Should the US military be allowed to target mosques?

[jamiroguy1]

Mosques will be targeted: commander

SENIOR US army officer said today that Iraqi mosques will be targeted by his troops if they are used as fire bases or weapons storage depots.

Brigadier General Mark Kimmitt, speaking to CNN from Baghdad, said US forces had dropped two 227kg precision-guided bombs on a mosque compound in Fallujah, Iraq, because local insurgents were using the compound as cover to fire at US soldiers.

"It (a mosque) has a special status under the Geneva Convention that it can't be attacked," Kimmitt said, adding "however, it can be attacked when there is a military necessity".

He said such religious sites would be struck if his forces believed insurgents were "storing weapons, using weapons, inciting violence, (or) executing violence from its grounds".

Kimmit said he could not confirm precise damage to the mosque or additional reports that a second Fallujah mosque had been attacked by US troops.

Link to article

http://www.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,4057,9225135%5E1702,00.html

[mr mahs]

Even if we're taking fire from Disneyland it's fair game....Send them in and let GOD sort them out...

[jamiroguy1]

Here's the problem I have with this rule...'if the forces believed they were inciting violence from the grounds' of the mosque it will be bombed.

This is too subjective we'll be bombing mosques everywhere in Iraq. How do you prove that this is where the violence is coming from? Sounds like mass killing to me.

[siceone]

Originally posted by jamiroguy1

Here's the problem I have with this rule...'if the forces believed they were inciting violence from the grounds' of the mosque it will be bombed.

This is too subjective we'll be bombing mosques everywhere in Iraq. How do you prove that this is where the violence is coming from? Sounds like mass killing to me.

the military doesn't hate islam and doesn't just fire on a mosque because they see one. the military is under orders to return fire, Return meaning that they can't fire first.

and can't fire initially unless ordered too.

like I said you can't expect us to play by a different set of rules

[mr mahs]

Originally posted by jamiroguy1

Here's the problem I have with this rule...'if the forces believed they were inciting violence from the grounds' of the mosque it will be bombed.

This is too subjective we'll be bombing mosques everywhere in Iraq. How do you prove that this is where the violence is coming from? Sounds like mass killing to me.

Mass killing? You don't think these animals realise that if they gather in a mosque the likely hood of it being bombed is lessened?

The insurgents closely watch the political and media environment in this country and the fact we are debating this only encourages them to use holy sites as camoflouge. Yesterday the gloves came off, these slugs can't hide and if they do we should level the building, period.

The people inside should notice these rag heads firing on troops and should flee immediatley, if the are being forced to stay then the word should get out that the insurgents are using innocent Iraq's as human shields... It's time for the majority to step up and voice their opposition to the terrorists action's,because in the long run it's only delaying democracy and the hand over of power.

Although some people have conspiracy theories about our true motives the US military doesn't wan't to stay in Iraq one day past whats necessary...

[jamiroguy1]

What would be definitive proof of military activity on the grounds of a mosque? Would it be militia outside the mosque with machine guns protecting who ever is inside like a radical cleric? Is that grounds for bombing a mosque? Or is it militia men shooting from inside the mosque? Or both?

[mr mahs]

Originally posted by jamiroguy1

What would be definitive proof of military activity on the grounds of a mosque? Would it be militia outside the mosque with machine guns protecting who ever is inside like a radical cleric? Is that grounds for bombing a mosque? Or is it militia men shooting from inside the mosque? Or both?

Inside firing on troops.

[siceone]

Originally posted by mr mahs

Inside firing on troops.

and storing weapons let's not forget that.

[pattbateman]

im a catholic and i would have no problem bombing the fuck out of a church

think about it

WWII- you and your crew are marching down and you see nazi motherfuckers going in and out of a church??

you bomb and shoot the fuck out of it

if the evidence is clear LOCK N LOAD and ROCK N ROLL!

[mrmatas2277]

great...it looks like it isnt getting any better...

Iraqi marchers break through US roadblocks in bid to relieve rebel bastion

BAGHDAD (AFP) - Thousands of Iraqi sympathisers, both Sunni and Shiite Muslim, forced their way through US military roadblocks in a bid to bring aid from the capital to the besieged Sunni rebel bastion of Fallujah.

