Miami = Big City , But does it live upto Big City Life ?

[Guest DJ Nova]

I visit and read about other cities music scene , and Miami's scene barely compares ....why ? Because Miami doesn't see alot of the talent (all kinds of music) that other metropolitan cities get to enjoy . I mean , I'm not trying to complain ...just understand.....why we get the same artists to visit constantly , as if no other artists even exist , and to the uneducated listener ...guess what they don't exist . I'm talking about artists like :

Antibalas , Carl Craig , Dave Clarke , Richie Hawtin , The Reefermen , John Arnold , Larry Heard , Magda , Steve Bug , Mathew Herbert , Sven Vath , Ricardo Villalobos , Francois K. , and the list goes on ......I mean seriously alot of the djs that frequent Miami are good , but there are SOOO many more !!

I guess more than anything I'm wondering where the days of being excited about goin to see somebody that's really doing something special with music have gone .

Is anyone with me ? Doesn anyone still care about music and quality of it ? I f so , please email me privately . But Please anyone feel free to discuss this topic openly .

[Guest JoeBudious]

Mr Nova, what's up man!!!

I feel we bring tons of talent to our events. In the past and upcoming months we have or will bring Dixon, Miguel Migs, Q Burns, Rich Medina, Jay J, Nickodemus, Charles Webster, Marques Wyatt, Osunlade, Louie Vega . . .

It may not be the ones you listed, but we feel they are great!!

I'd love to bring herbert but it would in no way even be close to breaking even financially. Francois K has been in conversation with us for years, it comes down to how much can one pay vs. how much money can be recouped. Larry Heard (the man( , same situation, etc., etc.

At the end of the day it comes down to who wants to put money up for whom. If I found a very rich person that had money to blow for fun only purposes, I'd have a list 60 names long for my wish list.

I feel you, its kinda a bummer at times.

We do what we can and its been 5 years now. That's all one should be asked to do. What he/she can.

So when someone brings good talent from afar, we all need to support it as best we can. That's all we can do.

Nova, I havn't seen you in a while homes. Maybe for our 5 year I'll see you?

Peace all,

Joe Budious

p.s. If someone has cash to burn, Herbert would be SOOOOOOOOOOO DOPE!!!!!!!!

[Guest ramon]

i agree completely nelson .. we could definitely use some variety in this city. it's tough, but i think it will catch on.

last week it was really amazing to hear mark farina .. it had been ages since i had that much fun ... it's always nice to hear something different and unfortunately those nights come too rarely these days.

i really think carl would do really well here .. his fabric 25 disc is going to open him up to a new audience i think. i really think we need a little more detroit in miami a little more chicago a little more new york .. you get the picture .. the us of a is a big country with loads of dj's who play diverse styles.

i really think miami needs more options and i think people want them its just hard to find a place to make it all happen.

very intrested to see what other people think about this.

[240turbo]

I wholeheartedly agree.... What pisses me off sometimes is that some guest DJ's that finally come and play here actually alter their sound just for the miami crowds. ???

[Guest skywalker01]

I visit and read about other cities music scene , and Miami's scene barely compares ..

that's a strong statement. which cities are you speaking of? i think miami is very lucky to get the talent it gets compared to most of america. and i agree that ultimately it boils down to being able to turn a profit (even breaking even on occasion) could miami do better? probably. but it's still a helluva lot better than most of the country imo.

[Guest pod]

Here we go again.

I swear, Mayor Diaz should put me on payroll for this shit.

It all comes down to what people want.

Miami is not Detroit. (thank god)

Miami is not New York.

Miami is not New Jersey.

Miami is not Los Angeles.

Miami is not Las Vegas.

Miami is not Chicago.

Miami is Miami. Frankly I'm glad to be here and I can think of a lot worse places to be. Sure the hurricanes suck and so forth, but no matter where you live there's issues. It's cold in New York. You'll get shot in Detroit. You'll get gang-raped by a cult in Los Angeles...you get my point.

As far as the music? Well we live in a city where the dance music scene is club - driven rather than DJ or promoter driven. The owner, be it LP, Ken Smith, Eric Milon, or Amika Kenny, is king. The owner treats his club like a business, which it is. He relies on his music director and marketing director to figure out which talent to book, and like Joe said, figure out the cost of booking vs the potential to earn it back. Joe's done this for awhile kids, pay attention.

