truelove vs. freelove

[wisdom]

this is a question thats been on my mind alot recently

I've been all about freelove for years...not that I've been taggin everything that comes my way...I try to be as selective as possible...just that my intentions were to have some fun and share a few experances and then go our seperate ways and then meet somebody else and so on and so on

(little note here...I'm not a player...as far as I know just about everybody I've been with still loves me and visiversa{yo...if I can't spell good at least I can take solance in the fact that I'm good in bed})

which has been working out pretty well

but for some reason...maybe I'm gettin older...maybe I'm finally growin up(no thats not it)...well I don't know why but for what ever reason I'm starting to want something a little deeper then my usaul short term relationship...which so far I haven't found although I'm opening up on new levels emotionally...so far mostly what I've felt is pain though since I'm fallin in love with one of my good friends...and its starting to get really complcated...since I'd hate to lose her a friend( I don't have that many friends) and she's going out with another one of my friends(not a good friend...more like and aquaitance...come to think of it we tagged alot of the same girls in the past) I really do love this girl though

in the end I'm going to have to confess...if it works out then great...ill get to experance something new and I figure the stronger emotions will only lead to even better lovemaking

and if not well...ill be devistated and be in all kinds of pain

and that'll be good too cause at least ill be feelin something and that'll only inspire me to new hieghts

and then ill go back to my old routine(come to think of it...I'm still in my old routine...since I was callin some other girl earler today...hey if she can have a boyfriend....)till I heal and find someone else I feel this deeply for...then go though the whole thing again...and again....till I find it or give up

or maybe I should give up now...pain might be good for insperation(see above)...but its also interfearing with my normal mellow mindset...anybody got any ideas...helpa brother out

(wow you read all that? I'm impressed)

[dgmodel]

bottom line in my opinion... is very simple... i have experienced true love and i have experienced a great deal of free love... and from my experience, ive come to the realisation that nothing tops love... love conquers all... love eclipses every and all feelings that i have ever experienced... over the course of the last two years, i have regressed a great deal from who i was back then... i used to be a serious, relationship oriented individual, and i was genuine, sincere, and thoughtful towards my girl... however after we broke up... (a year later that is, i actually waited for this girl, and didnt sleep around or talk to other girls or anything) i went on a sex crazed sleeping around binge... and here i am now... trying to go back to being that guy i was before... because quite frankly all this is fine and dandy... however its pointless and meaningless... and as of about a month ago, i swore off casual sex and meaningless flings... and i started a quest to find ms.right... or at least ms. right for me... so all in all what is this rant leading towards??? im saying, close your eyes, follow your heart, and see what happends... worst case scenario you go back to being a hot monkey fuckin' stud...

[djmoonshine]

i feel like i haven't experienced either.

i was in love once, a long time ago... doubt it was true love.. i was young... (not like im old now) but i've matured and see things differently and he def. was NOT my true love...

bah.

[atomicapples]

Originally posted by djmoonshine

i feel like i haven't experienced either.

i was in love once, a long time ago... doubt it was true love.. i was young... (not like im old now) but i've matured and see things differently and he def. was NOT my true love...

bah.

cuz im your true love.

[georgym]

True love, because for me it's for the long-term investment

[tastey]

i too was at this point some time ago and this helped me a lot, written by svengali (no, not dgmodel ) in responce to a "player" on another board. it basically is the best of both worlds, real love and free love, *THIS* is the TRUE player way.

this text however presupposes you are ALREADY good with women and know how to *work* them, so wisdom, you´re probably gonna be able to integrate that into your game pretty quick (i don´t know in what extend it will work for others). i was able to do so and since then i really feel i´ve changed from the dark side to the much better and more fulfilling bright side.

it is a fuckin long read, but i advise you to read it again and again. if you want some further convo on the topic, drop me a pm me dude

here we go:

Here's something that you can try immediately. and see an immediate

difference.

Keep in mind this does NOT preclude letting go of and not using any of the

knowing and skills you have, just a twist in the way you use them.

Go to where you usually go to meet women, only this time just go with the

attitude that you're going to meet and talk with whatever woman, and women,

that for whatever reason, turns you on from an interesting point of view. In

other words, forget about facial and body beauty for a moment, forget about

years, and just zero in on that woman, later other woman, later other woman,

who appeals to you for god-knows-chat reason. It could be something she's

doing, something she's wearing, something about her that for whatever reason

has you wondering what she is like. ,Now before you or anyone gets into it,

I'm not saying chow down on a dog, although a 5-10 minute courtesy with them

will, somewhere down the line, bring you more great women then you can

imagine. But that's another story. Having said thus, if she's physically a

turn-off to you, you won't notice that "interestingness" about her anyway. S

o it really doesn't matter.}

When you meet her, talk with her about the special something that said to

you, "that's interesting/she's interesting in some special way that I can't

put my finger on, I think I'll find out more about it and her".

