MoveOn.org ::: Censure Bush

[Guest LunaSea]

i'm not sure if this is the right place to post it... but on the site, www.moveon.org, is massive articles/supported + backed up news facts about bush and the need for congress to censure him bc of his lies re: war w/ iraq, the non-existant weapons of mass distruction.. please take a minute to skim/read thru this and help censure bush by clicking on this link:

http://www.moveon.org/censure/

this is their campaign message.:

Dear MoveOn member,

>

> During the buildup to war, President Bush said the United States "must not ignore the threat gathering against us. Facing clear evidence of peril, we cannot wait for the final proof -- the smoking gun -- that could come in the form of a mushroom cloud....

We have every reason to assume the worst, and we have an urgent duty to prevent the worst from occurring." [1]

On the eve of sending troops into battle, Bush asserted that "Intelligence gathered by this and other governments leaves no doubt that the Iraq regime continues to possess and conceal some of the most lethal weapons ever devised." [2]

Now David Kay, the CIA's chief weapons inspector, has testified before Congress that these weapons do not exist.

In an attempt to evade responsibility for the misleading statements that pushed the nation into war, Bush has announced plans to form an independent inquiry to look into what went wrong. An inquiry would serve the Bush administration well: it would envelop the issue in a fog of uncertainty, deflect blame onto the intelligence

services, and delay any political damage until 2005, after the upcoming election. [3]

But the facts need no clarification. Despite repeated warnings from the CIA and Defense Intelligence Agency, President Bush and his administration hyped and distorted the threat that Iraq posed.

[4] And now that reality is setting in, the President wants to pin the blame on someone else. We can't let him.

Congress has the power to censure the President -- to formally reprimand him for betraying the nation's trust. If ever there was a time for this, it's now. Join our call on Congress to censure President Bush at:

http://www.moveon.org/censure/?id=2313-723053-6DPSzuparP17vvI79m03Iw

It's clear that we've been mislead:

* David Kay said last week, "I'm personally convinced that there were not large stockpiles of newly produced weapons of mass destruction," and "We don't find the people, the documents or the physical plants that you would expect to find if the production was going on." Kay said these things shortly after resigning from his

post as Bush's chief weapons inspector in Iraq. [5]

* Bush, in his 2003 State of the Union address, said, "the British government has learned that Saddam Hussein recently sought significant quantities of uranium from Africa." [6] Yet Ambassador Joe Wilson, who was sent to Niger in February 2002 to determine whether Iraq was trying to purchase uranium materials there, concluded that "intelligence related to Iraq's nuclear weapons program was twisted to exaggerate the Iraqi threat." [7]

* A CIA report in February 2003 said: "We do not have any direct evidence that Iraq has used the period since [1998] to reconstitute its Weapons of Mass Destruction programs." [8]

It's also clear that the misleading was deliberate:

* The respected Carnegie Endowment for International Peace recently found that the administration "systematically misrepresented the threat" from Iraq. [9]

[Guest LunaSea]

* The basis for President Bush's African uranium claim was known at the time to be forged [10] and not credible. "Top White House officials knew that the CIA seriously disputed the claim that Saddam Hussein was seeking uranium in Africa long before the claim was included in Bush's January address to the nation," according to the Washington Post. [11]

* Secretary of State Colin Powell became alarmed at the level of intelligence distortion. When he read the first draft of his speech to the UN -- prepared for Powell by Vice President Dick Cheney's chief of staff -- he was so upset that he lost his temper, throwing several pages in the air and declaring, "I'm not reading this. This is bullsh--." [12]

Our democracy only works when we know the truth. We now know President Bush and his administration deliberately misled Congress and the American people. Censure is the least we should expect in response.

The independent inquiry will need a year or more to come to a conclusion, according to the Bush administration. It took less time than that for the country to go to war. We don't need more investigation, we need accountability, and we need it now.

Join our call on Congress to censure President Bush at:

http://www.moveon.org/censure/?id=2313-723053-6DPSzuparP17vvI79m03Iw

We'll be holding a press conference in Washington on Tuesday, February 10th, announcing our campaign for Censure. If you sign on now, we can count your signature at the press conference. Please sign on right away.

Thank you.

Sincerely,

--Adam, Carrie, Eli, James, Joan, Laura, Noah, Peter, Wes, and Zack

The MoveOn.org Team

Monday, February 9, 2004

[1]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A54353-2004Jan27.html

[2] htp://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2003/03/2000317-7.html

[3]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A3980-2004Feb1.html

[4] An excellent, comprehensive rundown on the Bush

administration's deliberate distortion of intelligence is available at:

http://www.americanprogress.org/site/pp.asp?c=biJRJ8OVF&b=24889

[5]

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/01/26/international/middleeast/26KAY.html

[6]http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2003/01/20030128-19.html

[7] http://www.nytimes.com/2003/07/06/opinion/06WILS.html

Note: Wilson's wife, Valerie Plame, had her CIA cover blown, possibly by the White House, in apparent retaliation for Wilson's contradicting the White House's line on WMDs.