The trainspotting crowd has to realize that first and foremost. A club is a business. You wanna hear "your" music, fire up Winamp or open your own club. If you can make it work with the sounds you like, I applaud you. I've seen too many clubs flop on the premise of providing a venue for the "music crowd". You know the clubs as well as I do.

The DJs you mention are great...if you're a "music head" or trainspotter. Frankly, I wouldn't book any of them in this town except for maybe Francois K. I wouldn't get my money back. Even though the DJs you mentioned are "unknown", they aren't cheap. Richie is very expensive, as you well know. There's no "market" for his sound down here, so I'd be out quite a bit of money at the end of the night. Not fun when you've got 50 or more people under you depending on your ability to make payroll that week. Clubs have to think about a lot of things like that. Sure you could do a one-off event, but still, you'd be out a lot of cash.

Another thing I've noticed is the tendency for DJs and performers playing more obscure sounds is their tendency to try and educate the crowd. The Miami crowd doesn't want to be educated. They go out to be seen, have fun, get drunk, fuck, rinse and repeat. The soundtrack has to match that. A lot of DJs forget that their purpose first and foremost is as an entertainer. Deep Dish isn't pulling 20+ grand per gig "educating" the crowd. Like any good DJ they read the crowd and figure out what to play. You can "educate" the crowd, but not by ramming things down their throat. Look what Oscar does. He plays the sounds people wanna hear, and occasionally throws in a well-placed techno bomb. The crowd likes it, but that doesn't mean their gonna go for six hours of it. I like Kraft Mac N Cheese but I won't eat it five nights a week even though it's the only thing I can cook.

But anyway, I think I went off on a tangent. We've got it pretty damn good here, and I wouldn't trade it for anything.

[Guest colione98]

I visit and read about other cities music scene , and Miami's scene barely compares ..

Although Miami is a great city and brings a lot of diversity, one must not forget that it is still down south and with that includes the warmth mental state towards the community....

Just naturally, the mentality in general will not be of the same as in other metro areas....

That may be the reason why you have many local talent(great talent at that) that has come about in yesterdays rain and is now currently residenting in 2-3 super clubs... That in my opion, no matter how great the talent is detrimental to the scene....

Why, because it creates a particular sound for that area in which does not allow for other sounds to be embraced because there is a large quantity of regulars..........

There is a sense of togetherness is this community which I think may affect the intervention from others.....

I reality, there should not be a miami sound..........

the kid...

[Guest pod]

Every city has it's "sound" if you think about it.

[Guest colione98]

Here we go again.

The Miami crowd doesn't want to be educated. They go out to be seen, have fun, get drunk, fuck, rinse and repeat. .

the formula to that equation is not complete.... it goes against proper form of being entertained...

[Guest colione98]

Every city has it's "sound" if you think about it.

Appreciate the argument...

but relatively speaking, miami shoud be less selective in wich in in time I think, would allow for more diversity in terms of bookings and so forth...

How you?

[Guest DJ Nova]

The Miami crowd doesn't want to be educated. They go out to be seen, have fun, get drunk, fuck, rinse and repeat. The soundtrack has to match that. A lot of DJs forget that their purpose first and foremost is as an entertainer.

actually first and foremost , djs are NOT just entertainers they are and have always been the people to "Break" new records in , and this goes back to the first DJ who used to play jazz records on community radio . Secondly , I think it's messed up that you talk about Miami Like there's NO people that honestly just like to go out for the music and not just to "fuck" . Don't underestimate Miami either .

This is not a STAB at anyone by Me , just a discussion .

[Guest skywalker01]

which cities are you comparing miami to?

[Guest pod]

Buddy, I'm out there three or four nights a week. Sidebar: If you want "your sounds" to get out in this town, go out and mingle. I know plenty of DJs and producers who do just that. I don't care if you bought your first Pioneer and pair of 1200s yesterday, or you've been rocking dancefloors since before I was old enough to buy porn legally...you gotta be visible, you gotta promote. The shittiest DJ in town can get a gig by doing that. But anyway...