If you are Sincere/genuine, about this, a certain magic occurs Where she

pours her heart and soul out to you (you'll still need to use your knowings

and skills for awhile), and you'll quickly see, in her eyes. that she is

falling in love and lust with you at such an accelerated rate, it will knock

your socks off:

Don't burst her bubble, but don't lead her on either. Just go with the flow.

Having said this, there's something else that you must do

--screen her! That's right screen her. By that I mean you shift the tables

and screen her for the qualities that you are looking for in a woman, and

whatever kind of relationship you want with this particular woman, and/or

women in general.

:fin interesting thing happens when you do this... women sense and know what

you're doing (screening than as a potential partner) and they become all

flustered because they want to say the right things, to have you, but they

don't know what those things arc. So they try and find out more about you to

(a) say the right things, and ( to take back that power and start

screening you. {Here's where your knowing and skills come in to keep her

talking about herself: and to keep her talking about what you want to know

about her.;

The really neat thing about this is that you are no longer seen as a

"player" or "dog" by the outside world, but rather --do I dare say it?-- a

genuinely nice guy who just likes to get to know people. (Do it with

guys --you know what I mean-- too. Thus way they'll become your allies,

rather then your competitors or enemies.) In no time at all your whole

reputation will change, and people will be coming or; to you constantly to

share something with you.

To do this, you MUST give up on the idea of scoring with every wornan. and

more importantly, with every woman you know you could "do". Ire otherwords,

you must now become selective about who you want to lie with sexually and

physically, and why you want to be with them

So let's say that you like to play tennis and you saw, this plain woman who,

for whatever reason (non verbally) said to you "nearly even woman in here is

better looking then she is. Yet there's something about her... ", and you

meet her. And you discover what it was (god, it's exciting to me to even

think about it). In the course of learning about it, and her, you learn that

she plays tennis a lot, and from your knowing, skills and kino application,

you fulfill her knight/adventure fantasy and do her someplace other then

your or her apartment. This locks in your being a really great and exciting

guy, who is genuinely interested in her. With the sex out of the way, you

now Want To see her because she also plays a lot of tennis, like you do, and

believe me, there's nothing like playing tennis with a woman in a tennis

skirt with no panties or underwear. So you're going to want to call her the

next time you want to play tennis (knowing, that With the tennis they is sex

too), and she is going to want to be with you because she is not thinking

that you're only calling her to get in her pants (you've already done that),

but to talk to and be with her. 'It's an extremely

subtle yet Very profound shift that takes place when done this way,}

Aright, now let's say that you met an interesting woman and in screening her

for personality traits similar to your own, you discover --in ten to twenty

minutes-- that her personality leaves much to be desired. Fine. Thank her

for the conversation and leave. Repeat with

the next "something-about-her" woman that you see:.

And here is where you're reputation changes from being a "player" or "dog"

to the outside world, to that of just being a nice, friendly. curious guy

who gets along w ith everyone, if you take the time to do this with some

guys too.

However, you will destroy your new great reputation if you go around,

bragging that you bagged this woman or that, or if you start talking

negatively about her or him. {Blow your steam, or bragging

off -anonymously-- in this group or similar location.)

This is a very subtle change "NYC" because, like I said, it does Not mean

giving up the communication skills you have learned and use. Nor does it

mean giving up kino, or any of the other knowledge you have and things you

do. Rather it's the way and how you now apply them that changes .

If you try this for a month or two you will quickly discover that you no

longer go out to meet women because you are talking to and meeting

fascinating women everywhere. Plus your always going to and doing what you

love, with really great women, who you are having sex with too.

Additionally, you are never trying to get them to do anything, but rather

you're just fulfilling their fantasies and desire::.

See what you haven't learned vet (this is NOT a put-Down, and it's Solely

based on your postings) is that after you're with a woman for awhile, she

starts telling you all kinds of things that she. would like to do that she's

dreamed about. So you, being the good/great guy that you are, take the nude

pictures of her. Do the porn movie she would like to do. Go to the swinging

events she would like to experience Have sex in the park, on the airplane,

in the pool, etc.

