Zionism And Its Impact

[kramadas]

an old article but informative...

-------------------

The birth of Israel

Israelis salute their new state

The former BBC Middle East correspondent, Tim Llewellyn, looks back at the history of Israel.

The contrast between the growing Jewish society in Palestine - the Yishuv - and the indigenous, mainly Muslim Arab population could not have been greater.

In 1917, two-thirds of the roughly 600,000 Arab population, were rural and village-based, with local, clannish loyalties and little connection with the towns. What passed for "national" Arab leadership was based in the towns, though there was little national identity. Two or three established, rival families dominated Palestinian politics.

Tilling the land

¿ Israeli Ministry of Foreign Affairs

The majority of the Jews arriving in Palestine were well organised, motivated and skilled. In the early 1920s, they set up an underground army, the Haganah, or Defence. A Jewish shadow government was set up, with departments which looked after every aspect of society: education, trades unions, farmers, the "kibbutzim" settlements that spread across Palestine, the law, and political parties.

the rest here:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/events/israel_at_50/history/78601.stm

[tribal]

Originally posted by raver_mania

Let me throw that back at you - how many of those Arab nations claim to be democracies?

ahhhh i see now. so if Israel were to say that its not a democracy, that it is an autocracy, you would stop blaming everything on the Israelis

really. so for you, instead of critisizing the gross human rights abuses by Syria, Hezbolla and Egyptian secret police, for you, it makes more sense to bash Israel because they are a democracy, but not the kind of democracy that you would prefer.

you're full of shit. youve never been to Israel, yet you claim to know how people live there and who deserves what. newsflash douchebag, knowing the situation on the ground does not rest solely on pseudo-propaganda 'news' outlets like Guardian and BBC. Travel the region and see the situation from both sides. Nothing is ever black or white.

[pattbateman]

hahahaha Orange County California

like the tv show the OC

and simons you let your politics get in the way of your history studies

you seem to know history but you also conveniently leave things out in order to make your political views stronger

you know it, i know it, and the american people know it!

[kramadas]

Originally posted by tribal

Travel the region and see the situation from both sides. Nothing is ever black or white.

You haven't answered my question - how many times have you travelled to the OT (to see "the situation on the ground" and "both sides of the story" so to speak)?

How many Israelis are conveniently shielded from whats happening in the OT? Guess its taking its toll on the IDF - more and more of them are speaking out against the "immoral" actions going on in the OT.

[babbo]

Originally posted by raver_mania

You haven't answered my question - how many times have you travelled to the OT (to see "the situation on the ground" and "both sides of the story" so to speak)?

How many Israelis are conveniently shielded from whats happening in the OT? Guess its taking its toll on the IDF - more and more of them are speaking out against the "immoral" actions going on in the OT.

taking it toll- lmfao- a few out of 1000's are unhappy about it- picture that happening in a muslim county- dissatisfaction- met with the firing squad- lmfao

[marksimons]

heheh, so what am I leaving out of history?

my view is that a lot has been left out of american history textbooks and tv shows...

politics in the way of history?

hmm, nah, I try to keep politics out of it, but the problem is, what if politics and history overlap?

political situations today have their roots in history...

not my fault, that companies the president and vice president have close ties to, it's not my fault they've been involved in so many wars around the world.

[igloo]

Originally posted by marksimons

heheh, so what am I leaving out of history?

my view is that a lot has been left out of american history textbooks and tv shows...

a lot was left out of your brain too douche bag

[babbo]

Originally posted by igloo

a lot was left out of your brain too douche bag

after all the discussion-zionism exists to preserve the jewish people-where the rest of the world has tried to destroy judaism for 1000's of years- end of conversation!!

[marksimons]

well have you ever seen a tv show looking at the role of corporations in wars around the world since the early 20th century? then look at who these companies are supporting now, who runs them and what countries they run?

[igloo]

Originally posted by marksimons

well have you ever seen a tv show looking at the role of corporations in wars around the world since the early 20th century? then look at who these companies are supporting now, who runs them and what countries they run?

:peeright:marksimons

[marksimons]

I'm trying to remember the last time you actually put up an argument igloo (not necessarily a good argument, but any argument)...

I'm beggining to think you've got nothing but insults to contribute...

if my take on history is so wrong, why get angry, just kindly point out the factual errors, and the errors I've made in drawing conclusion from what I know of events.