Believe me, you music heads are waaaaay outnumbered. I'm glad you disagree with me completely too. I may not be the jaded industry veteran you are, but I'm not some fresh-off-the-plane jackass from Ohio, either...in other words, I do know a thing or two. I've seen the back-end operations of every major club in town for the past five years, and I have a good idea of how it works around here. Instead of bitching and moaning, I've used my contacts from time to time to get things that I need.

I'd love to see more musical diversity, but it isn't something you can just do on a lark. A club has to plan this sort of thing out. Even non-music heads are sensitive to the music, if you get my drift. They may not know the tracks by name, but they know what sound they want to hear. Most people are content to be in the comfort zone of familiar tunes and sounds. A DJ can break new tracks here, but it usually doesn't deviate from his or her signature style. Again, the club owner is king and will beat down a DJ who clears the room. I know I would.

You're only as good as your last night, and if my last night sucked, that isn't a good thing at all.

For every one trainspotter there is about 100 people who don't give a shit either way. To each his own though. I don't begrudge trainspotters their hobby. Hell, I carry a fucking three-pound chunk of glass, steel, and silicon around with me in a club. That's pretty oddball too.

[Guest colione98]

P0d, you bring about some very argumentive statements...

We'll have to wait until sunday evening to continue this discussion.... when everyone else has risen from the dead... but for now, you have laid the cement...

[Guest Tru1]

POD

"I may not be the jaded industry veteran you are, but I'm not some fresh-off-the-plane jackass from Ohio, either"

Come on bro, I agree with everything you said but why did you have to bring Ohio into it. OSU beat Michigan Yesterday, The Brown's stomped on the Dolphins today, I'd have to say it was a pretty good week for Ohio!

And as you know, I devoted better than four years of my life importing world class DJ's and nightlife into Ohio. When I brought in Oakey in 2001 people drove 12 hours TO OHIO for nightlife!!!

Please, next time you need to feature a lame midwestern state, use Iowa, or Nebraska, or Missouri.

You owe me a beer!

;D

[Guest DJSkeemWestchesta]

I am one that would also much rather put my efforts forth into bringing some of those so-called "lesser known DJs" than the crap we are forced to swallow week in, week out. With the exception of a few, most of these Nico whatevers do know even deserve to be in the same breath as some of those people we mention and are definitely not worth paying $50 to go see. It is very stupid to think that these club owners are not making more than their share, especially when they charging people $5 for a cup of coke on ice. It is a vicious cycle we are all victims of here and the major problem we face is that we are blinded by their marketing and brightly colored flyers.

Pod, next time I see you out in the streets, I'd like to meet you because you seem to be the biggest pimp in the nation. I have a friend that works for Ocean Drive who would love to do a story on such a stud. I could only dream of spending my hard earned cash on the shallow and materialistic and sleep around as much as it seems that you do. Perhaps, if I were so lucky, I'd not care about anything when I go out either.

[Bling]

I visit and read about other cities music scene , and Miami's scene barely compares ....why ? Because Miami doesn't see alot of the talent (all kinds of music) that other metropolitan cities get to enjoy . I mean , I'm not trying to complain ...just understand.....why we get the same artists to visit constantly , as if no other artists even exist , and to the uneducated listener ...guess what they don't exist . I'm talking about artists like :

Antibalas , Carl Craig , Dave Clarke , Richie Hawtin , The Reefermen , John Arnold , Larry Heard , Magda , Steve Bug , Mathew Herbert , Sven Vath , Ricardo Villalobos , Francois K. , and the list goes on ......I mean seriously alot of the djs that frequent Miami are good , but there are SOOO many more !!

I guess more than anything I'm wondering where the days of being excited about goin to see somebody that's really doing something special with music have gone .

Is anyone with me ? Doesn anyone still care about music and quality of it ? I f so , please email me privately . But Please anyone feel free to discuss this topic openly .

francois k 8) damn i want to see this guy spin down here

[Guest pod]

Umm I never claimed to sleep around? Shit, I have to beg or pay for it, just like you. We can smell our own.

I don't make the rules in Miami, I exist around them. In an age of chimpanzees I'm a monkey. It's profit-driven around here. Ask your "friend" in Ocean Drive. Tell her to tell Mark that Dan says hello and thank you.

[Guest saintjohn]

This thread is reminding me of a Soul Coughing song:

They call me Mister Bitterness . . .

[Guest pod]

Say no more John. It reeks of such in here.

