Why are you going to vote for Kerry?

[mursa]

looky look !!!!!!!!!!!! Dumb has Dumber's back

What a duo !

[mursa]

Slowly? What planet are you on? This economy is growing the fastest it has in over 25 yrs. Then again, how long have you been here in America? How much of it's history do you know? NUFF SAID.

.

Bro ...wtf is up with you and me being an Immigrant ????? playing soccer ?Are you implying that since your a pure bread american your "gods chosen one " ?

..your begining to sound even more and more like a Bigot and in some ways rascist ....but in a way it probably suits your ideological/political views well .

Humility is a beautiful thing .

[obby]

childish personal jabs?

narrow minded?

no substance?

cultured?

accepting of others?

whoa! this should be fun.

You brilliantly followed this post w/ "dumb and dumber's back"...........

care to follow your own advise Einstein?

Sarcasm & undeniable facts may come across to you as childish, narrow minded and un-cultured, but that still leaves out "substance" and "accepting of others".

Either you haven't fully grasped the English language or need help w/ reading comprehension. I have bombarded you w/ undeniable facts which completely undercut your colorful theories and accusations. Your problem is you've based your argument on emotional psycho-babble. When presented w/ facts, you change the subject to avoid further embarrassment. You claim you're accepting of others but you forgot to mention that included everyone except "conservatives/republicans". I've done my best to better educate you in the hope you might have a better grasp of reality, to no avail. I've tried the humble approach (at first), sarcastic approach, kindergarten approach and combative approach. Thus far, to no avail. Your latest stroke of genius is to imply I'm racist or a bigot (hint-hint: changing subject again,,,GOTCHA!). If you are an immigrant, then what's the problem? That's not a bad word. Inferiority complex on your part does not equate to bigotry on mine. I'm far from being "God's chosen one" (ps...did you just say God? I thought that was a bad word for you guys?). Anyway, I'm an American. An American of Cuban decent, but make no mistake,,,USDA CHOICE BABY! lol I know this countries history. I value and respect the sacrifices so many Americans have made to have lived the life I have lived thus far. Those aren't just words I just wrote. They're something I carry in the core of my soul. Excuse me if I get offended when foreign immigrants who can't even vote try to re-write history and twist facts to suit their failed logic. Excuse me if I get offended when people who use this country to provide themselves w/ lives their home countries never could provide, begin to falsely accuse our leader of atrocious, immoral behavior. To put this in Mickey Mouse language "Don't bite the hand that feeds you!". A truly cultured person would never disrespect the house in which he is a guest. You're problem is not being cultured, it's knowledge. They say a little knowledge can be more dangerous than having no knowledge. You seem to fit this scenario perfectly. You think you know what you're talking about and bravely take a stand. Only when confronted w/ facts which completely discredit you, you try to twist the argument into something else. It's the equivalent of screaming "HALLIBURTON" every time you're proven wrong.

Like I said, "skool yo' self man!" Go to the library, don't worry, "da' gobmint" ain't gonna track you down for checking out American History and European Civilization books.

You have yet to answer my questions from the first page of this thread....but I can understand why.......you can always have your mod partner answer for you.

I'll be waiting....

[mursa]

You brilliantly followed this post w/ "dumb and dumber's back"...........

care to follow your own advise Einstein?

I'll be waiting....

LOL ...you call be Robin , then low & behold I accidentally find material to hit back ...and now your acting like the victim.

I barely skimmed through your "essay" and what i get out of it is your Angry and your in Denial about something ............just a hunch i have .

PS....by my education/library comment ....im 24 with a major in Biology and a minor in History . FYI .

[sobeton]

childish personal jabs?

narrow minded?

no substance?

cultured?

accepting of others?

whoa! this should be fun.

You brilliantly followed this post w/ "dumb and dumber's back"...........

care to follow your own advise Einstein?

Sarcasm & undeniable facts may come across to you as childish, narrow minded and un-cultured, but that still leaves out "substance" and "accepting of others".

