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djxeno

Report From GAZA...

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I]Courtesy of http://middleeastinfo.org

By Justin Huggler in Gaza

24 July 2002

We found them in the morgue, the victims of Israel's air strike on Gaza, tiny bodies lying on slabs that were too big for them. The Palestinians opened the refrigerators to show us the bodies. In refrigerator after refrigerator, there were the bodies of children.

They pulled back the covers over one to show the tiny head of a baby, eyes screwed up as if in sleep. Part of the back of its head was missing.

In the next refrigerator lay Mohammed al-Hwiti. They said he was four and a half years old. He too could have been asleep. He was still dressed in a bright blue top. "My friend" was written across it in English. In the refrigerator below they showed us his brother, Subhi. He was three and a half.

Nine children died when an Israeli missile smashed into the densely packed residential district at about midnight.

On the floor of the morgue, wrapped in a Palestinian flag, lay the target of the missile, Sheikh Salah Shehada. The morgue staff pulled back the flag. Inside were fragments of flesh. The body had been torn apart by the missile. In a second flag beside him lay a bundle of the body parts of his wife, Leileh, and their 14-year-old daughter.

Shehada was a man with the blood of children as young as these on his hands. He was the head of the military wing of Hamas, the militant group that has been behind more suicide attacks than any other, many of them against Israeli civilians.

Israel's Prime Minister, Ariel Sharon, described the air strike that killed him as "one of our biggest successes" because it "hit perhaps the most senior Hamas figure on the operational side". It was an unavoidable step to protect its citizens from suicide bombers, Israel said.

More than 140 people were wounded, and at least 14 died. All but Shehada and one other were civilians, we were told. "Are these terrorists?" one of the morgue staff asked angrily, pointing to the bodies of the children.

The White House, using unusually blunt language, said: "This heavy-handed action does not contribute to peace." Mary Robinson, the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights, said: "The reckless killing of civilians is absolutely prohibited, regardless of the military significance of the target being attacked." Britain also joined the condemnation, telling Israel's ambassador the strike was "unjustified and disproportionate".

Pushing our way out of the morgue to get back to clean air, we had to struggle through a crowd that was getting angrier by the minute. Thousands were congregating outside the morgue.

Hundreds of young men, their faces hidden under black hoods, fired guns in the air. "Are you prepared for revenge?" someone screamed through a loudspeaker. They roared back in answer and the air was thick with the sound of gunfire. They formed a funeral procession. Thousands kept coming in a great sea of people. They brought the bodies out, and a young man held the body of a baby aloft, swaddled in a Palestinian flag and keffiyeh head-dress.

We found the father of the two dead brothers in the refrigerators, Mahmoud al-Hwiti, in the hospital. His face was badly injured, he found it hard to speak. His brother, Mohammed, told his story. Not only were two of Mahmoud's sons killed, but his wife as well.

The two brothers, Mohammed and Mahmoud lived with their families in houses next door to each other. When we went to find the building, it was just a pile of rubble. The houses all around where the missile struck had been flattened, reduced to piles of dust and stones with metal rods twisting out of them at crazy angles.

Just before midnight on Monday this was a packed residential neighbourhood, full of people trying to sleep in the summer heat. Gaza City is teeming with Palestinians who have nowhere else to go. Residents said there were 20 people living in each house here.

The Israelis will say that Shehada deliberately targeted Israeli civilians, that their strike was directed against a militant with blood on his hands. But there was no way you could fire a missile into this warren of houses without inflicting terrible civilian casualties. They must have known that.

Across the walls of the half-ruined buildings next to those that were destroyed, someone had written in English: "This is the American weapon. This is the Israeli peace."

Mohammed said: "We had no idea we lived next to a guy from Hamas." It seems Shehada, who knew he was at the top of Israel's hit list, was living here in secret. None of his neighbours knew that in the house next door lived a man whose presence would bring death to them out of the sky. Residents said they had seen two Israeli F-16s circling earlier in the day, but that is not so rare an occurrence here, and nobody expected what happened next.

