Bang Music Festival!!! Miami, FL Nov. 11, 2006

[V. Barbarino]

LiquidX

The fucking problem with our scene and one of the reasons why it is shrinking is the very underground nature that it comes from. Any time an artist gets too successful it suddenly becomes "cool" for all of the trendsetters to start hating on that artist. Look at Oakenfold, tiesto, even Morillo now. As soon as they hit it big, the trendsetters who helped get them there (many of whom reside on CJ) start hating on them.

Now look at rock, or rap, or fucking polka for that matter. Their fans support and continue to support the artists the more successful they get. Look at U2. Do you think their core fans abondoned them when they started having commercial success...no...they embraced them, and bragged about how they were fans with them since way back when.

That is why our scene will never be the dominant one in mainstream.

That is why it pisses me off when I see people on this site hate on some of the people who helped create the scene that they enjoy so much.

Just my .02...but it happens to be the truth.

Many of the people on this site that complain about things going downhill are the very reason why they are.

THINK ABOUT IT

Whether you are right or wrong doesn't matter in terms of the over all health of edm music. It's fan base is shrinking for one reason and on reason only. EDM fans are getting older while the younger kids are not replacing us.

[Guest spacecadet]

LiquidX

The fucking problem with our scene and one of the reasons why it is shrinking is the very underground nature that it comes from. Any time an artist gets too successful it suddenly becomes "cool" for all of the trendsetters to start hating on that artist. Look at Oakenfold, tiesto, even Morillo now. As soon as they hit it big, the trendsetters who helped get them there (many of whom reside on CJ) start hating on them.

Now look at rock, or rap, or fucking polka for that matter. Their fans support and continue to support the artists the more successful they get. Look at U2. Do you think their core fans abondoned them when they started having commercial success...no...they embraced them, and bragged about how they were fans with them since way back when.

That is why our scene will never be the dominant one in mainstream.

That is why it pisses me off when I see people on this site hate on some of the people who helped create the scene that they enjoy so much.

Just my .02...but it happens to be the truth.

Many of the people on this site that complain about things going downhill are the very reason why they are.

THINK ABOUT IT

Whether you are right or wrong doesn't matter in terms of the over all health of edm music. It's fan base is shrinking for one reason and on reason only. EDM fans are getting older while the younger kids are not replacing us.

Yea saw allllll those older crowd at Ultra gues EDM is not getting replaced by the younger crowd :

[Guest Hateraid]

well damm i hope this party will be better than last years bust !!!! ;D ;D ;D ;D

[Guest lyrik]

What does it take for people to get it...all Nick is saying is that the fan base for EDM is aging at a more rapid pace as compared to the amount of younger people replacing them…its true…not hate. You can argue all you want about the “scene†the fact IS its shrinking…NOT GONE….but getting smaller.

[Guest spacecadet]

From what i see there are more events they are now bigger now then back in the days and more clubs play EDM than back in the days sooooo I dont know how you can its getting smaller. Just Music has changed a bit but still electronic music

[Guest lyrik]

From what i see there are more events they are now bigger now then back in the days and more clubs play EDM than back in the days sooooo I dont know how you can its getting smaller. Just Music has changed a bit but still electronic music

Were you around in the scene 10 years ago or more specifically at its height in the mid-late 90's? The scene is smaller you cannot take it now and judge it as whole unless you consider all the areas it is and was in. Space and these one-off festivals are a small microcosm or what the scene use to be…but if you look in almost any place where the scene had blown up in the past it is no where near its prevalence as it was in the late nineties there are many factors why. Nick is correct its an aging core - not enough turnover by the youngsters...rave acts/laws (crack house laws)...the scene when it was at its peak was not just about clubs and a festival here and there…there were tons of one-off events (raves) being held everywhere from Davenport IA...to the deserts of Nevada...not just once or twice a month but 3-4 times a week...its was a movement and that movement has since quelled into what we have today a more formalized version of the scene as we use to know it. Sure space always goes off…what about all the other clubs in town…or lets look at alternative events...parties or what people try to pass off as modern day raves…are they occurring more frequently or at the pace they use to? Nope…and if you attend them you would see the numbers…5 or 6 of those type events here and there over the course of a couple months [and I’m being generous] that draw maybe a hundred kids or so is not an increasing scene when the number use to be 4-5 events a week taking that 100 and multiplying it times 5-10. Yes there is that “one-off†event that does well and you’ll see numbers etc…but it’s exactly what it is…a one-off. There use to be at least one of these festivals occurring at the very least once a month somewhere in the US (not to mention over-seas but for the sake of argument let’s keep it US) 10 years ago and you would be hard pressed to see them in the fashion they are being pushed today (i.e. mixing rock bands with EDM).

