kramadas Posted December 12 Report Share Posted December 12 Articles linking the three...some interesting info, especially the 3rd article!http://www.ucan.org/law_policy/ener.../oilwaredit.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scratchapella Posted December 12 Report Share Posted December 12 the links not working yo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kramadas Posted December 12 Author Report Share Posted December 12 lets try this again...http://www.ucan.org/law_policy/energydocs/oilwaredit.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chynado11 Posted December 12 Report Share Posted December 12 interesting...what would u say about it ravercd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malanee Posted December 12 Report Share Posted December 12 I've long thought our dealings in that region were heavily colored by our energy needs. Very interesting articles! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vicman Posted December 12 Report Share Posted December 12 kinda reminds me of the case with chiquita banana's in the 1970's in Honduras where after the Honduran govmnt. expropriated chiquita's plants in the country and bought them off, the US govmnt. sponsered an insurgency in the country and eventually had the pres. deposed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadygroovedc Posted December 12 Report Share Posted December 12 Originally posted by vicman kinda reminds me of the case with chiquita banana's in the 1970's in Honduras where after the Honduran govmnt. expropriated chiquita's plants in the country and bought them off, the US govmnt. sponsered an insurgency in the country and eventually had the pres. deposed. Is that a real bit of history, or did you make that shit up? Cause either way, it's pretty fucking funny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kramadas Posted December 12 Author Report Share Posted December 12 I'm not gonna get pulled into political debates on a public msgboard again (:D - had enough of those on the NYC board) BUT I wouldn't rule out anything. Its always good to see all sides of an issue, and that article was written by (seemingly) experienced analysts. Plus, you have Bush's obsession with oil (eg, drilling in Alaska).The oil companies have too much say in the govt - they need to start putting more funding into alternative energy sources. Don't these ppl realize that natural gas is only going last so long before we run out?!??!This whole mess in the ME is about oil...thats the reason the US was so quick to react to Kuwait's invasion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vicman Posted December 12 Report Share Posted December 12 Originally posted by shadygroovedc Is that a real bit of history, or did you make that shit up? Cause either way, it's pretty fucking funny. nope, it's true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vicman Posted December 12 Report Share Posted December 12 Originally posted by raver_mania I'm not gonna get pulled into political debates on a public msgboard again (:D - had enough of those on the NYC board) BUT I wouldn't rule out anything. Its always good to see all sides of an issue, and that article was written by (seemingly) experienced analysts. Plus, you have Bush's obsession with oil (eg, drilling in Alaska).The oil companies have too much say in the govt - they need to start putting more funding into alternative energy sources. Don't these ppl realize that natural gas is only going last so long before we run out?!??!This whole mess in the ME is about oil...thats the reason the US was so quick to react to Kuwait's invasion. yeah, alot of times the public doesnt even know half of what is going on, and since what the they tellis us is half true, then you realize we know nothing... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgiddy Posted December 12 Report Share Posted December 12 Ok well that was a long article(s) and I have a lot to say but will try to make it short. First, the war going on right now has NOTHING to do with oil, Saddam or Saudi Arabia. It has to do with us getting our freedom back and not letting terrorists ruin our country and everything our founding fathers ahve fought so hard for, i.e constitution. Secondly I'm sure this was written by greenpeace. Oil is natural and we will not run out of it and prices are low, so the consumers(us) aren't going broke paying for it and the producers aren't getting as rich off of it. Obviously we consumer more now then ever, we live in a technologically advanced country where everyone drives a car. Yes we are making strides, electric cars, solar power, nuclear. But damn it give us some time, should we just wuot using oil all together. See how far that gets us. Finally, the oil producing countries rely more on us to buy the oil then we do, there is other oil underground, it's not only in Iraq and Saudi Arabia. Did I make any sense, kinda went in a circle? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadygroovedc Posted December 12 Report Share Posted December 12 Originally posted by raver_mania This whole mess in the ME is about oil...thats the reason the US was so quick to react to Kuwait's invasion. Oh, it's definitely all about oil. But everything's about money. That's the American Way! And I'm damn proud of it! Look back in history. Everything has been about money. Start with the beginning of this country - The Revolutionary War - the limeys wanted to tax the colonists. The colonists didn't want to pay.The Civil War - the south wanted to keep the slaves for lucrative tobacco fields. The War of 1812 - I have no fuckin' idea what this war was about. But it was probably about money.Star Wars - One of the biggest money making movies of all time.yada yada yada. I can't keep a train of thought to save my life today... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadygroovedc Posted December 12 Report Share Posted December 12 Originally posted by pgiddy Ok well that was a long article(s) and I have a lot to say but will try to make it short. First, the war going on right now has NOTHING to do with oil, Saddam or Saudi Arabia. It has to do with us getting our freedom back and not letting terrorists ruin our country and everything our founding fathers ahve fought so hard for, i.e constitution. Secondly I'm sure this was written by greenpeace. Oil is natural and we will not run out of it and prices are low, so the consumers(us) aren't going broke paying for it and the producers aren't getting as rich off of it. Obviously we consumer more now then ever, we live in a technologically advanced country where everyone drives a car. Yes we are making strides, electric cars, solar power, nuclear. But damn it give us some time, should we just wuot using oil all together. See how far that gets us. Finally, the oil producing countries rely more on us to buy the oil then we do, there is other oil underground, it's not only in Iraq and Saudi Arabia. Did I make any sense, kinda went in a circle? Yeah, but if you look back at the root cause (why the Terrorists hate us), it's oil. Our military is only in Saudi Arabia cause of the oil. I mean, otherwise, we wouldn't give a shit what happened to the Middle East, would we? Doubtful. Don't get me wrong, blowing the shit out of the terrorists is definitely a just cause for this war. But at the root of everything, if you trace everything back to the original cause, it's always money. On the other hand, it kind of has to be, cause money's what makes the world go around. Did I just butcher that cliche?