What's happening with you, based on your posts, is that you're. quickly

screening all the women for that one woman who will have no-strings-attached

sex with you right now. And word is getting around, and I would dare say,

some women are putting up amazing blocks just to show; say to others, "see

if couldn't do it/I wouldn't let him do it with me". But, by you're not

gearing everything toward the one night stand, and by YOU saying "no" to

women you KNOW you could have that night, you change the dynamics of

everything as its seen that you're just being friendly, and screening for

potential partners too. .

Remember when you posted on more then one occasion about chicks being

competitive? When it's heard/seen that you're a friendly great guy. who also

Appears To Be screening for a potential partner too (you never admit or deny

that you are), what do you think happens'?

Page 4 of 7

You got it! Only now, they are competing for your Long Term affections and

company, which means they have to do things over, and over, and over again,

rather then once you've been used to.

You've heard me say here, that I don't do "wingmen" along with my stating

why. I'm going to use that concept and what I just presented to you to

explain what would happen if I met you in NY, and we both we're using the

"Svengali" (for lack of a better term) way.

First, you would see me coming off the plane, talking with someone, bidding

them farewell in the way I have determined. Then as we're going through the

airport, you or I would see some woman and we would go meet her because

there's something about her... let's say it was you who spotted and wanted

to meet some intriguing woman. I would just smile, listen and be fascinated

by what she would say as you were communicating with her. My only comments

would be those that I felt you didn't pick up on, to further lead her into

conversation. This would take 10-20 minutes, and in that time you would know

where you wanted to go with her, and what you wanted to do next. Because

we'd both be skilled at this technique, I would see what is happening, and

if need be, because that would be appropriate, go to the hotel without you

where you would meet me later. If, however, she didn't have the qualities

you were looking for, we would go through the airport, perhaps repeating

this process several times. We would do the same when we got to the hotel,

and the restaurant, and wherever else we decided to go. Somewhere along the

line you and I would be having sex with a woman within a couple-three hours

of meeting her, and so our desire for sex would be lacking for awhile. That

means that one or both of us would NOT be gearing our vocal and physical

actions toward having sex with any woman we found fascinating at the moment,

but rather, we would either get her number, or as I usually do, just pass on

the opportunity to be with her sometime.

Now let's say that you and I decided to play tennis the next day,, and you

had someone you play tennis and have sex with, and wanted to do doubles. My

screening process, with the fascinating woman I found then, would be, does

she like to play tennis and is she any good at it' Once I found that, we

would have a doubles game, and if you were into it, a "foursome" too. And

that's the way our whole time would go. So we would be doing what we want to

do, and we would each be doing what we want to do, with who we want to do it

with, too.

That brings up the type of relationship question: how long, what type, etc.

Here's how I do it: I learn how many things she likes/loves to do that I do

too. I also learn her Natural personality traits that comes from her

actions, not just her words. So let's say that she likes to fly, skydive;

play racquetball, tennis and volleyball, in addition to baking on the spot

sex every time we get together. fm going to lie with this kind of woman a

lot, because I like to do those things a lot. But if she only likes to do

one of them, then I'm not going to be with her very often, and just maintain

the relationship with an occasional five-ten minute phone conversation now,

and then

If she changes where she suddenly does like all that affection (kino ) I

like to provide and receive, the relationship on my part is going to change

too. In other words, she may find herself replaced with a woman who is like

her in the activities department, but now better then her (from the

standpoint of what fir. looking for) M' the. Personality" department.

Let's take the next most important item --sex. As you have seen me post, in

my opinion, there is absolutely no reason for me to be with

Any woman, beyond a few minutes, who I'm not Also having sex with.

After all, if all I'm wanting is to play basketball, I can do that with

my guy friends, right? So during or after the activity(s) we both

like/loves I'm into sex with her. But if she is not into having sex

with me, I merely end our time together, in a nice way, and don't call

or see her anymore. Nine times out of ten the inevitable phone call of

why have I stopped calling her comes, and I explain to her just what l

said here. Those that get pissed about it get a "have a good life"

from me, and those that understand and accept it, are seen by me again

No pressure, just a simple laying-my-cards-on-the-table with her, procedure.

Do some complain? You bet. But it's there choice as I'm

not forcing anyone to do anything. If they don't like it, go meet and be

with another guy, right`? Any woman that doesn't like this is

saying that she wants things her own way, and is that the kind of woman you

want to be with --one you're already in conflict with`?