"At around midnight I was sleeping," said Mohammed. "I woke up to the noise of the bomb falling. Then I was scrabbling in the rubble for my three young children, and calling out to my older kids in the next room. My 16-year-old son said he was OK."

The deaths of civilians, so many of them children, has unleashed a terrible wave of anger here. Tens of thousands joined the funeral march through the streets, many of them firing guns as they went. The din was deafening. They draped the coffin of Shahadah under a green Hamas banner and paraded him slowly.

The strike came only hours after the spiritual leader of Hamas, Sheikh Ahmed Yassin, said the group was prepared to stop suicide attacks if Israel withdrew from the West Bank towns it had reoccupied, and the Israeli Foreign Minister, Shimon Peres, said Israel might be ready to pull out of two West Bank towns. Yesterday, all talk of moves towards peace was over. The talk was only of blood.

For more on News on the Palestinian/Israeli Conflict please visit:

http://www.palestinechronicle.com

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God this is depressing....

I went to a protest today regarding this attack in front of the State Department. There were not that many people, only around 50 or so, and tons of TV networks...the fat cats across the street of course didn't give a fuck...I understand that Israel needs to defend itself but this and other attacks in the past are really uncalled for.

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Yeah, and that shit didn't even make the news yesterday!! I was so mad. I understand that they have to go after Hamas leaders, but come on, firing a missle into a residential area is just asking for civilian casualties, and in my opinion, they did it on purpose. They wanted to kill him and his family. Bastards.

Thanks for going to the protest :rolleyes:

Peace,

-XeNo-

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This is just not right.

Maybe Israel felt they had to eliminate this "Sheikh" character.

But not at the cost of all the innocent civilians that had to go with him. If the Israelies had their own people in refrigerators with mangled heads and missing ligaments, maybe they'd speak up against their gov't 's staunch action as of late.

We're not going to get anywhere with Israels latest escalation. It;s only going to anger the Palestinians further and give them more reason for suicide bombings :(

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Just to provide a little balance.....

The killing on innocent civilians is never acceptable, and unfortunately always a by-product of armed conflict...

But there is a difference between targeting civilians for death, and accidentally killing civilians based on faulty intelligence.....like I said, neither is acceptable, but there is a difference with respects to intent....

I am not sure how I feel about this particular attack yet, but overall Israel has shown tremendous restraint and discretion, and skill, in minimizing the amount of civilian deaths in their military moves, while the same can not be said for their enemies....I am sure even Sassa may agree with this

One must also take into consideration that this particualar Hamas character, like all good terrorist leaders, use civilains and civilian cover as protection, making it near impossible to target them....

I wonder if the same Americans protesting the latest Israeli attack would feel the same if American warplanes slammed a missle into an apartment building in Pakistan that housed Bin Laden, causing civilian casualties......

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Originally posted by igloo

I am not sure how I feel about this particular attack yet, but overall Israel has shown tremendous restraint and discretion, and skill, in minimizing the amount of civilian deaths in their military moves, while the same can not be said for their enemies....I am sure even Sassa may agree with this

Never! The comment you just made proves that you have been brainwashed by the media. The Israeli Army kills innocent civilians everyday, but you will never hear about that because of the U.S. media being biased. They even have no respect for journalists, many who have been captured and detained for no reason, blindfolded and humiliated and even shot at. When they say "Hey we are journalists!" the army simply says you shouldn't be hear and if you get killed it is your fault. I strongly suggest you visit other sites besides CNN, MSNBC, etc..cuz you will not get the whole story of what happened. If you question where I get my news from, please visit http://www.middleeastinfo.org and http://palestinechronicle.com or http://ww.internationalanswer.org

Let me give you an example. I'm sure you have heard about the Jenin Massacre. Well, the U.N. themselves own that camp, and they were not allowed to carry out an investigation because the U.S. didn't want them to. Also, it was part of a bargin that if the U.N. agreed to scrap the whole thing, they would stop the siege at Arafat's compound. Now let me ask you something, if the Israeli's were not responsible for a massacre at the camp, then what do they have to hide, why can't they let the U.N. conduct their investigation.

