alivak

I must take offense to one thing stated early in this thread, that Raver Mania said Arafat was once a terrorist like Ariel Sharon was. That is the most outrageous thing you can say. Sharon never ordered the murders of Olympic athletes, he never ordered the assassination of a US diplomat in Jordon, Sharon never paid an Israeli or anyone else for that matter to walk into a hotel lobby during a religious holiday and blow it up. Sharon was a soldier and defense minister before becoming Prime Minister, not some renegade who supports killing innocent women and childen on school buses, hotels, restaurants, etc. You do not have to like sharon or his politics, but do not compare him to a terrorist, who still is a terrorist and who still supports terror. Just ask Abu Mazan (sic) I am impressed with the level of discourse on this thread, it seems that once trouble makers were weeded out, you can actually have normal conversation

UN doesnt give 2 shits about people under dictatorship. They just put Libya and Syria on the human rights commissions. You honestly think that the UN with France and Russia having billions of dollars in Iraq were going to agree to liberate the people there? Hussein was visited by Chirac months before the war. If you want a war crimes tribunal - just look who sits at the UN. How ironic that 9/11 terrorists destroyed the Towers, too bad they didnt take out the UN instead. But then they would have wiped out the only people who support them. I live three blocks from the building and see these diplos everyday being as cocky as ever, living here for free and then walking into that building and trashing us and yet support every terrorist regime in the world. Most expensive waste of real estate in the world

actually Sudan offered him to the US in 1996 and Willy turned it down for God knows what reason, and then he bombs a pharmacutical factory IN SUDAN two years later..

was he orthodox? because they are impossible to deal with. they dont believe in an Israeli state, refuse to serve in the military when its their asses that are being defended. Very difficult people

war on drugs was always a joke. they should just police it without the billions spent on advertising it. We will do whatever we want anyway. Hey Normalnoises, still waiting to hear from you...you wanted to see me..we'll let go then..your big mouth finally caught up to you or what?

This was actually a really good article. Shows dems learned nothing in three years. Say what you want about Dubya, the guy knows politics..gave these 9 guys the whole summer and they beat on him every single day...and yet the best they can do in the polls is pull within 5 to 10 points. Bad news for them, now he's back and ready to play ball. Dean and company will never have a three month period to themselves like they just did. Fyi - in 1984 - Mondale was ahead of Reagan before the election...1996 - Dole was ahead of Clinton the year before. Both won pretty big. Comparatively speaking, Bush is in real good shape.

Raver, I understand your point and they did destroy the building because it was clearly a terrorist hang out. You're telling me if Bin Ladin was hiding in a builing the US wouldnt destroy it? Israel didnt want to kill civilians so they used a lighter bomb, i dont recall a suicide bomber using less potent bombs just so he can kill the men and not women and childen on the buses. In fact those bombs have nails, shrapnel, etc. to make it even more worse. Cease fire? it was a one way cease fire, the funniest statement came from Hamas after they murdered 25 people including children and Israel retaliated by killing Hamas leaders that they no longer abide by the cease fire. Its not a truce when one side blows up buses. BTW, there is a huge difference between target killing of terrorits leaders and blowing up innocent civilians on purpose. PLO's biggest mistake was going after civilians, if they had continued to attack the soldiers no one would have been able to say anything because then they could have claimed it was a guerrila war, etc. As soon as bus stops and supermarkets were bombed, changed the whole political spectrum.

problem is that if everything is done on the downlow..the media and conspiracy theorists (if that is a word) would be jumping down Bush's throat. There is nothing right now that he can do to please anyone. It will happen in a year or two, maybe longer when we see Iraq and the outcome of the war in full. He may not even be in office when the finality of it occurs. This is time period of day to day reconstruction and rebuilding that we as a country do not have the patience for (think of it as a sports team rebuilding, and the fans are impatient). Unfortunately, we do lose soldiers during the process as well...but how many lives we save in the long run.

thanks for the info...says a lot about the posts then.

If you are talking about the attack on Yassin, the leader of Hamas, then the attack was done with civilians in mind. They dropped a 550 pound bomb on the on an apartment building that didnt destroy the entire structure. They wanted to use a heavier bomb but didnt because they feared the building would collapse and kill civilians. Ended up being that Yassin, who is a terrorist, got out with slight injuries and no one was killed. It's very easy to blame Israel for everything, actually it's the norm, but you can't in this case. I am not sure if this is the strike you are referring to, but this was the last one i heard of.

But at the same time, we cannot leave. I know that opens the argument of we should never have gone in the first place. However, that being said and done already, what's the alternative. We have to see this through.

Oh did someone get under your skin...tree fucker? you talk smack, but then you cant handle it? You talk more trash then anyone here, i didnt even start this, and now you want me to say to you in person. GLADLY. I would love too say this to your face (better yet repeat some of the shit you've said asshole)...its children like you who hide behind screen names and can say the most ridiculous things without having to answer for it. Come on little boy, anytime anyplace. I live and work in the city - tell me where and when.

Anger management issue...talk about tolerance. Thanks for clearing up what sarcasm means - kind of got lost in the paragraph between cunt and duckfuck. Talk to me when your'e vocabulary goes beyond elementary school level. Better yet, just shut the fuck up...you're looking a bitter child who got beat way to much. You really thing i care what you think? you think i care about being taken seriously here, after reading the bullshit you post. HAHA...get off your high horse tree fucking fag. You're a child you couldnt hold my spit let alone my dick, i post here to kill time and see how stupid this thread can get...not to be taken seriously by children like you.

