BUSH 2004 - It's Over !!!!!!!!

[vicman]

So why not lower the taxes of that 2 person family. wouldn't that help them?

yes it would.

if they make less than 200k that would prolly happen. the only people who would see their taxes go up would be those making over 200k.

i think i got $700 back on my fed. tax return this year, it was $200 less 'cos i moved up a couple of brackets in the tax-code. and then i got slapped in my face 'cos MD State taxes and fokkin' County taxes went up, so did my cars registration and fokkin' tolls and parking meters and public transportation in DC.

i think the average for the average citizen, 30% of their income goes to taxes, did you see Teresa's Heinz Kerry tax return from last year? She paid like 15% of her total income in taxes. She is a good example of what rich people get away with, politicians are rich people, they know where to put their $$$ so they don't have to pay that many taxes. Bush is a billionaire, just the same way a lot of the people his tax cuts are helping the most.

Kerry admited in the debates that his taxes, as well as Bush's, went way down in comparison to the average citizen, to me there is something wrong with that picture.

[vicman]

Some of those mega millionaires worked hard to be where they are at today. Not all were lucky enough to have Grandma or Grandpa leave them something when they passed away. I try and put myself in their shoes and I myself would be bitter if:

1- I worked hard for my money

and

2- Just because I made I am now to be taxed extra

Sorry, doesn't make sense to me at this point.

Not all millionaires inherited their millions.

From what i have read the top 50% of wage earners pay 96% of the taxes. Poor people don't pay taxes because they don't have the money, hence being poor.

they just like to rape you out of your disposable income. yeah a lot of them worked hard, but a lot of them know how to move their $$$ around so they don't have to pay more taxes if they have to.

they move their businesses to bermuda so they dont taxed there while conducting business in the US, for example.

they move thier companies overseas so they can pay lower wages instead of paying higher wages in the US and don't have to pay for any type of health insurance to their employees, hence increasing thier proffits, in the meantime, your cousin is out of a job.

they work hard in lobbying elected officials so they can get federal contracts, lobbying congress (both parties are equally at fault), to pass legislation that would allow them greater flexibility in increasing their profits and pay lower taxes and be able to screw you and me in the process while your job as a computer guy gets shipped to india.

(i dunno if you are a computer guy, i just used it as a metaphor)

[italia23]

Some of those mega millionaires worked hard to be where they are at today. Not all were lucky enough to have Grandma or Grandpa leave them something when they passed away. I try and put myself in their shoes and I myself would be bitter if:

1- I worked hard for my money

and

2- Just because I made I am now to be taxed extra

Sorry, doesn't make sense to me at this point.

Not all millionaires inherited their millions.

From what i have read the top 50% of wage earners pay 96% of the taxes. Poor people don't pay taxes because they don't have the money, hence being poor.

The top 1% pays 70% of U.S. taxes.

The bottom 50% pays 4%.

I'm not in that top 1% but I someday plan to be.

LOL @ Kerry referring to the top 1% as "millionaires sitting by their pools".

[amyscottsdale]

yes it would.

if they make less than 200k that would prolly happen. the only people who would see their taxes go up would be those making over 200k.

i think i got $700 back on my fed. tax return this year, it was $200 less 'cos i moved up a couple of brackets in the tax-code. and then i got slapped in my face 'cos MD State taxes and fokkin' County taxes went up, so did my cars registration and fokkin' tolls and parking meters and public transportation in DC.

i think the average for the average citizen, 30% of their income goes to taxes, did you see Teresa's Heinz Kerry tax return from last year? She paid like 15% of her total income in taxes. She is a good example of what rich people get away with, politicians are rich people, they know where to put their $$$ so they don't have to pay that many taxes. Bush is a billionaire, just the same way a lot of the people his tax cuts are helping the most.

Kerry admited in the debates that his taxes, as well as Bush's, went way down in comparison to the average citizen, to me there is something wrong with that picture.

So I'll put you down for a middle class tax cut, which I love.

But I don't like 'redistribution of wealth'. Why do you want to raise other people's taxes? What do you want done with that money?

[anotherway83]

i think the next four years will most likely be worse than the previous four years. at least before now bush couldn't just do anything at all that he pleased, because he had to keep his re-election chances in mind. now that he's been re-elected and has only one more term to go, he might do things that are far more worse.