Either you haven't fully grasped the English language or need help w/ reading comprehension. I have bombarded you w/ undeniable facts which completely undercut your colorful theories and accusations. Your problem is you've based your argument on emotional psycho-babble. When presented w/ facts, you change the subject to avoid further embarrassment. You claim you're accepting of others but you forgot to mention that included everyone except "conservatives/republicans". I've done my best to better educate you in the hope you might have a better grasp of reality, to no avail. I've tried the humble approach (at first), sarcastic approach, kindergarten approach and combative approach. Thus far, to no avail. Your latest stroke of genius is to imply I'm racist or a bigot (hint-hint: changing subject again,,,GOTCHA!). If you are an immigrant, then what's the problem? That's not a bad word. Inferiority complex on your part does not equate to bigotry on mine. I'm far from being "God's chosen one" (ps...did you just say God? I thought that was a bad word for you guys?). Anyway, I'm an American. An American of Cuban decent, but make no mistake,,,USDA CHOICE BABY! lol I know this countries history. I value and respect the sacrifices so many Americans have made to have lived the life I have lived thus far. Those aren't just words I just wrote. They're something I carry in the core of my soul. Excuse me if I get offended when foreign immigrants who can't even vote try to re-write history and twist facts to suit their failed logic. Excuse me if I get offended when people who use this country to provide themselves w/ lives their home countries never could provide, begin to falsely accuse our leader of atrocious, immoral behavior. To put this in Mickey Mouse language "Don't bite the hand that feeds you!". A truly cultured person would never disrespect the house in which he is a guest. You're problem is not being cultured, it's knowledge. They say a little knowledge can be more dangerous than having no knowledge. You seem to fit this scenario perfectly. You think you know what you're talking about and bravely take a stand. Only when confronted w/ facts which completely discredit you, you try to twist the argument into something else. It's the equivalent of screaming "HALLIBURTON" every time you're proven wrong.

Like I said, "skool yo' self man!" Go to the library, don't worry, "da' gobmint" ain't gonna track you down for checking out American History and European Civilization books.

You have yet to answer my questions from the first page of this thread....but I can understand why.......you can always have your mod partner answer for you.

I'll be waiting....

:laugh: you have got to be kidding..

[obby]

Point proven !!!

[mursa]

go get em OBBY !!!!!!!!!!!! US rulers of the UNIVERSEEEEEEEEE

[philippio]

...

-Even though we are slowly gaining jobs in this country , we forget that most of them are minimal wage type .

Come on mursa, you and I both know that's a cheap shot! After all, think of one of the underlying reasons you came to the US. You and I both know that Portugal, Greece, Ireland and Spain have the highest unemployment rates in the EU... I'm not arguing here that you should compare my aforementioned statement with the unemployment figures in the US... during any war or conflict, unemployment rates are undeniably going to fluctuate. It is expected that sometimes recovery will occur slowly.

[obby]

Come on mursa, you and I both know that's a cheap shot! After all, think of one of the underlying reasons you came to the US. You and I both know that Portugal, Greece, Ireland and Spain have the highest unemployment rates in the EU... I'm not arguing here that you should compare my aforementioned statement with the unemployment figures in the US... during any war or conflict, unemployment rates are undeniably going to fluctuate. It is expected that sometimes recovery will occur slowly.

Hence my comments:

Excuse me if I get offended when foreign immigrants who can't even vote try to re-write history and twist facts to suit their failed logic. Excuse me if I get offended when people who use this country to provide themselves w/ lives their home countries never could provide, begin to falsely accuse our leader of atrocious, immoral behavior. To put this in Mickey Mouse language "Don't bite the hand that feeds you!". A truly cultured person would never disrespect the house in which he is a guest.

I respect your mentality Philip and I hope our (yours too) Country helps you accomplish all your dreams.

Again I you.

[mursa]

Come on mursa, you and I both know that's a cheap shot! After all, think of one of the underlying reasons you came to the US. You and I both know that Portugal, Greece, Ireland and Spain have the highest unemployment rates in the EU... I'm not arguing here that you should compare my aforementioned statement with the unemployment figures in the US... during any war or conflict, unemployment rates are undeniably going to fluctuate. It is expected that sometimes recovery will occur slowly.

It's a cheap shot ? . How so ?