Unlike liberal ass pussies like yourself who constantly give us this bullshit about tolerance (and you are so open to other views), at least conservatives dont play that bullshit hypocritical game. Next time come up with something original to say. Need anymore quotes? Dude, you're like a 6th grade punk i bitch slapped 20 years ago. Last time i got into a fight with someone about my mama i must have been in the 6th grade - and you question my intelligence? What are u 9 years old? grow the fuck up, pretend to be intelligent, fake it at least. Fucking dead people? HELLO? what the hell is wrong with you. Do you realize how stupid you sound. All that nonsense takes away from anything have decent you have to say. My rants? have you noticed your posts? talk about anger management issues. I guess now that Sassa;s gone you need to fill the void. I await holding my breath the words of wisdom that you will grace up me.

who is aflak - isnt that an insurance company with that duck in their commercials? And how do u see indirectly through someone's words? Is that some kind of esp - and u never answered me, how was that night with my mother? jerkoff. Funny thing about liberals - claim to be tolerant of all views and people. Looking at your rants, the only thing you are tolerant is of those people who agree with you, otherwise everyone else is an asshole or moron or whatever other adjective you can come up with in your 4th grade class. Doesnt that contradict everything you tree huggin assholes stand for? Oh and BTW - we are using Iraq's oil to rebuild their own country. Its something you will never accept so just shut the fuck up and move on. If we wanted their oil we would have taken it in 1991.

i made a mistake, i was referring to 70% as a personal tax in Germany on the wealthest individuals..mainly to fund the health care system. Look in today's papers (NY papers, not sure where u are) and they write about the failing german economy and that is why they are holding out for a bigger piece of the pie in Iraq - regarding the new UN resolution. They need to jump start their economy. In Canada the taxation level is somewhere around 55% on individuals and they have the same double taxation laws on corporations that we have except at a higher rate. Again, a big part of this is because their dollar is so weak that it is really cheap for companies to invest there, lets see what happens when the dollar increases and the tax burden remains high.

Canada's economy is doing well comapered to what? maybe better then it used to be, but it is far from doing well. Just look at the Canadian dollar and how weak it is. Only recently have companies started investing in the country and going into major cities like Toronto. Lets see what happens when their dollar gets a little stronger and those companies are stuck paying 50% taxes and they dont get as much for the buck. You cannot have a thriving economy in a global recession where you tax corporations and individuals to the point of 50-70%

you cant take one idea and say something is great. Its like saying the facism is great because there is no crime, great law and order in that society. You have to take everything into account. Health care comes at an extreme cost and keeps the rest of the economy down in socialist countries. Why do u think taxes kill the Canadians and Germans just as an example (up to 70% tax rates)...to cover health care, its equivalent to purchasing your own health care here in the states. Not to diminish the situation here, that is this countries greatest challange, but socialism is not the answer.

Dennis Prager is conservative radio talk show guy. He used to have a TV show as well. Compared to all the talk show people, he is not as bad as the extremes that make all the noise on both sides. Raver - I agree with you in what bothers me most about the right (and i consider myself to be rightie) is that in the end it all comes down to religion. A perfectly good argument such as his about socialism and the faults he has with it, which many of us on the right do have...does not need to be turned into Judeo-Christian discussion on right and wrong. I believe socialism does not work because of the philosophy behind, not because it's a religious issue. It is the religious non-sense that gives the left the opportunity to yell and scream about how everyone on the right is a religious nut...which is far from the truth. If conservative writers stuck to theory and philosophy instead of throwing religion in everyones face, the left would have less to yell about. Denmark was # 1 place to live; Oslo Norway was the most expensive city in the world.

a) difficult for u to win a night bed with my mom since she has not been around for about 10 years now - let me know how that works out for you. where in my statement did i admit anything of what you said. I stated that you won dick. We went to war, and all you can do is talk about oil. Get over it. c) you have no idea what my views are since i never really talk about them with idiots like you who only scream and dont actually look at the anything other then the bullshit that you believe in. But please, I am curious to know about my admittal, show it to me. Where in my one well structered sentence did i agree that we went to war for oil?

meant to write what..not who

what did u win, ur angry and pissed off at the world? We still faught the war, doing what you didnt want us to do...so who did u win?

This looks like a John Dean thread

maybe its the enviroment that does not allow normal conversation then, because i am open minded about a lot things, i went through my close minded stage in college. U''re right I dont know u but i see what goes on here. I will stick to topic as u like to say, i am bored as hell at work, and i like to talk politics, i am little junkie when i comes to that. But u must realize, passion is one thing, antagonism and condescension is another. So i make peace with u, whoever it is that u are.

Where in my post did u see anything about the soviet union? again, u have reading problem, and u call me ignorant. If u dont like me responding to your posts, why are u responding to mine and everyone elses. Do you think people here care what u think? from the looks of things, i would say no.. but you keep on posting. Dont give me shit for responding to yours then. I dont see everything as heaven here, lots of problems, but its not "scary", and the good far out weigh the bad. I apologize for only listing 250 million as opposed to 275 people. . I can now see why u are so hated on every thread, not just here. You make it very difficult to discuss anything with you. If u dont like what i have to say, dont answer it. Simple...no? The sad thing is, i actually was intrigued by your posts before i started answering them because you are passionate and have interesting things to say...but it is impossible to have any prolonged conversation because you antagonize.