[vicman]

So I'll put you down for a middle class tax cut, which I love.

But I don't like 'redistribution of wealth'. Why do you want to raise other people's taxes? What do you want done with that money?

taxes from the big companies would help fund education programs (such as No Child Left Behind-which Bush signed into law and underfunded; more after school programs); social services and programs (like better housing for seniors; better drug tx and education programs; better health related prevention programs; better health education programs); more work training programs (so people whose industries have dissapeared and their skills are no longer usefull can get training in new skills so they can go out and find a job); improved health care (like reducing the cost of medical drugs-we dont use them now but wait until we hit 60 or 70; public hospitals across the country are closing or being privatized); increased funding to research alternative fuel sources.

we are not taking the money from the rich to give it to the poor, we are taking the money that the govmnt. has been throwing at them and using it to fund things that you, me, my mom, your dad, our neighbors, the kid in north dakota, the guy in the bronx, can use.

[amyscottsdale]

taxes from the big companies would help fund education programs (such as No Child Left Behind-which Bush signed into law and underfunded; more after school programs); social services and programs (like better housing for seniors; better drug tx and education programs; better health related prevention programs; better health education programs); more work training programs (so people whose industries have dissapeared and their skills are no longer usefull can get training in new skills so they can go out and find a job); improved health care (like reducing the cost of medical drugs-we dont use them now but wait until we hit 60 or 70; public hospitals across the country are closing or being privatized); increased funding to research alternative fuel sources.

we are not taking the money from the rich to give it to the poor, we are taking the money that the govmnt. has been throwing at them and using it to fund things that you, me, my mom, your dad, our neighbors, the kid in north dakota, the guy in the bronx, can use.

That all sounds good, but I don't want my taxes raised, I want them lowered. Why don't we NOT do all that stuff and lower everybodies taxes.

[jtk4]

yeah fuck taxes. Who needs things like cops, or firefighters, or public works workers, or garbage men,ect

or a military or a coast guard or a border patrol,

[mursa]

..the rich get rich in part by taking advantage of poor people ....where else do they make thier money ?

I laugh at the concept of "oh, but they work hard !" ,,fact of the matter is that I have known people who work 16-18 hour days only to bring 150$ home ...so for anyone to come with that excuse is ridiculous .

..why is it a bad thing for them to give something extra back to society ?, which in the first place allowed them their material wealth in the first place .

They'll continue Rich and at the same time allow others to live a better life .

*

Humanity ! got it ?

[vicman]

That all sounds good, but I don't want my taxes raised, I want them lowered. Why don't we NOT do all that stuff and lower everybodies taxes.

taxes are how the government obtains its revenue to fund the services you have. water, gas, collecting trash, military, health care, law enforcment; fund departments such as the FAA, homeland security, health and human services, etc.

if the taxes are lowered or federal spending is way over what the pull in, they have to cut services, such as cops (or their salaries), military personel (and their salaries); seniors medical coverage; your social security-stuff like that is usually the first to go.

you need a balance between between enough taxes and not too many.

bush is just going make your kids end up paying for everything you dont plus intrest.

[obby]

Some geniuse wrote: (aka- MURSA)

- The rich get rich in part by taking advantage of poor people

Survey Says?

X

You know your a socialist, right?

Your entitled to have that belief but you are in the last place that logic actually has any relevance, AMERICA! (Longest lasting democracy to date)

Socialism is an old, tired failure. Why you embrace such a historically failed ideology and logic really has me scratching my head? You might want to try selling that in another capitalistic republic super power. It comes across like a student lecturing the professor. America earned it's rightful place in the world. America was not given it's power and success. It was not entitled, nor were any others. There's nothing wrong w/ working hard to achieve a goal. Success should never be punished, rather, it should be applauded and taught to all that will listen. You seem to share the same gene as Sen. John Kerry and most of today's democrats. You wrongly believe that Gov't was meant to govern over the people. President Bush, myself, and as of yesterday the majority of America happen to believe that the Gov't was meant to govern FOR the people, not OVER them. Get it?