As a result of meeting this and that fascinating woman, I'm n meeting women

of all generations who like to do one, two, three, four or more

of the things that I like to do, and has the personality traits I'm wanting

her to have too. So let's say that I have a woman whose only

compatible activity with me is skydiving, who I see when I want to do

that in addition to having sex. However let's say that I meet a woman who

loves skydiving and racquetball. Now I have someone that I cast be

with for more then one activity reason, in addition to sex. That means

I will let go of --via fewer and fewer phone calls and meetings over

time -- the one activity woman, and replace her with the two activities

woman. And two's get replaced 3, three's and the three's by

four, well you get the idea.

However, you mileage may vary. So you have to decide what is it you would

like and want, and then arrange things to fit your desires.

Now here's something that I doubt you or anyone would ever hear me say...

I'm in love with these women. Not all of them, but a great many of them.

See, I like being in love. This does NOT mean, however, that feel I have to

make a monogamist commitment to any of them. In face, as often comes up,

when they push for it, and nearly all of them do after a few years, I have

to let them go so They can have what They want with Another. Does this make

me vulnerable? You bet. Does thus bring me pain? You bet. But if I didn't

allow for vulnerability and pain, there would be no openness and love coming

from any of the women. and that would be the worst possible thing.

When a woman leaves me for lack of permanent long term monogamous

commitment, the very first thing she screens for is a guy looking for one.

And with so many guys wanting and looking for that from moment one, fm

actually doing slot of guys a BIG. Big Big favour by being the way I am.)

This brings up something else you must know and deal with: your own

temperament. You canNOT have this kind of arrangement if you're into total

control, rather then flow. what I mean by this is, if you're wanting to know

what they do, who they're with, and all that other stuff when they're not

with you, and attempt to control their away-from-you actions, you've doomed

yourself:

My attitude is this: I don't care if she's fucking and sucking off every guy

on the NY Jets when she's not with me, or if she dresses like a nun, or damn

near anything else. I screen, watch for and stay away from alcoholics,

druggies, criminal and Uncompassionate behaviour. All I'm interested in is

"does she want to be with. me when I call", and "does she provide me with

what I want when she is with me"? Having my tells me that when a woman is

with me, she Really Wants to be with me, to do what I want to do, more so

then being with, or doing anything and everything else that she could be

doing. That makes me special and feeling really good, proud, and confident

from the get-go.

BTW, you have to have a little give and take in thus relationship set-up

because not every woman is going to be able to do what you want to do. When

you want to be doing it. But what do you care --you have other women you can

call on. And if by some duster none of them wanted to be with you at that

particular time (never had it happen to me), what do you care as you still

leave the skills to meet and leave" anyone you wait.

Naturally, you cannot do this if you're living with someone which is

why I advocate NOT cohabiting with anyone. This doesn't mean that

you shouldn't or can't have overnight or long term --which to me, is a

maximum of one week--guests. It simply means that you lose all your freedom

and the ability to have what you want, when you want it. When you have a

live-in. I cannot emphasize this strongly enough...DON'T DO IT!

Better that you park your ass over her place for awhile (which means you're

free to get up and leave anytime you want), then for her to part:

her ass over yours.

I've gone on too long, so let me bring, this to a conclusion I've done it

your find-'em-feel-'em-fuck-'em-one-night-stand way for a few years, and

that, I've discovered, is far too much work and only leads to burn-out. The

way I do it now is far more comfortable, easy, pleasure filled and fun..

You're starting to get up there in years, "NYC". So if you want the best of

both worlds --married and single--without being either. and if you want to

continue on with this game well into your thirties. forties, fifties and

beyond, then you need to do it in a relaxed.

comfortable, easy-going, fun filled, loving way. Try it for awhile... you

won't want to go back to your previous way .

I remind you of the often maligned bull story: papa Bull and baby bull are

up on top a hill eating grass, when the baby bull turns around and sees a

herd of cows down in valley below. So baby bull in his excitement says to

papa bull, "papa' There's a herd of cows down there in the valley below.

Let's run down the hill and fuck some, like we were meant to do". To which

the papa bull replied "son, I've got better idea. Why don't you and I just

walk down the hill, and and then we won't frighten the herd away, and then

we'll have

the energy to fuck all of them".

My best to you and everyone.

Should you need any more details, or anything else you feel I might be able

to help you with, Please do not hesitate to ask.

Take care.

--

If life's a bitch...

fuck her!

'oo'

Svengali

[dgmodel]