[Guest deejay]

It's funny....I just registered with this forum and posted about being new to Jacksonville from Los Angeles. I've been to some great parties and events since 91'. And now I find myself in Jacksonville where the parties I go to are just rooms filled with bored kids drinking alcohol. No vibe...no dancing...no nothing...You people ought to realize that you come from a place that is respected and hailed for its scene. We love Florida out in Cali...you guys have a different style of breaks than we do...and when I had an opportunity to move to Florida ...I jumped on it. The only problem was that I didn't realize that where I was moving to had....NO scene(well that is not completely true...I saw DJ Dan a few months ago and AK 1200 is coming in a week or so). Do you see my point? When DJ Dan comes to town, I get all excited like it was the first time I ever went out to a party. That really only happens because there is nothing else really for me to choose from. I am considering moving to Miami from Jacksonville but not because it's in Florida or convenient. I could move anywhere that I like. But I think that Miami may be one of the more special places to be a part of. Try living in Jax for about a year and if you haven't killed yourself, you'd move back there in a flash! You do have a lot to choose from down there and even if that's all that you have, you are rich from where I stand. Enjoy the artists that are there now...anything could happen tomarrow.

[Guest JMT]

Here we go again.

I swear, Mayor Diaz should put me on payroll for this shit.

It all comes down to what people want.

Miami is not Detroit. (thank god)

Miami is not New York.

Miami is not New Jersey.

Miami is not Los Angeles.

Miami is not Las Vegas.

Miami is not Chicago.

Miami is Miami. Frankly I'm glad to be here and I can think of a lot worse places to be. Sure the hurricanes suck and so forth, but no matter where you live there's issues. It's cold in New York. You'll get shot in Detroit. You'll get gang-raped by a cult in Los Angeles...you get my point.

As far as the music? Well we live in a city where the dance music scene is club - driven rather than DJ or promoter driven. The owner, be it LP, Ken Smith, Eric Milon, or Amika Kenny, is king. The owner treats his club like a business, which it is. He relies on his music director and marketing director to figure out which talent to book, and like Joe said, figure out the cost of booking vs the potential to earn it back. Joe's done this for awhile kids, pay attention.

The trainspotting crowd has to realize that first and foremost. A club is a business. You wanna hear "your" music, fire up Winamp or open your own club. If you can make it work with the sounds you like, I applaud you. I've seen too many clubs flop on the premise of providing a venue for the "music crowd". You know the clubs as well as I do.

The DJs you mention are great...if you're a "music head" or trainspotter. Frankly, I wouldn't book any of them in this town except for maybe Francois K. I wouldn't get my money back. Even though the DJs you mentioned are "unknown", they aren't cheap. Richie is very expensive, as you well know. There's no "market" for his sound down here, so I'd be out quite a bit of money at the end of the night. Not fun when you've got 50 or more people under you depending on your ability to make payroll that week. Clubs have to think about a lot of things like that. Sure you could do a one-off event, but still, you'd be out a lot of cash.

Another thing I've noticed is the tendency for DJs and performers playing more obscure sounds is their tendency to try and educate the crowd. The Miami crowd doesn't want to be educated. They go out to be seen, have fun, get drunk, fuck, rinse and repeat. The soundtrack has to match that. A lot of DJs forget that their purpose first and foremost is as an entertainer. Deep Dish isn't pulling 20+ grand per gig "educating" the crowd. Like any good DJ they read the crowd and figure out what to play. You can "educate" the crowd, but not by ramming things down their throat. Look what Oscar does. He plays the sounds people wanna hear, and occasionally throws in a well-placed techno bomb. The crowd likes it, but that doesn't mean their gonna go for six hours of it. I like Kraft Mac N Cheese but I won't eat it five nights a week even though it's the only thing I can cook.

you really need to make this a 'sticky'.

[Guest saintjohn]

How about making new users read it before they can complete the CoolJunkie registration process?

[Guest deejay]

I guess that I missed something..enlighten me...sorry for being new...sheesh

[Guest saintjohn]

deejay, that certainly wasn't directed at you - sorry for any confusion. I enjoyed reading your Jax post, and your comments in this thread have been interesting, too.

Like you, I think everyone should try to appreciate what they've got. If there are things people don't like about a particular music scene, they should try to make it better, move to another city, or just deal with it.