Listen scooter,

The top 50% of wage earners pay 96% of all Federal Income Taxes(Read that last line again, and again, and again). The top 10% percent pay 65%. The top 5% pay 53%. The poor don't pay taxes, hence being poor. I'm not one who believes I'm entitled to prosperity via the Gov't. Success breeds success. The Gov't can't tax us into prosperity. Therefore, it would be unwise to punish success in America by over taxing those who succeed. Take away the prize and then there's not much worth fighting for. Our economy is driven by the private sector, not the Gov't. You can't expect to maintain the entrepreneurial spirit which is our CASH COW. It makes the wheel go round. Sky's the limit. Sacrifice, Work hard, Be responsible and obey the rule of law. That's the formula for increasing your chances at reaching financial stability and maybe even prosperity. There are no guarantees in life. There are no entitlements. To assume so is foolish and ungrounded from reality,,,some might say even WHACKED! You want those new shoes? Work, save up and buy them. You want that nice car? Ditto! You want that big house? Ditto! You might be surprised how much of better person that journey might make you. It's called character and integrity which by all account, you lack.

To be quite honest, If you really want to get down to the nuts and bolts of this issue imagine this:

Imagine you're king for the day and you make taxes optional. This way, the true "do gooders" could donate all they wish to the Gov't. Those who support the Gov't programs donate what they want, those who don't, DON'T! How well do you think this tax plan will function? If you could do this I think you would be awoken to the reality that not many(probably including yourself) would be giving away their money. NOT GONNA HAPPEN GUY! Therefore, the hypocrisy of your implication of taking more from the ones who are already doing their fair share and then some is a little offensive. Not much, but enough. (Take your stinking paws out of my wallet!)

Look dude, you've got it all wrong. American Gov't should be as limited as possible. It should only help maintain and protect a fair environment in which business' can grow. If you keep putting hurdles up, you foolishly destroy what too many have worked hard and died trying to preserve. In America, we the people decide. Americans choose those whom they believe will best represent them, their beliefs, convictions and vision. Once every 4 years, we're lucky to have the right to vote for whom we wish can best lead this great super power.

Some tried to imply Bush was not even worthy of winning the election in 2000. Gore won the popular vote by 500,000 and most of his supporters screamed that from the mountain tops and planted the seed of illegitimacy. 2 yrs. later, America spoke again and gave Republicans the majority in both houses of congress. Regardless of what was staring them right in the face, democrats insisted on regurgitating the myth of President Bush's illegitimacy. Let's review shall we? He wins a close one in 2000, Demz believe it's just a fluke. There's no way America would disagree w/ them, Right? Then comes 2002 mid-term elections and POW, Republicans clean house. Take congress and governorships. Still, these same OMNISCIENT democrats choose to point blame and invent conspiracy rather than soul search. Finally, 2004 presidential election, President Bush wins the popular vote by almost 4,000,000 (yes, 4 million and counting,,,,still counting absentee votes). President Bush wins the electoral vote. Republicans gain even more seats from both houses of congress and increase even more governorships. America again spoke LOUDLY. Apparently the last 2 times fell upon deaf ears.

Ironically, there are still those who've yet to be successful which keep trying to push their failed propaganda. Why would anyone in their right mind take the advice of 3 time LA-LA-LA,,,,LOOOOOSERS! Apparently, for anyone who's grounded in reality, you must see the major tidal shift in the culture of America. Looks like Americans aren't as dumb as today's democratic party thought they were. The rest of the globe is still drinking the Kerry Kool-Aid, but as of Nov 2nd,,,Kerry WHO??????? The SILENT MAJORITY has again spoken and spoken loudly.

Both Demz and Repz knew the stakes of this election. They both knew w/ Repz controlling congress, a Bush re-election could possibly bring desperately needed conservative change to our Gov't. With Supreme Court Justices expected to retire w/in the next few years (maybe up to 4 Justices), this could mean "quite a bit" don't ya' think? Right now, the 9 judge panel consists of 5 Repz and 4 Demz. President Bush appointing up to 4 Supreme Court Justices(which they will hold for life)? Are you shaking in your boots yet? Don't silly rabbit. Bush is not the NAZI "yo' dying raza" claims he is(Just check your latest election map,,,and good luck finding any BLUE). So, I understand the "dirty trix". I understand why the left chose to attack the man rather than his policy. You again "mis-underestimated" the American people and their value of character, core convictions and principle. Apparently, character does matter. You can't have a record of "liberalism" and FAKE being a conservative come election time. Maybe in the past, but not today, NO WAY.