Speaking from personal experience .....I used to make nearly 20 $ an hour back in 98-99 , now that same type of job pays 13$-14$ .

The fact is that LIFE is getting more and more Expensive all while salaries are going downhill .............no denying that philip .

PS...yea i know how europe is ....i once worked construction for nearly 2 weeks to get paid ...200 euros .

[philippio]

It's a cheap shot ? . How so ?

...

As you earlier mentioned, we are not fighting a war against a known adversary. It's a war on terrorism that the US could be engaged in for a long period of time. During this time, our economy will fluctuate. This is inevitable. If you chose a career path like mine, you would see military contract opportunities rise (for such companies as Boeing, Lockheed, Raytheon, etc) while employments opportunities at say, various bizjet manufacturers or Boeing Commercial would disappear, and layoffs could very well be possible. Maybe, if we were to go back to 9.10.01, you would see things very differently. But as they say, hindsight is 20/20. Maybe this administration made mistakes engaging in the conflicts that we are still fighting. But could it be that certain socio-economic indices will undoubtedly be perturbed by these conflicts whether the administration rightfully engaged in them or not? Can you honestly tell me that Kerry, or Bush, or any other politician could promise that engaging in a war on terrorism will in no way affect our domestic economy and GDP?

[mursa]

As you earlier mentioned, we are not fighting a war against a known adversary. It's a war on terrorism that the US could be engaged in for a long period of time.

You Cannot use the Terrorism excuse forever man ! ,,,if thats the case , then if we are attacked once or two times like 9/11 ,,then in all seriousness THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA will implode and cease to exist ...al quaeda wins

..

....So if the war on terrorism last 50 years , your telling me we'll have to deal with ever growing difficulty for that period of time ?

[sobeton]

As you earlier mentioned, we are not fighting a war against a known adversary. It's a war on terrorism that the US could be engaged in for a long period of time. During this time, our economy will fluctuate. This is inevitable. If you chose a career path like mine, you would see military contract opportunities rise (for such companies as Boeing, Lockheed, Raytheon, etc) while employments opportunities at say, various bizjet manufacturers or Boeing Commercial would disappear, and layoffs could very well be possible. Maybe, if we were to go back to 9.10.01, you would see things very differently. But as they say, hindsight is 20/20. Maybe this administration made mistakes engaging in the conflicts that we are still fighting. But could it be that certain socio-economic indices will undoubtedly be perturbed by these conflicts whether the administration rightfully engaged in them or not? Can you honestly tell me that Kerry, or Bush, or any other politician could promise that engaging in a war on terrorism will in no way affect our domestic economy and GDP?

we are not fighting a war against a known adversary:confused:

the war against terrorism is indefinite. securing our country is not a temporary thing; it’s a long term commitment. while catching Bin Laden may minimize the terrorist threat; it will not erode it completely..

when consumer confidence is high the economy gets a jolt. our economy has survived several wars. it would be naïve to believe our economy, would not be effected by our current state of affairs. conversely using war, as the only means to rationalize a weak economy is rather subjective at best. btw we are engaged in several wars at the moment..

[philippio]

You Cannot use the Terrorism excuse forever man ! ,,,if thats the case , then if we are attacked once or two times like 9/11 ,,then in all seriousness THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA will implode and cease to exist ...al quaeda wins

..

....So if the war on terrorism last 50 years , your telling me we'll have to deal with ever growing difficulty for that period of time ?

No that is not what I'm saying. And I do not even entirely agree with our administration's decision to invade Iraq. Although I'm not politically inclined toward Bush or Kerry, I was using the anecdote not to portray one candidate as a better choice than another, but rather, to illustrate that as an immigrant to this country, you should not expect to be voting for someone who claims they can magically correct the job unemployment situation. History should tell you that many people tried to do just that after the 2 WOrld Wars yet their attempts were dismal failures.

[mursa]

No that is not what I'm saying. And I do not even entirely agree with our administration's decision to invade Iraq. Although I'm not politically inclined toward Bush or Kerry, I was using the anecdote not to portray one candidate as a better choice than another, but rather, to illustrate that as an immigrant to this country, you should not expect to be voting for someone who claims they can magically correct the job unemployment situation. History should tell you that many people tried to do just that after the 2 WOrld Wars yet their attempts were dismal failures.

