Is a weekly minimal night viable in Miami?

[Guest pod]

True enough. Even people I know are really about the music at least have to take care of their operating expenses at the end of the evening. Whether it be out of pocket or from the money that came in that evening.

[Guest DJ Nova]

needing money and Hoarding it all in is not the same thing; people here are being taken to the cleaners ......these crazy expensive cover charges, and for what ? To see an OVERPAYED dj ?

no thanks !

every one needs money to live, but what this town does with money is much more than that my friend. They are making themselves rich at every club goers expense , AND they treat you like shit in the process..... Who wants to go out and experience this ? and why ?

You can come see world reknowned talent for $10 on friday night, INSTEAD most people will go see danny tenaglia (who is also world reknowned) the difference is DANNY plays here a several times a year..... and this is Rolando's 1st Ever Appearance outside of the wmc in like 10 years . Plus you won't be waiting outside for an eternity and Drink are cheaper.......

so tell me what is wrong with this picture ?

It's because, marketing (yes I know) whoever sells it the hardest wins.......and you have to have money to do that.....

[Guest DJ Nova]

True enough. Even people I know are really about the music at least have to take care of their operating expenses at the end of the evening. Whether it be out of pocket or from the money that came in that evening.

it's more costly to book Tiesto, than any other DJ, and other DJS would have just as big a draw (for example at mansion).......so people need to re-visit their operating expenses

[Guest pod]

Also it is what people are specifically out for. Some people like what Danny does, others like what Rolando throws down.

What if someone doesn't like Rolando? Does that mean they are to be vilified? Conversely, what if someone isn't a Danny fan? They shouldn't be vilified either. Just because Mr. Rolando hasn't show up outside of conference in a decade isn't enough of a reason to go see him. The marketing for him needs to emphasize other things, as well as the marketing for the night itself.

Clubowners aren't the proverbial fat cats usually. Yes, the successful ones live well, but still, I'm sure you are fully aware of the overhead for a large venue. $20,000 per night to open the doors if you're lucky. And that's before DJ fees if there's a big guest DJ.

Also, factor this in for the large venues. There's 200 people working there, many whom depend on the venue for a significant chunk of their paychecks. I'm sure they'll be thrilled to learn their paycheck bounced because the owner decided to be "experimental" and start booking DJs that made the crowd run away.

[Guest coach]

needing money and Hoarding it all in is not the same thing; people here are being taken to the cleaners ......these crazy expensive cover charges, and for what ? To see an OVERPAYED dj ?

You can come see world reknowned talent for $10 on friday night, INSTEAD most people will go see danny tenaglia (who is also world reknowned) the difference is DANNY plays here a several times a year..... and this is Rolando's 1st Ever Appearance outside of the wmc in like 10 years .

These 2 comments seem to contradict each other in a number of ways. First, if clubs are fleecing people, how can you see a world-reknowned DJ for $10? Second, if people have the choice of $10 for one DJ or big$ for another and they choose the big$, how are they being taken advantage of. I mean, if there is some sort of collusion to make sure that people have NO choice, that is one thing, but if they actually have a choice, then it is their own business how they spend their money.

Note that I in no way condone taking advantage of people, I'm just not sure where you are coming from.

[Guest DJ Nova]

Also it is what people are specifically out for. Some people like what Danny does, others like what Rolando throws down.

What if someone doesn't like Rolando? Does that mean they are to be vilified? Conversely, what if someone isn't a Danny fan? They shouldn't be vilified either. Just because Mr. Rolando hasn't show up outside of conference in a decade isn't enough of a reason to go see him. The marketing for him needs to emphasize other things, as well as the marketing for the night itself.

Clubowners aren't the proverbial fat cats usually. Yes, the successful ones live well, but still, I'm sure you are fully aware of the overhead for a large venue. $20,000 per night to open the doors if you're lucky. And that's before DJ fees if there's a big guest DJ.

Also, factor this in for the large venues. There's 200 people working there, many whom depend on the venue for a significant chunk of their paychecks. I'm sure they'll be thrilled to learn their paycheck bounced because the owner decided to be "experimental" and start booking DJs that made the crowd run away.

How can someone dislike something they've never heard ?

the marketing shouldn't have to empahsize anything except REAL accomplishments....

and if checks bounce from club owners it's because they're driving that new BENZ, not because they've tried to be "EXPERIMENTAL" Because they HAVEN'T ......when has any venue tried to bring someone down that was different ? NEVER! it's never happened , and when it did happen(The Edge) people did not run away ....actually people used to FLOCK to that place.....or didn't you hear about the edge ?