[igloo]

Originally posted by marksimons

I'm trying to remember the last time you actually put up an argument igloo (not necessarily a good argument, but any argument)...

I'm beggining to think you've got nothing but insults to contribute...

if my take on history is so wrong, why get angry, just kindly point out the factual errors, and the errors I've made in drawing conclusion from what I know of events.

:peeright:marksimons

[pattbateman]

lol

dude every text we have here in the states is written and choosen by liberal techers and profesors.

it is absolutely insane how bias these teachers and books are

[marksimons]

every text book.

show me an example of the liberally biased books you've been forced to read.

please do.

can you tell me what books you feel are biased, and which books would you reccomend to me instead?

some names and authors so I can read them for myself and see this 'unbiased' view of history.

and liberal?

what do you mean by that.

when we come down to economics bush is Liberal in the classical economics sense of the word...

do you mean socially liberal? economically? or politically?

I'm pretty sure american books are biased economically towards liberalism and free trade, but the others? I don't know, but I'm sure you'll enlighten me bateman and igloo.

what books about the second world war should I read?

what books about the cold war should I read, what books about vietnam?

what books have you read on the history of europe from the late ninteenth century to the end of the fifties?

I'm sure we can compare which authors we like and don't like guys...

[pattbateman]

im talking about text books mandated by schools

i do not remember the names of the texts and i dont have them (i return them for the little money i get from them)

[pattbateman]

this is what you requested

http://hnn.us/articles/1247.html

[pattbateman]

that site is EXACTLY WHAT I AM TALKING ABOUT

[pattbateman]

read up asshole

[marksimons]

"The panel wound down with a debate over which lefist icon Gandhi most resembled: Che Guevara? Marx? Nelson Mandela? Susan Sarandon? (OK, I'm kidding about the last one.) Wishing to put a bit of stick about, I finally spoke up, addressing a serious (but admittedly provocative) question to Professor Spodek: "isn't it possible to see anti-Soviet activists such as Lech Walesa and Vaclav Havel in a Gandhian vein, too?" No sooner had the words left my mouth than a grad student (easily identifiable by his glaring sartorial ignorance, manifested by a fetching socks-and-Birkenstocks motif) butted in with "Well, they became millionaires and Gandhi didn't, HAR HAR HAR!" Leaving aside the rudeness of butting (and I mean that literally) in, what was the relevance of such a remark--even if true? The point, I have little doubt, was simply to belittle my contention and to keep Gandhi purely as the property of the Left--or at least the left attending that panel."

heheh poor conservative historian man don't get the joke.

this site seems a rather right wing biased site, very venomous writings about the 'left' and stuff.

I dunno.

i'm still yet to be convinced that american kids are being brainwashed evil liberal ideas.

I'm more worried about history books that don't teach kids the truth.

so far you've not offered much to convince me that, in your own words "every text we have here in the states is written and choosen by liberal techers and profesors."

so far I see no evidence of that.

they don't like marx do they...

"I observed that Marx?s ideology was the ideology Lenin embraced and Stalin employed to carry out their ghastly crimes. In response, Professor Dubofsky argued that Marx should not be blamed for the sins of Lenin, Stalin, and Mao. ?Should the parent,? he asked, ?be condemned for the sins of his figurative children?? Dubofsky says no; I say yes. Marx was no democrat. He was not interested in pluralism, tolerance, diversity, or freedom. He dreamed and fought for the day when one group of people would be violently eliminated by another group of people. He advocated the abolishment of private property and the establishment of a dictatorship. He argued that the slow and often difficult process of democratic reform was a sham."

heheh I believe marx could often be right:

"He argued that the slow and often difficult process of democratic reform was a sham"

no shit.

there seem some very paranoid people writing articles that are very overtly biased.

this quote made me chuckle

"I have to agree. This article is too typical of the type of hysterical, hyperbolic, intellectually sloppy rightist diatribe that HNN has been foisting on us lately. Herodotus is of the opinion that HNN is nothing more than some weird graduate student project and we are essentially the rats in the HNN maze. Instead of trying to goad and poke us into reacting by sticking us with this type of garbage, I hope HNN could actually make a serious effort to find articles by intelligent, rational conservatives. Such people do exist."