Also you said that this Hamas character tryed to shield his crimes but hiding with civilians which may be true, but Israel didn't have to drop a fuckin ONE TON bomb into a densly crowded civilian neighborhood. If they really wanted to capture him without hurting civilians, why couldn't they use ground troop or tanks that they use to shoot kids throwing rocks at them.

Also, under a new law (I cant remember the exact resolution), the Israeli Army can arrest any Palestinian Male from the ages of 16-50 just because he is Palestinian, and under no suspicion of wrong doing. They are ALLOWED to purposely target civilians and fuck with them, torture them and humilate them however they please, LEGALLY IN ISRAEL.

WHAT A COUNTRY. A COUNTRY WITH NO BORDERS. A COUNTRY WITH NO MORALS. A COUNTRY WHICH COMMITS TERRORIST ACTS EVERYDAY WITHOUT ANYBODY HEARING ABOUT IT. WELCOME TO ISRAEL.

So before you say that Israel's Military conducts itself in a appropriate manner, please read news that is not biased.

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Originally posted by djxeno

Never! The comment you just made proves that you have been brainwashed by the media. The Israeli Army kills innocent civilians everyday, but you will never hear about that because of the U.S. media being biased. They even have no respect for journalists, many who have been captured and detained for no reason, blindfolded and humiliated and even shot at. When they say "Hey we are journalists!" the army simply says you shouldn't be hear and if you get killed it is your fault. I strongly suggest you visit other sites besides CNN, MSNBC, etc..cuz you will not get the whole story of what happened. If you question where I get my news from, please visit http://www.middleeastinfo.org and http://palestinechronicle.com or http://ww.internationalanswer.org

Let me give you an example. I'm sure you have heard about the Jenin Massacre. Well, the U.N. themselves own that camp, and they were not allowed to carry out an investigation because the U.S. didn't want them to. Also, it was part of a bargin that if the U.N. agreed to scrap the whole thing, they would stop the siege at Arafat's compound. Now let me ask you something, if the Israeli's were not responsible for a massacre at the camp, then what do they have to hide, why can't they let the U.N. conduct their investigation.

Also you said that this Hamas character tryed to shield his crimes but hiding with civilians which may be true, but Israel didn't have to drop a fuckin ONE TON bomb into a densly crowded civilian neighborhood. If they really wanted to capture him without hurting civilians, why couldn't they use ground troop or tanks that they use to shoot kids throwing rocks at them.

Also, under a new law (I cant remember the exact resolution), the Israeli Army can arrest any Palestinian Male from the ages of 16-50 just because he is Palestinian, and under no suspicion of wrong doing. They are ALLOWED to purposely target civilians and fuck with them, torture them and humilate them however they please, LEGALLY IN ISRAEL.

WHAT A COUNTRY. A COUNTRY WITH NO BORDERS. A COUNTRY WITH NO MORALS. A COUNTRY WHICH COMMITS TERRORIST ACTS EVERYDAY WITHOUT ANYBODY HEARING ABOUT IT. WELCOME TO ISRAEL.

So before you say that Israel's Military conducts itself in a appropriate manner, please read news that is not biased.

bravo. couldn't have said it better myself.

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Originally posted by djxeno

Never! The comment you just made proves that you have been brainwashed by the media. The Israeli Army kills innocent civilians everyday, but you will never hear about that because of the U.S. media being biased. They even have no respect for journalists, many who have been captured and detained for no reason, blindfolded and humiliated and even shot at. When they say "Hey we are journalists!" the army simply says you shouldn't be hear and if you get killed it is your fault. I strongly suggest you visit other sites besides CNN, MSNBC, etc..cuz you will not get the whole story of what happened. If you question where I get my news from, please visit http://www.middleeastinfo.org and http://palestinechronicle.com or http://ww.internationalanswer.org

Let me give you an example. I'm sure you have heard about the Jenin Massacre. Well, the U.N. themselves own that camp, and they were not allowed to carry out an investigation because the U.S. didn't want them to. Also, it was part of a bargin that if the U.N. agreed to scrap the whole thing, they would stop the siege at Arafat's compound. Now let me ask you something, if the Israeli's were not responsible for a massacre at the camp, then what do they have to hide, why can't they let the U.N. conduct their investigation.