[Guest DJ Nova]

needing money and Hoarding it all in is not the same thing; people here are being taken to the cleaners ......these crazy expensive cover charges, and for what ? To see an OVERPAYED dj ?

You can come see world reknowned talent for $10 on friday night, INSTEAD most people will go see danny tenaglia (who is also world reknowned) the difference is DANNY plays here a several times a year..... and this is Rolando's 1st Ever Appearance outside of the wmc in like 10 years .

These 2 comments seem to contradict each other in a number of ways. First, if clubs are fleecing people, how can you see a world-reknowned DJ for $10? Second, if people have the choice of $10 for one DJ or big$ for another and they choose the big$, how are they being taken advantage of. I mean, if there is some sort of collusion to make sure that people have NO choice, that is one thing, but if they actually have a choice, then it is their own business how they spend their money.

Note that I in no way condone taking advantage of people, I'm just not sure where you are coming from.

you can see a world re-knowed dj for $10 because, pornograph is just trying to it accesible to everyone (alot of people haven't heard of Rolando but that is what makes it an interesting show), and break even .

People are being taken advantage of because of the way they are treated, who wants to wait out front all night ? and then pay $20-30-40 to get in, then drinks are an arm and a leg,

that's if you get in....because god forbid you might be wearing sneakers ....so you can dance. Most people out here don't know there are choices.....I mean you should be able to trust the clubs with names to offer quality environment, without having to pay for a table , VIP this or that. To me a club is to go hear music, and you would expect that clubs would specialize in music....being that is there business and they seriously lack. Look what just happened at Space with Roger S. they kept promoting it , telling people he would be there....fully knowing he waould NOT be.

[Guest pod]

I've heard about the Edge. I got here in '97 so I missed out. However, I do know personally the prime movers behind those events. I lived with one for a year and a half as a matter of fact.

Back then, the scene as it were wasn't big business. DJ fees were reasonable, and overheads were low.

Not every venue owner is a Benz-driving fat cat. I've seen plenty of guys struggle and go without just so their staffers can get paid.

One of the assumptions you're making is that the market here knows DJs. Sorry, they don't. If you're gonna book a DJ, you cannot have him or her be the sole reason for people showing up, unless it's PvD, Roger, Tijs, etc.

Also, it isn't that they dislike something they've never heard, it is just that they want to spend their hard-earned money on something enjoyable. People don't have a lot of disposable income these days, they want to spend it on the "sure thing", rather than a "maybe".

[Guest coach]

needing money and Hoarding it all in is not the same thing; people here are being taken to the cleaners ......these crazy expensive cover charges, and for what ? To see an OVERPAYED dj ?

You can come see world reknowned talent for $10 on friday night, INSTEAD most people will go see danny tenaglia (who is also world reknowned) the difference is DANNY plays here a several times a year..... and this is Rolando's 1st Ever Appearance outside of the wmc in like 10 years .

These 2 comments seem to contradict each other in a number of ways. First, if clubs are fleecing people, how can you see a world-reknowned DJ for $10? Second, if people have the choice of $10 for one DJ or big$ for another and they choose the big$, how are they being taken advantage of. I mean, if there is some sort of collusion to make sure that people have NO choice, that is one thing, but if they actually have a choice, then it is their own business how they spend their money.

Note that I in no way condone taking advantage of people, I'm just not sure where you are coming from.

you can see a world re-knowed dj for $10 because, pornograph is just trying to it accesible to everyone (alot of people haven't heard of Rolando but that is what makes it an interesting show), and break even .

People are being taken advantage of because of the way they are treated, who wants to wait out front all night ? and then pay $20-30-40 to get in, then drinks are an arm and a leg,

That's my point. If they *can* pay the $10, but aren't, why not?

[Guest Philip]

not to jump on your case to much, but...

needing money and Hoarding it all in is not the same thing; people here are being taken to the cleaners ......these crazy expensive cover charges, and for what ? To see an OVERPAYED dj ?

no thanks !

ok but your opinion is in a serious minority as compared with thousands of Miami clubbers every weekend.

every one needs money to live, but what this town does with money is much more than that my friend. They are making themselves rich at every club goers expense , AND they treat you like shit in the process..... Who wants to go out and experience this ? and why ?

thousands of Miami clubbers? because they like it and feel its worth it?