Troops in armoured vehicles attempted to stop the convoy of cars and pedestrians from reaching the western town where US marines have met ferocious resistance in a two-day-old offensive against the insurgents.

But the US contingents were overwhelmed as residents of villages west of the capital came to the convoy's assistance, hurling insults and stones at the beleaguered troops.

Some 20 kilometers (12 miles) west of Baghdad, a US patrol was attacked just moments before the Iraqi marchers arrived, and armed insurgents could be seen dancing around on two blazing military vehicles.

Two US Humvees attempted to stop the marchers but were forced to drive off as residents joined the marchers, shouting "Allahu Akbar" (God is greater).

US troops armed with machine guns and backed up by armour again blocked the highway further west, but were forced to let the Iraqis past as they came under a hail of stones.

The cross-community demonstration of support for Fallujah had been organized by Baghdad clerics both Sunni and Shiite amid reports that the death toll in the town had reached 105 since Tuesday evening.

The rare display of sectarian unity came after Shiite radicals launched an uprising in cities across central and southern Iraq (news - web sites), shattering a year of relative tolerance of the US-led occupation from the country's majority community.

"No Sunnis, no Shiites, yes for Islamic unity," the marchers chanted. "We are Sunni and Shiite brothers and will never sell our country."

The marchers set off from the Um al-Qora mosque in west Baghdad where wellwishers donated food, drinks and medicine.

They carried portaits of Shiite radical leader Moqtada Sadr, as well as pictures of Sunni Islamist icon, Sheikh Ahmad Yassin, the spiritual leader of the Palestinian Hamas movement who was assassinated in an Israeli air raid last month.

"Our families in Fallujah, remember that our dead go to heaven and theirs to hell," read a banner held aloft by the crowd.

Mosque imam Sheikh Ahmad Abdel Ghafur al-Samarrai said the US-led coalition had given the Iraqi Red Crescent permission to organize a relief convoy but made no secret of his hostility to the US offensive in Fallujah.

"The Iraqi Red Crescent got permission from the coalition, following negotiations over one day and one night to bring these supplies into the city," Samarrai said.

"Baghdad residents decided to send initially 90 cars with food and medicines to Fallujah families," he told AFP.

"We want to express solidarity with our brothers who are being bombed by warplanes and tanks.

"It is a form of jihad (holy war) which can also come in the form of demonstrations, donations and fighting. The people who are occupied have the right to fight occupation, whatever the means they use."

The Sunni cleric called on US commanders to stop the bloody offensive they launched in Fallujah on tuesday after four US civilian contractors were killed in the town and two of their bodies mutilated.

"This only brings hatred and enmity," Samarrai said of the US assault.

"They killed the elderly praying at the mosques, as well as women and children. This is indiscriminate killing."

The cleric said he opposed the way the bodies of the American contractors had been treated but insisted that what the US marines were now doing in Fallujah was no better. They "are doing the same by mutilating the residential neighborhoods," he said.

[siceone]

darkest before the storm we will previal

[kramadas]

yeah, lets just keep telling ourselves that as more and more of the country starts to show support for the fighters.

[cintron]

we should be able to bomb churches and other "off limits" areas.

IN case everyone forgot - take a look at Vietnam.

They knew we wouldn't bomb them out of respect for the Geneva convention, so churches and hospitals became nests for flak cannons and weapons storage depots.

Imagine how pissed you'd be if you were taking fire from a church and you had someone senior calling you over the radio teling you that shooting back isn't allowed becuase we have to respect the geneva convention.

[tasrit]

Originally posted by mr mahs

Mass killing? You don't think these animals realise that if they gather in a mosque the likely hood of it being bombed is lessened?

The insurgents closely watch the political and media environment in this country and the fact we are debating this only encourages them to use holy sites as camoflouge. Yesterday the gloves came off, these slugs can't hide and if they do we should level the building, period.

The people inside should notice these rag heads firing on troops and should flee immediatley, if the are being forced to stay then the word should get out that the insurgents are using innocent Iraq's as human shields... It's time for the majority to step up and voice their opposition to the terrorists action's,because in the long run it's only delaying democracy and the hand over of power.