[8] http://msnbc.msn.com/id/3340723/

[9] http://www.ceip.org/files/pdf/Iraq3GuideFind_SummRec.pdf

[10]

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/07/08/international/worldspecial/08PREX.html

[11] http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/news/nation/6362092.htm

[12]

>

http://www.usnews.com/usnews/issue/archive/030609/20030609040506.php

Note: The article with the Powell quote is available for

purchase from the US News & World Report archives for $2.95.

[Guest endymion]

I am happy to see this posted here. I am going to move it to Junkie Chat, I think that this is relevant outside of NYC. Lots of us down in South Beach want to move on as well.

[Guest web_norah]

move on is a cool informative DEMOCRATIC site...werk!

[Guest bcnjunkie]

This war was a mistake and it's just beginning. President Bush began to roll that snowball down a steep long hill. This is just beginning !

One more grand result of the war, two days ago the Euro went up 25% compared to the $

[Guest zacashus]

This war was a mistake and it's just beginning.  President Bush began to roll that snowball down a steep long hill.  This is just beginning !

One more grand result of the war, two days ago the Euro went up 25% compared to the $

i agree w/ that, however i gotta say that i'm glad sadaam is out of power and iraq can be a free and democratic nation. (lets hope it sticks) sadaam def. needed to be put down and the iraqi people deserve the same freedoms that are shared over the rest of this great world. however, i don't agree w/ our gov't manipulating the american people to believe that this was the reason why we were going into that country and not some ulterior motive (i.e. oil). the morality card that is played by our gov't on our people to rally support sickens me. .... if we really practiced what we preached we would be doing away w/ alot of wrongs that are occuring all over this planet. If we want to send a moral message to the rest of the world we must be consistent..... and we are NOT! This is why the rest of the world has a slanted view of our gov't and society. AND IT'S NOT THE AMERICAN PUBLIC'S FAULT!!!! this really upsets me. ...... but i guess we have to start somewhere... i only hope that this will change.

[Guest bcnjunkie]

zacashus:

One great thing about this country is that it's made up of so many cultures and we've been forced to get along with each other. In Miami alone I've had the opportunity to work side-by-side and meet so many different people of different cultures, ethnic and religious backgrounds with difeerent political views. For the most part I think people here have no choice but to try and get along. I think you make an excellent point that sometimes the rest of the world has a slanted view of the US and found most people that critize it, haven't had the opportunity to really get to know it. I do think that sometimes our goverment uses the "freedom fighters" campaign as a mask for a hidden agenda (such as in Iraq). I think that because of our sense of pride, sometimes it clouds the fact that our goverment does alot of (for a lack of a better expression) f****d up things around the world (which my friends in the midwest have a hard time believing. But alot of times it doesn't reflect the attitude of the American people who are generous and hospitable

[Guest endymion]

A huge part of the problem is that people who think like we do tend to not vote.  Bush wasn't elected in the first place, but if the 18-30 age demographic were as easy to mobilize as the churgoing crowd then 2000 would have turned out differently and we wouldn't have been counting hanging chads.

The Rock the Vote people are trying as hard as they can to get people our age to remember that it's 18 to vote, not 30.

That war pretty much did it for me as far as the next presidential election goes.  No way to explain that one away.  "No soup for you, NEXT!!"

[Artemis1414777738]

The fact that we have a president that uses his position to push a personal and business agenda as opposed to one that is centered on the citizens of this country as a whole, shows that we have become largely apathetic when it comes to politics.

Hmmm... Bush is republican. Congress is controlled by republicans. Exactly how much censure do these people really believe is going to occur?

[ryan2772]

tech you make a great point: most people that share our train of thought don't vote. it's freakin ridiculous how many of my friends didn't vote in 2000, and it really pissed me off. and now, there's another chance to change things, and we all have to do our part. i get more and more paranoid every day about the way our government runs things completely independent of public involvement. a few notes of concern for me: 1st john ashcroft scares the freakin crap out of me. in fact, it wouldn't surprise me that one of his cronies is reading this post right now! 2nd it was revealed that g. dubbya doesn't read the newspaper. ARE YOU KIDDING ME??? there is just soooo much that is wrong with that. 3rd this FCC mierda is getting entirely way out of hand. every day it's getting worse, all in the guise of "protecting our kids". blech. makes me sick. it's so sad to me that there are only 2 political parties in this country, and no realistic room for anything else. but i choose the lesser of the two evils. i'll make my voice heard in november, and you bastards better make your voices heard, too!!!! ;D