I guess the good guy does win out at the end.

Well, there's always Canada "eh" ? LOL

For the drama queens threatening to "FLEE" to Canada, by all means,,,GOOD REDDENS.

God Bless America and Pray for our troops.

Class dismissed.

DJ OBBY, aka,,,SUPER "DOOPER" CITIZEN (like you call me).

[jtk4]

do you really think that people voted for bush because of his view on the economy? They would rather have kerry in if it was only about the economy.

did you look at the exit polls?

The majority of peope who voted voted bush for his moral views. Abortion gay marriage shit like that.

The top 50% pay 96% but the problem is they are getting richer while the middle class and poor are getting poorer. The gap between the three are growing. That is not good in any society.

god bless the troops is right

[obby]

It was a reply to the "rich get richer by taking advantage of the poor" by Mursa.

[jtk4]

oh ok

because the majority of the people do not like bush's tax plan but agree with his moral standing. I am talking all the people deep south and mid west. You know the same people who dragged that gay guy behing their truck and then tied him to a fence post.

[amyscottsdale]

taxes are how the government obtains its revenue to fund the services you have. water, gas, collecting trash, military, health care, law enforcment; fund departments such as the FAA, homeland security, health and human services, etc.

if the taxes are lowered or federal spending is way over what the pull in, they have to cut services, such as cops (or their salaries), military personel (and their salaries); seniors medical coverage; your social security-stuff like that is usually the first to go.

you need a balance between between enough taxes and not too many.

bush is just going make your kids end up paying for everything you dont plus intrest.

All I know is, especially out here, people are tired of paying taxes for everyone else who just doesn't feel like working. I finally saved enough money to buy my own house by busting my ass for 4 years and working hard (2 jobs!!!) and saving. Meanwhile, my loser brother is sitting around on welfare just because he doesn't feel like working. I don't think we should all have to pay for his food and health insurance. He needs to put down the x-box and get a job (or 2).

[mursa]

It was a reply to the "rich get richer by taking advantage of the poor" by Mursa.

Isn't it true ? .............. How do buisiness executives make money ??? .. buy low and sell high in order to make a profit . simple junior high economics ...im not saying it's illegal or even imoral ..

....but don't you feel a multi-millionaire buisiness owner should give a little bit more to the very society that gives him a super confortable life ?

3,000$ more in taxes for someone making 2.1 million $ isn't NOTHING TO EM !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

No Gratitude ? Humanity ? ...oh yea we're in the US ...its full force ahead and fuck your neighbor ....almost like those broken down drivers on I-95 huh ? fuck em !

[jtk4]

All I know is, especially out here, people are tired of paying taxes for everyone else who just doesn't feel like working. I finally saved enough money to buy my own house by busting my ass for 4 years and working hard (2 jobs!!!) and saving. Meanwhile, my loser brother is sitting around on welfare just because he doesn't feel like working. I don't think we should all have to pay for his food and health insurance. He needs to put down the x-box and get a job (or 2).

wait arizona does not even have unemployment. They also have some of the lowest taxes in the country. stop bitching and be glad evertime you turn on your shower you have water. Someone has to pay to ship it into the dessert for you.

[amyscottsdale]

wait arizona does not even have unemployment. They also have some of the lowest taxes in the country. stop bitching and be glad evertime you turn on your shower you have water. Someone has to pay to ship it into the dessert for you.

I'm not bitching, I'm very happy.

And I pay for my water, thank you!

[jtk4]

we all pay for your water

[amyscottsdale]

we all pay for your water

Thanks!

[soturecords]

Some geniuse wrote: (aka- MURSA)

- The rich get rich in part by taking advantage of poor people

Survey Says?

X

You know your a socialist, right?