Although some people have conspiracy theories about our true motives the US military doesn't wan't to stay in Iraq one day past whats necessary...

The only animals are the occupiers of a land and in this case, the soldiers of the USA occupied IraQ. Each person has the right to defend himself against occupiers.

It's all colonial rhetoric!

[mr mahs]

Originally posted by tasrit

The only animals are the occupiers of a land and in this case, the soldiers of the USA occupied IraQ. Each person has the right to defend himself against occupiers.

It's all colonial rhetoric!

Yeah, good observation:rolleyes: Let me guess, we're there for oil right? We gave them freedom,on June 30th the deal is complete and we won't stay there one day over whats needed...

[tasrit]

In the past the Europe countries like France, Spain, Belgium, Britain and the Netherlands used the same colonial rhetoric as the USA today. These countries don't talk about occupation, but about bringing freedom and civilization to the people in Africa and Asia. For example, Spain and France occupied Morocco under the cloak of protectorate. They want to "save" Morocco from his Sultan and bring their "civilazition" to Africa. The people who fought against these occupiers were labeled as terorrist and barbarians.

You know nothing about the history of many countries in Europe, Middle East, Asia and Africa.

The history is repeating itself

[babbo]

Originally posted by tasrit

In the past the Europe countries like France, Spain, Belgium, Britain and the Netherlands used the same colonial rhetoric as the USA today. These countries don't talk about occupation, but about bringing freedom and civilization to the people in Africa and Asia. For example, Spain and France occupied Morocco under the cloak of protectorate. They want to "save" Morocco from his Sultan and bring their "civilazition" to Africa. The people who fought against these occupiers were labeled as terorrist and barbarians.

You know nothing about the history of many countries in Europe, Middle East, Asia and Africa.

The history is repeating itself

we should have just assassinated Husseein, and the the iraqi people should do what they wnated after that- yeah- kill the mother fucker- and thats it- not go into the country with troops

[mr mahs]

Originally posted by tasrit

In the past the Europe countries like France, Spain, Belgium, Britain and the Netherlands used the same colonial rhetoric as the USA today. These countries don't talk about occupation, but about bringing freedom and civilization to the people in Africa and Asia. For example, Spain and France occupied Morocco under the cloak of protectorate. They want to "save" Morocco from his Sultan and bring their "civilazition" to Africa. The people who fought against these occupiers were labeled as terorrist and barbarians.

You know nothing about the history of many countries in Europe, Middle East, Asia and Africa.

The history is repeating itself

Hopefully July 1st will exstinguish all this baseless rhetoric of empire building and occupation...

[siceone]

Originally posted by tasrit

In the past the Europe countries like France, Spain, Belgium, Britain and the Netherlands used the same colonial rhetoric as the USA today. These countries don't talk about occupation, but about bringing freedom and civilization to the people in Africa and Asia. For example, Spain and France occupied Morocco under the cloak of protectorate. They want to "save" Morocco from his Sultan and bring their "civilazition" to Africa. The people who fought against these occupiers were labeled as terorrist and barbarians.

You know nothing about the history of many countries in Europe, Middle East, Asia and Africa.

The history is repeating itself

yeah like 400 years ago Great frame of reference dipshit don't you think things are a little different.

[tasrit]

Originally posted by siceone

yeah like 400 years ago Great frame of reference dipshit don't you think things are a little different.

i'm talking about 80 years ago.

and still occupation is still occupation

genocide is still genocide etc.

why are you calling names?

[tasrit]

Originally posted by mr mahs

Hopefully July 1st will exstinguish all this baseless rhetoric of empire building and occupation...

I think we must leave this to the Iraqi people what they think about these situation. But I think they're not happy with it.

But I hope you're right that the USA don't want to control this area (or should I say control the whole world).

[siceone]

Originally posted by tasrit

i'm talking about 80 years ago.

and still occupation is still occupation

genocide is still genocide etc.

why are you calling names?

Genocide? where do you see genocide? the only genocide that occured in iraq was when saddam was in power he killed a 1/4 of the population a 1/4.

the military doesn't even kill every person with a gun just the people that shoot first shove that genocide crap.

for the last time the US does not want to rule the world all that would do would be to create the worldwide welfare state.