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgiddy Posted December 12 Report Share Posted December 12 Originally posted by shadygroovedc Yeah, but if you look back at the root cause (why the Terrorists hate us), it's oil. Our military is only in Saudi Arabia cause of the oil. I mean, otherwise, we wouldn't give a shit what happened to the Middle East, would we? Doubtful. Don't get me wrong, blowing the shit out of the terrorists is definitely a just cause for this war. But at the root of everything, if you trace everything back to the original cause, it's always money. On the other hand, it kind of has to be, cause money's what makes the world go around. Did I just butcher that cliche?? Not necessarily, we have military ALL over the world. The cold war had nothing to do with money, oil, or bananas:laugh: . It had to do with power and democracy. But yes we are there mostly to protect our interests, but it's smart if we can get oil from them cheaper then we could in our own country, then why not use their supply and save ours in case we ever really need it. Without us buying it, we consumer and purchase by far, more then any other country/gov't, then they would be nothing. They rely on us, we are the only reason why they have any money at all. One thing about Bin Laden, is that he's smart and doesn't rely on one product, he has a big hand in the heroin trade, farming, oil, construction, etc.. Nevermind I can go on forever and it's too hard to argue on a messageboard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadygroovedc Posted December 12 Report Share Posted December 12 Originally posted by pgiddy Nevermind I can go on forever and it's too hard to argue on a messageboard. It's all good, cause I forgot what we were talking about anyways. And I'm too lazy to go back and re-read. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgiddy Posted December 12 Report Share Posted December 12 Originally posted by shadygroovedc It's all good, cause I forgot what we were talking about anyways. And I'm too lazy to go back and re-read. I couldn't agree more, I'd rather talk smut, make fun of vic and post pictures of vixen up, hold on let me see if I still have some. At least one's she won't throw a fit about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chynado11 Posted December 12 Report Share Posted December 12 im glad to see that we have some inteligientes personas in this piece about political issues ....and that we all arent about crass sexual comments...cd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadygroovedc Posted December 12 Report Share Posted December 12 Originally posted by chynado11 im glad to see that we have some inteligientes personas in this piece about political issues ....and that we all arent about crass sexual comments...cd For some reason, I get the feeling that comment was directed at me... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scratchapella Posted December 12 Report Share Posted December 12 awww, i really wanted in on this topic. . . whatever, i'll say something anyway. i agree w/pgiddy, for all intents and purposes, this 'war' is largely to save face and fight for an abstract idea, american greatness, whatnot. . .BUT no one can absolutely say that Americans or the American government aren't going to capitalize on this, an opportunity/excuse to keep US influence in central asia? that's one area of the world they lack major influence. . .and american investment in oil. up until now, chinese investors have been the one footing the pipeline bills and keeping tabs on all the fomer USSR republics through regional groups like the Shanghai cooperative. . .anyways, i'm starting to go off on a tangent. . my point about the chinese though, US presence is definitely perceived as some sort of encroaching threat with not so altrusitc intentions by other countries, not just enemies of the US. . .it's like. . .the icing on the cake the fat baby knows is already on the cake. (i knowiknow but i couldn't think of anything better. . .) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kramadas Posted December 12 Author Report Share Posted December 12 Originally posted by scratchapella awww, i really wanted in on this topic. . . whatever, i'll say something anyway. i agree w/pgiddy, for all intents and purposes, this 'war' is largely to save face and fight for an abstract idea, american greatness, whatnot. . .BUT no one can absolutely say that Americans or the American government aren't going to capitalize on this, an opportunity/excuse to keep US influence in central asia? that's one area of the world they lack major influence. . .and american investment in oil. up until now, chinese investors have been the one footing the pipeline bills and keeping tabs on all the fomer USSR republics through regional groups like the Shanghai cooperative. . .anyways, i'm starting to go off on a tangent. . my point about the chinese though, US presence is definitely perceived as some sort of encroaching threat with not so altrusitc intentions by other countries, not just enemies of the US. . .it's like. . .the icing on the cake the fat baby knows is already on the cake. (i knowiknow but i couldn't think of anything better. . .) Hell yeah, the US is gonna capitalize on this to maintain a presence in the ME. They had some sort of hold while controlling Saudi (so much for the US not supporting dictatorial regimes), but the threat of bin Laden was always a thorn in the govt's side. So, finally now, after a game of politics (did they REALLY think the Taliban would hand over bin Laden - it would be interesting to conjecture what would have happened if they had done that), they can restructure Afghanistan such that a US presence is seen more favorably. I don't think I explained that too well, but its too late in the day...need some sleep!BTW, the second article about oil prices and such is also very interesting! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgiddy Posted December 12 Report Share Posted December 12 Originally posted by raver_mania Hell yeah, the US is gonna capitalize on this to maintain a presence in the ME. They had some sort of hold while controlling Saudi (so much for the US not supporting dictatorial regimes), but the threat of bin Laden was always a thorn in the govt's side. So, finally now, after a game of politics (did they REALLY think the Taliban would hand over bin Laden - it would be interesting to conjecture what would have happened if they had done that), they can restructure Afghanistan such that a US presence is seen more favorably. I don't think I explained that too well, but its too late in the day...need some sleep!BTW, the second article about oil prices and such is also very interesting! It's basically your typical supply and demand curve. They can control it so easily, the less they produce the more a barrel costs, likewise if they produce a lot(over supply) then the price will go down. And basically they just play with us and make us go in and out of a recession single-handedly. I just wonder how many of these big players also make money on the US stock markets, buying and selling? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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