[Guest web_norah]

i'd love to enter this debate but politics and religion are 2 things i will gladly stay away from

but in regards to the war, i feel it was wrong and a career move for GWB more than his conviction of liberating people from Saddam and an oil -economics interest..if Bush really cared, he would have helped Venezuela or Argentina during their political crisis, for example.....i dont feel he has any sympathy for the soldiers and people who fight on a daily basis ...and the whole aircraft carrier manuever and cutting the turkey on thanksgiving in the warzone (disgusting and poor taste!)........

if you go outside this country, it is astounding how other people view the American savior antics.....not for anything Bush was egged in London (i wish i could have witnessed the protests)....and now Brazil photographs americans that enter their territory.....a taste of our own poison!

[Guest endymion]

The fact that we have a president that uses his position to push a personal and business agenda as opposed to one that is centered on the citizens of this country as a whole, shows that we have become largely apathetic when it comes to politics.

Wow, yes, that pretty much nails it. That simultaneously explains my feelings for Our Fearless Leader and his henchmen, and the sad statement that it makes about us that we let this happen.

I have a feeling that this whole thread isn't really going to get all that interesting because we all seem to pretty much agree on what's wrong. We should maybe look into what we can do to push in a sane direction. The Rock The Vote guys feel strongly about it that they are bringing PVD to Space just to get peoples' attention. If everybody here does them a favor by taking a few minutes to just glance over their web site then something positive just came out of this. I'm going to go and update my voter registration and then tell as many people as I can all about how to go about doing that. The only boldfaced title in the entire CoolJunkie List of WMC events is "ROCK THE VOTE", there is a reason for that. They got that one free...

And Apotheosis, Ashcroft really does have a new Homeland Security department office that does nothing but archive Internet forums looking for counter-revolutionary behavior. After that DEA Space raid you might as well just assume that you're in their database just for posting here. There's a blinking file at the FBI somewhere that says that some "Apotheosis" guy in Miami called him "dubya" again.

Is anybody else disappointed that our alternative choise is going to be Kerry? At first I thought I didn't like him because he was ugly but I have done a bunch of research and now I'm past that. Now I don't like him because he's just a pillar of mediocrity. There's just nothing there worth getting excited about. I'm excited by nothing other than removing Bush. I seriously want President Blow Job back.

[Guest JMT]

what simple-minded and one dimensional thinking.

i for one dont have any problems with Bush. people who dont like it can plant one between my pockets.

[ryan2772]

what simple-minded and one dimensional thinking.

i for one dont have any problems with Bush.  people  who dont like it can plant one between my pockets.

Opinions are like assholes......

Just vote, man, that's the point.

[Guest endymion]

JMT's attitude pretty much mirrors that of Our Fearless Leader himself.

'You don't like me starting wars and killing people and running the economy into the ground for my own business purposes? Yeah, well I can bomb anybody in the world off of the map by waving my hand. Bite me.'

[Guest JMT]

so yeah, the world is minus one insane dictator, responsible for the deaths of at least 300,000 people. if the UN had any balls they would have acted on their years of empty threats inacted after the first Gulf War. and aside from a very small faction of militants, the US was received as liberators by the Iraqi people. Now all these countries that didnt back us, want the billion dollar reconstruction contracts that would help boost our economy.

alan greenspan has more control over the economy in his left nut then any president does. blame him for the economy. anyone who knows basic macro economics knows the economy is cylical, trends that are happening today were seeded years ago. but its been on the upswing for months. and the DOW and S&P's 500 has been cruising as well.

a bigger threat is the recent trend for large corporations to move lower-level white collar job positions overseas. mirroring the blue-collar factory outsourcing during the late 80's early 90's. something needs to be done about that. its getting worse all the time.

[Guest JMT]

if anyone feels the economy is so bad due to Bush, go ahead and send back your last 2 tax refund increases.

[Artemis1414777738]

so yeah, the world is minus one insane dictator, responsible for the deaths of at least 300,000 people...snip...

Fidel Castro would have been closer, less expensive to overthrow and has done more to harm this country than Saddam Hussein on his worst day. Fidel aside, there are far more "evil" dictators around if Bush is feeling so righteously philanthropic..

...snip...

alan greenspan has more control over the economy in his left nut then any president does.  blame him for the economy.  anyone who knows basic macro economics   knows the economy is cylical, trends that are happening today were seeded years ago.  but its been on the upswing for months.  and the DOW and S&P's 500 has been cruising as well.  

Yes, but there is this little thing called "consumer confidence" which drives both investment and short term spending trends. Put a president in place that most people did not vote for, who starts wars abroad over unsubstantiated claims and submits to congress a 2005 fiscal budget that includes an 11% increase to his own department and guess what? People start to hold on to their money in hopes of preparing for the worst.