You can come see world reknowned talent for $10 on friday night, INSTEAD most people will go see danny tenaglia (who is also world reknowned) the difference is DANNY plays here a several times a year..... and this is Rolando's 1st Ever Appearance outside of the wmc in like 10 years . Plus you won't be waiting outside for an eternity and Drink are cheaper.......

so tell me what is wrong with this picture ?

nothing...? maybe i wanna see Tenaglia ina world-class club where i know what to expect and im guaranteed a good time.

It's because, marketing (yes I know) whoever sells it the hardest wins.......and you have to have money to do that.....

marketing? marketing only goes so far. people have actually heard or heard of Tenaglia

[Guest ANARCHYP]

and how do you think he got to that point....people did not just wake up one morning and say oooo..we know him thats danny t...marketing

[Guest pod]

Another issue I'm seeing here is that a lot of the "music" (sorry but I don't know what else to call them) crew see conspiracies around every corner against the type of sound and party they are going to and wanting to purvey. Nice attitude, you're defeating yourself from the get-go. Space, Mansion and so forth are the big boogeymen in town, essentially The Man, and are keeping the little guy down.

Clubs aren't out there to actively crush these little parties? Do you guys honestly think LP, the Milons, etc, are out to stomp out the little guy? Hardly. LP's thoughts are on tuning the sound system this week, and the Milons are thinking about changing the carpet upstairs at Mansion.

Most of these guys, or their duly appointed representatives, will listen to a well-thought out plan for a night or DJ booking. You can't go over their swinging a pair of brass ones and telling them what they are doing wrong. No one wants to hear that, and they'll kick your ass accordingly for being arrogant.

Draft up a viable plan for the evening, schedule an appointment, and most of all, be professional and courteous. A long time ago, we (as in CJ) were the little guys on the street. Some careful planning and sorting things out, and we managed to convince a megaclub (Space) to let us put some DJs no one ever heard of on the decks.

[Guest Philip]

who wants to wait out front all night ? and then pay $20-30-40 to get in, then drinks are an arm and a leg,

that's if you get in....because god forbid you might be wearing sneakers

im up for it. i wonder how many thousands of others will be as well these next couple weekends...

[Guest DJ Nova]

not to jump on your case to much, but...

needing money and Hoarding it all in is not the same thing; people here are being taken to the cleaners ......these crazy expensive cover charges, and for what ? To see an OVERPAYED dj ?

no thanks !

ok but your opinion is in a serious minority as compared with thousands of Miami clubbers every weekend.

that's because they don't know any better, it's like cuba. If you ask cubans in cuba, they'll tell you they love it (sure alot have left) but there is still quite a large population there I assure you.

They will tell you they love it, they don't go without food, education, medicare etc...but we obviously know here that it sucks for them there and they have very little compared to us here in the states. The people here have not been exposed because people in control do not know enough about music and miami.

every one needs money to live, but what this town does with money is much more than that my friend. They are making themselves rich at every club goers expense , AND they treat you like shit in the process..... Who wants to go out and experience this ? and why ?

thousands of Miami clubbers? because they like it and feel its worth it?

see above (it's all they've ever known) since electronic music really blew up in the late 90's here

You can come see world reknowned talent for $10 on friday night, INSTEAD most people will go see danny tenaglia (who is also world reknowned) the difference is DANNY plays here a several times a year..... and this is Rolando's 1st Ever Appearance outside of the wmc in like 10 years . Plus you won't be waiting outside for an eternity and Drink are cheaper.......

so tell me what is wrong with this picture ?

nothing...? maybe i wanna see Tenaglia ina world-class club where i know what to expect and im guaranteed a good time.

and that is all you will get a "good time", what I am proposing is an amazing night, much more than just a good time guaranteed!

It's because, marketing (yes I know) whoever sells it the hardest wins.......and you have to have money to do that.....

marketing? marketing only goes so far. people have actually heard or heard of Tenaglia

well actually at some point, no one had heard of danny tenaglia or anybody for that matter.........you didn't know who sander klienberg was 15 years ago !

[Guest ANARCHYP]

you guys had a concept...names had nothing to do with it...and you guys also have the reacH(which i am sure is a little bit more extensive than the regular joe shmo)

[Guest Philip]

and how do you think he got to that point....people did not just wake up one morning and say oooo..we know him thats danny t...marketing

uh, no. Danny didn't get where he is today because of marketing. maybe with the help of marketing. christ...

