely saw him :-\) he wasn't even there that long. How do you critique a night if you are barely there to see 5 different djs.. Yes it was my b-day, so I was there to drink and be merry more than disect the track selection and mixing skills of each dj. However, I do have a decent ear and I saw three djs spin that night. Biased not in the least.. Even though I know two of the three djs that I saw spin that night I still don't even know them that well nor would I lie if I wasn't feeling them. I conversed with the cjers and my friends, we danced and people had fun. If I recall correctly, Saleen's comment was they played the same tired shit but the only same tired shit was his comment. :

[Guest DJ Box-of-Rocks]

im 25. wise old clubber i am!!!

[Guest]

im 25. wise old clubber i am!!!

so basically... when I started clubbing... you were 8 years old.