Also you said that this Hamas character tryed to shield his crimes but hiding with civilians which may be true, but Israel didn't have to drop a fuckin ONE TON bomb into a densly crowded civilian neighborhood. If they really wanted to capture him without hurting civilians, why couldn't they use ground troop or tanks that they use to shoot kids throwing rocks at them.

Also, under a new law (I cant remember the exact resolution), the Israeli Army can arrest any Palestinian Male from the ages of 16-50 just because he is Palestinian, and under no suspicion of wrong doing. They are ALLOWED to purposely target civilians and fuck with them, torture them and humilate them however they please, LEGALLY IN ISRAEL.

WHAT A COUNTRY. A COUNTRY WITH NO BORDERS. A COUNTRY WITH NO MORALS. A COUNTRY WHICH COMMITS TERRORIST ACTS EVERYDAY WITHOUT ANYBODY HEARING ABOUT IT. WELCOME TO ISRAEL.

So before you say that Israel's Military conducts itself in a appropriate manner, please read news that is not biased.

Before I start, I need to refer back to my comments that you highlighted:

Originally posted by igloo:

"I am not sure how I feel about this particular attack yet, but overall ...."

Please take notice to the line where I said "I am not sure how I feel...yet, and the word "overall". Enuf said on that.

Secondly, just because someone does not agree with you does not mean they are brainwashed by the US media. That is an elist/leftist pile of bullshit. Believe it or not, there are different views than yours. And Holy Shit- there may even be a chance you are actually incorrect.

Thirdly, I was wondering Einstein how you can claim I only look at CNN or MSNBC, and I am brainwashed, yet you recommend www.middleeastinfo.org and palestinechronicle.com. Do you mean I can get fair and balanced reporting there?...There is no bias against Israel baked into their journalism?....That is amazing that a CNN viewer would be brainwashed, yet a reader of the palenstine chronicle could never be. Think about what you are saying moron.

With respects to the bomb being dropped on the building- didn;t I already make a statement on that, or is it too difficult for you to read.

Like I said, intent is the differentiator.

Lastly, just for the record, I have friends and co-workers from both regions, and do my fair share of reading on both sides, so please put your elitist attitude back up your ass.

You, and Sassa, really need to grow up.

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Originally posted by igloo

Before I start, I need to refer back to my comments that you highlighted:

Originally posted by igloo:

"I am not sure how I feel about this particular attack yet, but overall ...."

Please take notice to the line where I said "I am not sure how I feel...yet, and the word "overall". Enuf said on that.

Secondly, just because someone does not agree with you does not mean they are brainwashed by the US media. That is an elist/leftist pile of bullshit. Believe it or not, there are different views than yours. And Holy Shit- there may even be a chance you are actually incorrect.

Thirdly, I was wondering Einstein how you can claim I only look at CNN or MSNBC, and I am brainwashed, yet you recommend www.middleeastinfo.org and palestinechronicle.com. Do you mean I can get fair and balanced reporting there?...There is no bias against Israel baked into their journalism?....That is amazing that a CNN viewer would be brainwashed, yet a reader of the palenstine chronicle could never be. Think about what you are saying moron.

With respects to the bomb being dropped on the building- didn;t I already make a statement on that, or is it too difficult for you to read.

Like I said, intent is the differentiator.

Lastly, just for the record, I have friends and co-workers from both regions, and do my fair share of reading on both sides, so please put your elitist attitude back up your ass.

You, and Sassa, really need to grow up.