Your entitled to have that belief but you are in the last place that logic actually has any relevance, AMERICA! (Longest lasting democracy to date)

Socialism is an old, tired failure. Why you embrace such a historically failed ideology and logic really has me scratching my head? You might want to try selling that in another capitalistic republic super power. It comes across like a student lecturing the professor. America earned it's rightful place in the world. America was not given it's power and success. It was not entitled, nor were any others. There's nothing wrong w/ working hard to achieve a goal. Success should never be punished, rather, it should be applauded and taught to all that will listen. You seem to share the same gene as Sen. John Kerry and most of today's democrats. You wrongly believe that Gov't was meant to govern over the people. President Bush, myself, and as of yesterday the majority of America happen to believe that the Gov't was meant to govern FOR the people, not OVER them. Get it?

Listen scooter,

The top 50% of wage earners pay 96% of all Federal Income Taxes(Read that last line again, and again, and again). The top 10% percent pay 65%. The top 5% pay 53%. The poor don't pay taxes, hence being poor. I'm not one who believes I'm entitled to prosperity via the Gov't. Success breeds success. The Gov't can't tax us into prosperity. Therefore, it would be unwise to punish success in America by over taxing those who succeed. Take away the prize and then there's not much worth fighting for. Our economy is driven by the private sector, not the Gov't. You can't expect to maintain the entrepreneurial spirit which is our CASH COW. It makes the wheel go round. Sky's the limit. Sacrifice, Work hard, Be responsible and obey the rule of law. That's the formula for increasing your chances at reaching financial stability and maybe even prosperity. There are no guarantees in life. There are no entitlements. To assume so is foolish and ungrounded from reality,,,some might say even WHACKED! You want those new shoes? Work, save up and buy them. You want that nice car? Ditto! You want that big house? Ditto! You might be surprised how much of better person that journey might make you. It's called character and integrity which by all account, you lack.

To be quite honest, If you really want to get down to the nuts and bolts of this issue imagine this:

Imagine you're king for the day and you make taxes optional. This way, the true "do gooders" could donate all they wish to the Gov't. Those who support the Gov't programs donate what they want, those who don't, DON'T! How well do you think this tax plan will function? If you could do this I think you would be awoken to the reality that not many(probably including yourself) would be giving away their money. NOT GONNA HAPPEN GUY! Therefore, the hypocrisy of your implication of taking more from the ones who are already doing their fair share and then some is a little offensive. Not much, but enough. (Take your stinking paws out of my wallet!)

Look dude, you've got it all wrong. American Gov't should be as limited as possible. It should only help maintain and protect a fair environment in which business' can grow. If you keep putting hurdles up, you foolishly destroy what too many have worked hard and died trying to preserve. In America, we the people decide. Americans choose those whom they believe will best represent them, their beliefs, convictions and vision. Once every 4 years, we're lucky to have the right to vote for whom we wish can best lead this great super power.

Some tried to imply Bush was not even worthy of winning the election in 2000. Gore won the popular vote by 500,000 and most of his supporters screamed that from the mountain tops and planted the seed of illegitimacy. 2 yrs. later, America spoke again and gave Republicans the majority in both houses of congress. Regardless of what was staring them right in the face, democrats insisted on regurgitating the myth of President Bush's illegitimacy. Let's review shall we? He wins a close one in 2000, Demz believe it's just a fluke. There's no way America would disagree w/ them, Right? Then comes 2002 mid-term elections and POW, Republicans clean house. Take congress and governorships. Still, these same OMNISCIENT democrats choose to point blame and invent conspiracy rather than soul search. Finally, 2004 presidential election, President Bush wins the popular vote by almost 4,000,000 (yes, 4 million and counting,,,,still counting absentee votes). President Bush wins the electoral vote. Republicans gain even more seats from both houses of congress and increase even more governorships. America again spoke LOUDLY. Apparently the last 2 times fell upon deaf ears.

Ironically, there are still those who've yet to be successful which keep trying to push their failed propaganda. Why would anyone in their right mind take the advice of 3 time LA-LA-LA,,,,LOOOOOSERS! Apparently, for anyone who's grounded in reality, you must see the major tidal shift in the culture of America. Looks like Americans aren't as dumb as today's democratic party thought they were. The rest of the globe is still drinking the Kerry Kool-Aid, but as of Nov 2nd,,,Kerry WHO??????? The SILENT MAJORITY has again spoken and spoken loudly.