[Guest ANARCHYP]

not to jump on your case to much, but...

needing money and Hoarding it all in is not the same thing; people here are being taken to the cleaners ......these crazy expensive cover charges, and for what ? To see an OVERPAYED dj ?

no thanks !

ok but your opinion is in a serious minority as compared with thousands of Miami clubbers every weekend.

that's because they don't know any better, it's like cuba. If you ask cubans in cuba, they'll tell you they love it (sure alot have left) but there is still quite a large population there I assure you.

They will tell you they love it, they don't go without food, education, medicare etc...but we obviously know here that it sucks for them there and they have very little compared to us here in the states. The people here have not been exposed because people in control do not know enough about music and miami.

every one needs money to live, but what this town does with money is much more than that my friend. They are making themselves rich at every club goers expense , AND they treat you like shit in the process..... Who wants to go out and experience this ? and why ?

thousands of Miami clubbers? because they like it and feel its worth it?

see above (it's all they've ever known) since electronic music really blew up in the late 90's here

You can come see world reknowned talent for $10 on friday night, INSTEAD most people will go see danny tenaglia (who is also world reknowned) the difference is DANNY plays here a several times a year..... and this is Rolando's 1st Ever Appearance outside of the wmc in like 10 years . Plus you won't be waiting outside for an eternity and Drink are cheaper.......

so tell me what is wrong with this picture ?

nothing...? maybe i wanna see Tenaglia ina world-class club where i know what to expect and im guaranteed a good time.

and that is all you will get a "good time", what I am proposing is an amazing night, much more than just a good time guaranteed!

It's because, marketing (yes I know) whoever sells it the hardest wins.......and you have to have money to do that.....

marketing? marketing only goes so far. people have actually heard or heard of Tenaglia

well actually at some point, no one had heard of danny tenaglia or anybody for that matter.........you didn't know who sander klienberg was 15 years ago !

exactly

[Guest ANARCHYP]

and how do you think he got to that point....people did not just wake up one morning and say oooo..we know him thats danny t...marketing

uh, no. Danny didn't get where he is today because of marketing. maybe with the help of marketing. christ...

its cuse he is so talented...right?

[Guest pod]

Danny certainly is where he is because of marketing. Be Yourself, etc, that's all marketing! Even the viral word of mouth stuff counts as marketing. He's one of the most talented DJ/Producers on the planet, but if he or someone didn't realize that and run with it marketing-wise, he'd be balancing the books at Initech and DJing at house parties.

[Guest coach]

I mean, it's great if someone just wants to DJ for fun/the art/hobby. Nothing wrong with that at all. But if you want to create a career out of it and find an audience for your "sound", then you have to build that on money. No other way.

[Guest ANARCHYP]

Danny certainly is where he is because of marketing. Be Yourself, etc, that's all marketing! Even the viral word of mouth stuff counts as marketing. He's one of the most talented DJ/Producers on the planet, but if he or someone didn't realize that and run with it marketing-wise, he'd be balancing the books at Initech and DJing at house parties.

my point exactly

[Guest DJ Nova]

Danny certainly is where he is because of marketing. Be Yourself, etc, that's all marketing! Even the viral word of mouth stuff counts as marketing. He's one of the most talented DJ/Producers on the planet, but if he or someone didn't realize that and run with it marketing-wise, he'd be balancing the books at Initech and DJing at house parties.

since when did clubs down here start bookings on talent and marketing ?

because if that's the case, I can name quite a few talented , well marketed artists/ djs that have NEVER played here.

[Guest ANARCHYP]

Danny certainly is where he is because of marketing. Be Yourself, etc, that's all marketing! Even the viral word of mouth stuff counts as marketing. He's one of the most talented DJ/Producers on the planet, but if he or someone didn't realize that and run with it marketing-wise, he'd be balancing the books at Initech and DJing at house parties.

since when did clubs down here start bookings on talent and marketing ?

because if that's the case, I can name quite a few talented , well marketed artists/ djs that have NEVER played here.

you missed the point

[Guest coach]

By the way, did I mention that I think a minimal night *IS* viable in Miami?

[Guest pod]

That's where a lot of people are blinded too.

A lot of the people trying to do parties nowadays are doing it "on the side", from their day jobs doing real estate or what-have-you. They're not living on the funds from the party, so it is easy for them to do whatever, and not worry about the ins and outs of really promoting, DJing, or party planning. Ask anyone who promotes, DJs or owns a club as their only source of income. In the end, there's compromises being made.