First off , im not too crazy about Kerry aswell , but I simply choose the lesser of two evils on this one .........and also with the memories of my families economic life being better during Democratic rule than with Bush's .

Im not refering only to the economy which in my opinion is "eroding the middle class " , but in terms of international relations , this president doesn't gain respect among many of the world community , he alienates countries like russia , germany, france ......... and hear me well phillip ...

..

... Without the worlds help in fighting terrorism , the US will lose .

[philippio]

First off , im not too crazy about Kerry aswell , but I simply choose the lesser of two evils on this one .........and also with the memories of my families economic life being better during Democratic rule than with Bush's .

This is why I'm not a HUGE fan of the bipartisan system of government. What you are saying, mursa, is that you will exercise your right to vote not for the candidate whose views you agree with more, but for the one whose political agenda triggers LESS objections in you... Maybe this is why so few people in this country vote (when compared to any European country, where politics is second only to football). I strongly disagree with your reasoning for voting democratic.

Im not refering only to the economy which in my opinion is "eroding the middle class " , but in terms of international relations , this president doesn't gain respect among many of the world community , he alienates countries like russia , germany, france ......... and hear me well phillip ...

..

... Without the worlds help in fighting terrorism , the US will lose .

Honestly, I feel I'm a rational individual. And having spoken with Obby many times about many different subjects, I have come to the conclusion that he is rational as well. But nowhere in his tirade about Bush and the Iraqi invasion, have I seen any outlandish claims that the US is capable of fighting the war on terrorism alone. That would be a completely ignorant remark on his behalf, yet Obby does not strike me as an ignoramus in the least. In fact, I challenge you to seek out a single comment that could not be characterized as patriotic on his behalf. I know that if Greece were at war to protect its sovereignty and/or national security (say against Turkey), and the Greek government were sending my family and friends into battle, I would be supporting my country as well. I think what you fail to understand is that Obby is not simply supporting the war and Bush merely because HIS family is there. He is supporting it because HE believes that it is for a just cause, whether you like it or not.

Regarding Bush and his administration's global reputation for foreign policy, I do feel that he has made mistakes down the road... are you absolutely sure that Kerry will not follow in his footsteps? Can you honestly tell me that he is the only leader in the world that may have marred his reputation??? Politics is politics. Many people argue that Bush is much smarter that what he wants the world to see. I don't necessarily believe that. But in politics, it's not always about what you believe. US politics can be as corrupt as any other country's, with underlying motives and agendas. If you think you're voting for Kerry because he has no hidden agendas and his entire campaign is dedicated to the middle class, I wish you the best of luck and pray that you will not be entirely disappointed with the results, if he is elected.

[shortkat5]

LOL ...you call be Robin , then low & behold I accidentally find material to hit back ...and now your acting like the victim.

I barely skimmed through your "essay" and what i get out of it is your Angry and your in Denial about something ............just a hunch i have .

PS....by my education/library comment ....im 24 with a major in Biology and a minor in History . FYI .

you know i just gotta say it - mursa to be a 24 yr old college student your spelling and grammar are atrocious!!!!! (run go get a dictionary)

[sobeton]

This is why I'm not a HUGE fan of the bipartisan system of government. What you are saying, mursa, is that you will exercise your right to vote not for the candidate whose views you agree with more, but for the one whose political agenda triggers LESS objections in you... Maybe this is why so few people in this country vote (when compared to any European country, where politics is second only to football). I strongly disagree with your reasoning for voting democratic.

Honestly, I feel I'm a rational individual. And having spoken with Obby many times about many different subjects, I have come to the conclusion that he is rational as well. But nowhere in his tirade about Bush and the Iraqi invasion, have I seen any outlandish claims that the US is capable of fighting the war on terrorism alone. That would be a completely ignorant remark on his behalf, yet Obby does not strike me as an ignoramus in the least. In fact, I challenge you to seek out a single comment that could not be characterized as patriotic on his behalf. I know that if Greece were at war to protect its sovereignty and/or national security (say against Turkey), and the Greek government were sending my family and friends into battle, I would be supporting my country as well. I think what you fail to understand is that Obby is not simply supporting the war and Bush merely because HIS family is there. He is supporting it because HE believes that it is for a just cause, whether you like it or not.