Take a look at the national deficit over the last 10 years:

1994 -203.2

1995 -164.0

1996 -107.5

1997 -22.0

1998 69.2

1999 125.6

2000 236.4

2001 127.4

2002 -157.8

2003 -375.3

2004 (estimate) -520.7

2005 (proposed) -363.6

Notice that the years we became cash flow positive were the result of and during the Clinton years. Bush comes in and our net revenue starts to quickly go south (prior to 9/11/2001, so let's not use terrorism as the excuse). If you still think Greenspan has so much power over the economy, your ignoring the obvious...

a bigger threat is the recent trend for large corporations to move lower-level white collar job positions overseas.  mirroring the blue-collar factory outsourcing during the late 80's early 90's.  something needs to be done about that.  its getting worse all the time.  

agreed....

[Guest JMT]

i dont think Castro is responsible for nearly as many deaths as Sadaam. Did Castro gas the Kurds too?

i am curious to know where you can get those figures. The national deficit is very debated and a lot of people say the historic numbers tell ecominists that it means very little. But anyway, analysts think the recent years figures and the projections are "high-balled" to make the real ones look more improved, even Morgan Stanley. but more importantly is what percentage of the national economy is the deficit? its only 3.5%, which is not bad at all. After the biggest 3rd quarter growth in 20 years, our GDP avergared 7% growth. and there was a 6.6% increase in concumer spending. things are getting better.

If we felt like having our taxes raised to the rates of most of european countries, we could wipe out all national debt as well poverty in the US.

[Guest JMT]

recesions move in slow, gradual trends, change doesnt happen over night.

and i just saw that the "consumer confidence" is up 5.1 points for January and the U.S. leading index indicator is up .02%.

[Artemis1414777738]

i dont think Castro is responsible for nearly as many deaths as Sadaam.  Did Castro gas the Kurds too?

I never mentioned Castro killing as many as Saddam. Neither you nor I know exactly how many deaths either of these two dictators are accountable for. What I mention was that Castro was responsible for much more damage to this country than Saddam. Take a look around Miami during the 80's, 90's even now...

 

i am curious to know where you can get those figures.  The national deficit is very debated and a lot of people say the historic numbers tell ecominists that it means very little.

Those numbers were copied from usinfo.state.gov, the US Department of State website. Saying that the national deficit "means very little" is like having your own business and saying that your operating cash flow (bottom line) doesn't mean a thing. The "lot of people" you refer to must be Bush supporters, which is odd since I thought republicans were financially conservative (which I am).

 But anyway, analysts think the recent years figures and the projections are "high-balled" to make the real ones look more improved, even Morgan Stanley.  but more importantly is what percentage of the national economy is the deficit?  its only 3.5%, which is not bad at all.  After the biggest 3rd quarter growth in 20 years, our GDP avergared 7% growth.  and there was a 6.6% increase in concumer spending.  things are getting better.

Again, those figures came from the Department of State. Your not saying our own government would lie to us are you?

There is no "percentage of the economy" used to calculate the deficit. It's very simple really, the Executive branch submits to Congress a fiscal budget for each of the four years they are in power. This budget is compared to the expected revenue generated by the US government (ie.. taxes and such). The net result will either be a positive (profit) or negative (deficit) number.

Those precious "tax cuts" you refer to were essentially "loans" intended to raise consumer confidence by the administration. A desperate move to be sure. Unfortunately, these cuts contributed to the deficit and now we have lost many of the more lenient tax laws for 2004 for the sake of driving up revenue against this same deficit.

Think of Bush's financial sense explained by way of Popeye's non-vegan pal Wimpy:

"I will gladly pay you Tuesday for a hamburger today."

And Tuesday is fast approaching...

[Guest JMT]

if Iraq was 90 miles away, im sure we would have seen just as many refugees. Maybe some day we will get video tapes of Castro throwing people off buildings, or hear about his sons raping women at their leisure.

it does mean every little. its a fact. if Bush felt like closing a dozen or 2 military bases like Clinton, im sure he could lower it. the economy started to decline do to the hyper-inflated prices of the tech stocks. the dot-com crash was timing. 9/11 didnt help either. the tax cuts did help, there is no reason to say they didnt since the numbers show improvement. we will see what happens this year very soon.

The deficit projections were overstated, per Morgan Stanley's chief analysts.

and yes, the percentage of the deficit to GDP is a HUGE indicator of what is really going on in the economy.

[Guest JMT]

sidenote: Matt Drudge has reported that Kerry has been hiding a 2 year affair with a young intern. if the story catches fire, it could spell serious trouble for his campaign.

[Guest web_norah]

i am bummed out that Howard Dean is out of the race :'(

[Guest JMT]

no, after word of this spread, Dean decided to stay in.