Both Demz and Repz knew the stakes of this election. They both knew w/ Repz controlling congress, a Bush re-election could possibly bring desperately needed conservative change to our Gov't. With Supreme Court Justices expected to retire w/in the next few years (maybe up to 4 Justices), this could mean "quite a bit" don't ya' think? Right now, the 9 judge panel consists of 5 Repz and 4 Demz. President Bush appointing up to 4 Supreme Court Justices(which they will hold for life)? Are you shaking in your boots yet? Don't silly rabbit. Bush is not the NAZI "yo' dying raza" claims he is(Just check your latest election map,,,and good luck finding any BLUE). So, I understand the "dirty trix". I understand why the left chose to attack the man rather than his policy. You again "mis-underestimated" the American people and their value of character, core convictions and principle. Apparently, character does matter. You can't have a record of "liberalism" and FAKE being a conservative come election time. Maybe in the past, but not today, NO WAY.

I guess the good guy does win out at the end.

Well, there's always Canada "eh" ? LOL

For the drama queens threatening to "FLEE" to Canada, by all means,,,GOOD REDDENS.

God Bless America and Pray for our troops.

Class dismissed.

DJ OBBY, aka,,,SUPER "DOOPER" CITIZEN (like you call me).

Amen

If they only took the time to listen to the Country instead of trying to change the way our Country thinks.

[vicman]

Amen

If they only took the time to listen to the Country instead of trying to change the way our Country thinks.

59 million agree with you, 55 million doesnt, another segment aren't old enough to vote and another segment is so pathetic they'd rather sit around watching the latest britney gossip to even go vote.

[vicman]

All I know is, especially out here, people are tired of paying taxes for everyone else who just doesn't feel like working. I finally saved enough money to buy my own house by busting my ass for 4 years and working hard (2 jobs!!!) and saving. Meanwhile, my loser brother is sitting around on welfare just because he doesn't feel like working. I don't think we should all have to pay for his food and health insurance. He needs to put down the x-box and get a job (or 2).

hey well good for you and like your brother there are many more, but not everyone that is unemployed is like that. there are also millions that are underemployed doing things they are overqualified to do because their jobs got shipped overseas.

americans and people who live in the US work hard, overall, but there are lots of people out there that given whatever reason don't have the same luck we all do. you and i, and many on this board are privildged, i mean what do we worry about? work, save some $$$, and look fwd for the wekeend so we can go out and hit the clubs?

taxes pay for a lot much more things than just for stuff for the poor, they make your goverment move. the government is the largest direct and indirect employer of people in this country. whether you work in State, City, Federal govmn't (in the different Dperatments or for the Army, Nany, Marines or Air Force) or work for a govmn't contractor or make a living from businesses that cater to those people that work for the govmn't.

like i mentioned before, our leaedrs need to gauge how much people need to be taxed so we can get the services we need to live good lives and have the stuff we expect to have, while at the same time not get the govmn't into a deficit that will eventually come to haunt us in the long run; and not tax us too much where we are spending a big chunk of our paycheck on taxes.

that is why while govmn't spending has gone way up with the war in iraq, the big tax cuts that the fed. govmn't is giving overall is creating a huge deficit that we will all end up paying for eventually. whether you pay now, or pay later, you'll end up paying anyways.

~~~> on a side note, local taxes in Phoenix helped pay for America West Arena and Bank One Ball Park. Residents in Arlington, TX approved to be taxed more so the Cowboys could have a new 75,000 seat stadium. and if you come to DC in the next 5 to 10 years, expect to pay more in hotel taxes, 'cuz the district is raising taxes to pay for the new baseball stadium for the DC Expo's.

[tres-b]

59 million agree with you, 55 million doesnt, another segment aren't old enough to vote and another segment is so pathetic they'd rather sit around watching the latest britney gossip to even go vote.

The ones sitting around watching MTV shouldnt vote. They dont know their ass from their hand. Of the 55mill not voting for the President, a large majority of them are moderates. These folks could have gone either way and probably arent crushed and bitter about the results.

The Michael Moore's of the world(the left wing extremists) who are socialists and consider Gay Marriage to be the #1 issue of the election are a fringe minority with a loud voice. I dont think it really matters what they think and neither does the President, the Republican Party, or 99.5% of America.

[jtk4]

You are so wrong.

If you take the bible out of this election bush loses mondale style.

Why do you think all those poor people in the south and mid west voted bush? Because of his economic plan?