....and you need to stop making personal attacks. i am getting fed up of your bullshit. i'll be in nyc in a few weeks, meet me in person and i'll show you what a leftist radical nut i am. :rolleyes:

why can't you just take into consideration other people's views for one second? why can't you believe that someone MIGHT POSSIBLY have a side of a story that could be more plausible than what you're hearing? is that so hard? honestly? YOU, igloo, are the one who needs to grow up.

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You my friend, are the one who needs to grow up.

You can't even make a counter statment without attacking the person, as you have proved man times in your previous posts with tonythelover. As far as palestinechroncle being biased, take a look at the pictures yourself and see if pictures can be biased to you.

CNN itself is broadcasted by a Isreali Satellite company. After Tony Blair said that BOTH sides are engaging in terrorism, the company threated to pull the plug on CNN, which they did for about 15 minutes and CNN was off the air.

And if you don't like those websites visit International Answer like I said. And you did make a brainwashed comment, you stated that the Israel Army is very careful in thier handling of civilians. If you are not brainwashed, please do tell me where did you get this ideas stuck in your head and how you can feel that they are right.

And yes you are right, intent is the differentiator, and if it wasn't for thier intent to murder civilians, they wouldnt have a one ton bomb dropped in a residential area, they wouldnt have that resolution passed, and they wouldn't call every palestinian fighter who fights back a "terrorist."

So you say I could be wrong, and I could be. But if you had your family murdered, house blown up, and land taken away which was rightly yours I doubt you'd feel like you were wrong.

God is not a real estate agent. The whole idea that Israel, the land of milk and honey was promised to the Jews was not even written down until several hundreds of years later and its viewed by many as just tradition.

Peace,

-XeNo-

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Originally posted by djxeno

You my friend, are the one who needs to grow up.

So you say I could be wrong, and I could be. But if you had your family murdered, house blown up, and land taken away which was rightly yours I doubt you'd feel like you were wrong.

With your comment above- is it applicable to both sides?....you are right though- CNN has brainwashed me so bad with those fake suicide bombings, that my view is tainted....

Wake Up

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Originally posted by sassa

why can't you just take into consideration other people's views for one second? why can't you believe that someone MIGHT POSSIBLY have a side of a story that could be more plausible than what you're hearing? is that so hard? honestly? YOU, igloo, are the one who needs to grow up.

Didn't I just say the same thing...

You really need to start generating some original thought....then again, it must be difficult being such an imbecile....

When you wak up in the morning and look in the mirror- do you see the hurt in your eyes as you come to grips with how fucking stupid you really are?

Sassa- a symbol of hypocrisy, delusional self importance with an elitist complex that in actuality is closer to a pile of shit...

Fuck off and die loser

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It is nice to see more than the one sided news and opinion we usually see. We do not really ever get much of this kind of reporting from our local news. Most news stories about the damge the Israeli "army" (it is debatable how good they really are) does never makes it to us. I would love to hear more from the other side-- keep it comimg.

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Originally posted by djxeno

Igloo if you are for Israel please convince me why. Also what are you views towards Muslims and Islam.

Answer those questions if you have any heart.

Peace,

-XeNo-

If you are are trying to say I am completely anti-Palenstinian you are wrong...

If you are trying to say that I am anti-Islam or anti-Muslim you are wrong again...

The problem is you are too fucking stupid to understand my statements...

You and Sassa are always spending so much time "presenting" the other side in your quest to show you are an elitist, that you continually misrepresent the side you are challenging. If you want some respect, present balanced views baked in REALITY.

And like I said, if bullshit comes from CNN and CNBC, the same bullshit can be said for most Middle Eastern sources. I have a friend who is Iranian, and still has family there. He gets me some of the best reading I have ever read- but most of it is also bullshit.

Presenting views that are anti-majority, or anti-Israel, or anti-US simply for the sake of doing so does not make one intelligent, like your pal Sassa thinks. He makes you a fool. And just because someone leans towards the majority does not mean they are "brainwashed". That is leftist bullshit to falsely justify their baseless views.

For Sassa, she is just a hopeless piece of shit who should end her worthless life.