- that was a comment about the last article I quoted... ahahaahhahahhah

[bigpoppanils]

Originally posted by babbo

after all the discussion-zionism exists to preserve the jewish people-where the rest of the world has tried to destroy judaism for 1000's of years- end of conversation!!

actually one of the reasons why the Christian Right has joined the Zionist movement is that some beleive that restoring Jews to Israel will help bring about the Apocalypse.

that doesnt seem very noble to me.

[pattbateman]

and its not conservative bias that things happen and are not reported in text books????

there was 30 examples on that page here is one for younger children

The State Board of Education recently made a brave decision, rejecting two proposed environmental textbooks that were not only factually erroneous but also blatantly biased. The publisher of one of the rejected books has since agreed to remove the bias and correct the errors.

I testified at that hearing and, in the process, pointed out several factual errors to the board in response to direct questioning.

In one case, the error was so obvious that its presence at that late stage of the book's editing was surprising. On one page of an environmental textbook, students were told that water vapor was the most important greenhouse gas. On the facing page, students were told that carbon dioxide was the most important greenhouse gas. This error was all the more stunning because it was about global warming, which many environmental activists, including many who testified at the hearing, view as the largest environmental problem of our time.

But factual errors were really the least of the problems these proposed school books had. By far, the biggest problem was bias, both subtle and blatant. With little exception, the texts reflected a politicized view of environmental science and policy that presents every environmental problem by worst-case scenarios; that assigns blame exclusively to industry, capitalism and Western values; and that proposes command-and-control regulations as the best solution, preferably at federal or international levels.

Related Links

Q&A About Forests and Global Climate Change

Weighing the Words: Getting the Bias Out of Environmental Communications

National Academy of Sciences Raises More Climate Questions

Exploring the Science of Climate Change

Consider this little gem, from one of the rejected texts: "Some scholars believe that the spread of democracy, which put land ownership and wealth in the hands of many, and the industrial revolution, which made mass production of goods possible and spread wealth throughout society, are at the root of the environmental crisis."

Shame on us for spreading democracy!

Or this one, also from a rejected text: "Human attitudes and beliefs are also responsible for many unsustainable practices. Denial, apathy, inability to respond to subtle threats, greed, acquisitiveness and other factors influence our economic systems, laws and way of life in profound ways. In short, they worsen our biological imperialist tendencies."

I'll bet you didn't even know you had biological imperialist tendencies.

Those favoring such biased views on the nature of environmental problems wanted to hide behind the language of the Texas education code, which seems to limit grounds for textbook rejection to "factual error" for all science-related texts. But one of the first people to testify read a letter from state Rep. Charlie Howard, who explained that the Legislature did not intend the Texas education code to be construed as narrowly as some school board members were insisting.

Supporters of the biased texts tried to discredit the school board decision and portray it as a partisan, fundamentalist religious coup d'etat. Indeed, after the vote was taken, the first comment heard was from a school board member who loudly observed that the vote was "party-line." That is a keen insight from a person who somehow saw neither bias in the proposed books nor any factual errors.

There is no question that we face environmental challenges and that our children are going to face even more. It's important that our kids receive a thorough and extensive education about these problems and the many problem-solving approaches available to them. But giving our children a heavily slanted view of environmental issues - slanted in any direction - will only poison the virtuous pursuit of safety, health and environmental quality.

If we choose to use environmental education as a vehicle to promote political agendas of whatever stripe, we will ill-prepare our children for overcoming the challenges they face.

[marksimons]

heheh...

man...

on that page I saw some very hateful, and biased articles, and not much in the way of facts and figures.

that one you just posted does appear to have some factual errors and a bit of random political bias.

would hardly say it's shoving liberal ideas down kiddies throats though...

where is the liberal bias in the big stuff, the major history of america and the world.

the liberal american blaming WWII textbooks, the textbooks that say america was wrong in vietnam and was guilty of crimes against humanity.

where are the books that show how america armed and supported saddam in the 1980s...

well...? where are they? have you been forced to read any like that?

[babbo]

Originally posted by bigpoppanils

actually one of the reasons why the Christian Right has joined the Zionist movement is that some beleive that restoring Jews to Israel will help bring about the Apocalypse.

that doesnt seem very noble to me.

they await christs return to the land of israel-and Jesus returns as a jew- talk about creating confusion lmfao