Regarding Bush and his administration's global reputation for foreign policy, I do feel that he has made mistakes down the road... are you absolutely sure that Kerry will not follow in his footsteps? Can you honestly tell me that he is the only leader in the world that may have marred his reputation??? Politics is politics. Many people argue that Bush is much smarter that what he wants the world to see. I don't necessarily believe that. But in politics, it's not always about what you believe. US politics can be as corrupt as any other country's, with underlying motives and agendas. If you think you're voting for Kerry because he has no hidden agendas and his entire campaign is dedicated to the middle class, I wish you the best of luck and pray that you will not be entirely disappointed with the results, if he is elected.

what I interpret from mursa's comments which where: "First off , im not too crazy about Kerry aswell , but I simply choose the lesser of two evils on this one .........and also with the memories of my families economic life being better during Democratic rule than with Bush's ." that he is not fully supportive of Kerry. however, through his experience he has found his quality of life to be better during Democratic rule. knowing Jose (murusa) as I do, and based on discussions we have had regarding the same. there are qualities Kerry has which he favors; perhaps he will allude to the same when he replies to your post. if would be naive IMO, to believe someone would vote for a particular candidate;solely because one is the lesser of two evils. at the end of the day, people will vote for the candidate who best supports there individual beliefs.

[mursa]

you know i just gotta say it - mursa to be a 24 yr old college student your spelling and grammar are atrocious!!!!! (run go get a dictionary)

..I write quickly , I don't copy & paste material like some ...I type almost as quick as I think , hence my spelling errors .

thanks for noticing though .

[mursa]

This is why I'm not a HUGE fan of the bipartisan system of government. What you are saying, mursa, is that you will exercise your right to vote not for the candidate whose views you agree with more, but for the one whose political agenda triggers LESS objections in you... Maybe this is why so few people in this country vote (when compared to any European country, where politics is second only to football). I strongly disagree with your reasoning for voting democratic.

Honestly, I feel I'm a rational individual. And having spoken with Obby many times about many different subjects, I have come to the conclusion that he is rational as well. But nowhere in his tirade about Bush and the Iraqi invasion, have I seen any outlandish claims that the US is capable of fighting the war on terrorism alone. That would be a completely ignorant remark on his behalf, yet Obby does not strike me as an ignoramus in the least. In fact, I challenge you to seek out a single comment that could not be characterized as patriotic on his behalf. I know that if Greece were at war to protect its sovereignty and/or national security (say against Turkey), and the Greek government were sending my family and friends into battle, I would be supporting my country as well. I think what you fail to understand is that Obby is not simply supporting the war and Bush merely because HIS family is there. He is supporting it because HE believes that it is for a just cause, whether you like it or not.

Regarding Bush and his administration's global reputation for foreign policy, I do feel that he has made mistakes down the road... are you absolutely sure that Kerry will not follow in his footsteps? Can you honestly tell me that he is the only leader in the world that may have marred his reputation??? Politics is politics. Many people argue that Bush is much smarter that what he wants the world to see. I don't necessarily believe that. But in politics, it's not always about what you believe. US politics can be as corrupt as any other country's, with underlying motives and agendas. If you think you're voting for Kerry because he has no hidden agendas and his entire campaign is dedicated to the middle class, I wish you the best of luck and pray that you will not be entirely disappointed with the results, if he is elected.

It's not a matter of patriotism and love of country thats gonna win this war .....you have to be in good terms with the most powerful nations in the world and make them WANT to help out the US , like good friends do . A coalition of the willing that includes the phillipines, portugal , poland , ukraine and bulgaria isn't gonna help much in this war in terror ...you and I know that these countries are only involved because of the Economic aid the US is giving them ...well i know in the case of Portugal thats the case , so I predict for the other nations it'll be the same .

Excessive pride in being a super power and " we can do it alone " can bite this nation in the ass if It doesn't build bridges again .