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Originally posted by igloo

Presenting views that are anti-majority, or anti-Israel, or anti-US simply for the sake of doing so does not make one intelligent, like your pal Sassa thinks. He makes you a fool. And just because someone leans towards the majority does not mean they are "brainwashed". That is leftist bullshit to falsely justify their baseless views.

Yeah, simply for the sake of it? I present these views because the U.S policy in the Milddle East is completely biased and unjust. You continue to say that you are not brainwashed however still you fail to answer my question as to why you think the Isreali Army is just in their ways. Maybe that's because you don't even have a clue as to why you say the things you do. Please if I am misrepresenting the other side, please tell me how I am doing so and please come at me with some hard facts other then continually bashing me and Sassa which makes you look like a pathetic child and a blithering idiot.

Peace,

-XeNo-

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Originally posted by djxeno

Yeah, simply for the sake of it? I present these views because the U.S policy in the Milddle East is completely biased and unjust. You continue to say that you are not brainwashed however still you fail to answer my question as to why you think the Isreali Army is just in their ways. Maybe that's because you don't even have a clue as to why you say the things you do. Please if I am misrepresenting the other side, please tell me how I am doing so and please come at me with some hard facts other then continually bashing me and Sassa which makes you look like a pathetic child and a blithering idiot.

Peace,

-XeNo-

I am standing here with my friend and co-worker who has served in the Israeli army and who's family still leave in Israel. He thanked me for the good laugh.

BTW - if you truly believe that the US policy in the Middle East is completely biased and unjust and the Israeli Army is unjust in their ways.....you truly are clueless.....seriously clueless...take a reality pill

If you can not see BOTH sides of this conflict, then you are a fool and an imbecile......and THE fucking child

Seriously, increase your education yourself then come back to me....

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Originally posted by djxeno

Once again you couldn't answer my question :laugh:

Dumb Fuck :eek:

LOL.

Peace,

-XeNo-

Quite frankly, you are the dumb fuck. Like you friend Sassa, you spew bullshit.

And you still just DON"T GET IT.

Open your eyes to YOUR statements.

Fucking child.

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Originally posted by sassa

don't bet on it, it's probably not going to happen any time soon.

igloo, tell you israeli friend: leh lehizdayen et etsmecha.

You should talk you fucking crusty whore.

You never say anthing intelligent, simply post your one-sided bullshit. BULLSHIT.

please, please kill yourself. You are and always will be a repulsive waste of space.

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Originally posted by igloo

You should talk you fucking crusty whore.

You never say anthing intelligent, simply post your one-sided bullshit. BULLSHIT.

please, please kill yourself. You are and always will be a repulsive waste of space.

:laugh2:

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The Israeli Army kills innocent civilians everyday, but you will never hear about that because of the U.S. media being biased. [/b

hmm i read the guardian, bbc, Lenta.ru, arabic news.com and a few other sources including debka.com, just to get a nice mix in there. US media is biased, its true, BUT so is the european and arab media. even more so towards the palestinians

regarding this strike. it was a tragedy, and israeli government issued many apologies to the victims, not that it matters anymore. the point is that israeli forces do their best to minimize civilian damage in strikes like these. they withheld attacking this hamas murderer for 8 times in fear of killing innocent bystanders. this strike was a strategic mistake based on faulty intelligence, dont make it seem more than what it really is. it should have never happpened, and its terrible that those kids were right in the middle of it. graphically describing the victims in order to villify israeilis is a low tactic, because just as much or worse can be wrtiiten about victims of palestinian suicide killers. there is no moral high ground with this issue

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Yes, Palestinian Suicide Bombers are terrorists, without a doubt and they shouldn't be hurting civilians. But really, do you think the IDF would actually drop a ONE TON bomb in a CIVILIAN neighborhood if they didn't want civilian casualties???

And what about the Jenin Refugee Camp? The Palestians shouldn't even be refugees because they were kicked out of their rightful homes...

Peace,

-XeNo-

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