[Guest Adam Singer]

From what i see there are more events they are now bigger now then back in the days and more clubs play EDM than back in the days sooooo I dont know how you can its getting smaller. Just Music has changed a bit but still electronic music

Were you around in the scene 10 years ago or more specifically at its height in the mid-late 90's? The scene is smaller you cannot take it now and judge it as whole unless you consider all the areas it is and was in. Space and these one-off festivals are a small microcosm or what the scene use to be…but if you look in almost any place where the scene had blown up in the past it is no where near its prevalence as it was in the late nineties there are many factors why. Nick is correct its an aging core - not enough turnover by the youngsters...rave acts/laws (crack house laws)...the scene when it was at its peak was not just about clubs and a festival here and there…there were tons of one-off events (raves) being held everywhere from Davenport IA...to the deserts of Nevada...not just once or twice a month but 3-4 times a week...its was a movement and that movement has since quelled into what we have today a more formalized version of the scene as we use to know it. Sure space always goes off…what about all the other clubs in town…or lets look at alternative events...parties or what people try to pass off as modern day raves…are they occurring more frequently or at the pace they use to? Nope…and if you attend them you would see the numbers…5 or 6 of those type events here and there over the course of a couple months [and I’m being generous] that draw maybe a hundred kids or so is not an increasing scene when the number use to be 4-5 events a week taking that 100 and multiplying it times 5-10. Yes there is that “one-off†event that does well and you’ll see numbers etc…but it’s exactly what it is…a one-off. There use to be at least one of these festivals occurring at the very least once a month somewhere in the US (not to mention over-seas but for the sake of argument let’s keep it US) 10 years ago and you would be hard pressed to see them in the fashion they are being pushed today (i.e. mixing rock bands with EDM).

well said!

please make paragraphs in the future though!

[Guest lyrik]

From what i see there are more events they are now bigger now then back in the days and more clubs play EDM than back in the days sooooo I dont know how you can its getting smaller. Just Music has changed a bit but still electronic music

Were you around in the scene 10 years ago or more specifically at its height in the mid-late 90's? The scene is smaller you cannot take it now and judge it as whole unless you consider all the areas it is and was in. Space and these one-off festivals are a small microcosm or what the scene use to be…but if you look in almost any place where the scene had blown up in the past it is no where near its prevalence as it was in the late nineties there are many factors why. Nick is correct its an aging core - not enough turnover by the youngsters...rave acts/laws (crack house laws)...the scene when it was at its peak was not just about clubs and a festival here and there…there were tons of one-off events (raves) being held everywhere from Davenport IA...to the deserts of Nevada...not just once or twice a month but 3-4 times a week...its was a movement and that movement has since quelled into what we have today a more formalized version of the scene as we use to know it. Sure space always goes off…what about all the other clubs in town…or lets look at alternative events...parties or what people try to pass off as modern day raves…are they occurring more frequently or at the pace they use to? Nope…and if you attend them you would see the numbers…5 or 6 of those type events here and there over the course of a couple months [and I’m being generous] that draw maybe a hundred kids or so is not an increasing scene when the number use to be 4-5 events a week taking that 100 and multiplying it times 5-10. Yes there is that “one-off†event that does well and you’ll see numbers etc…but it’s exactly what it is…a one-off. There use to be at least one of these festivals occurring at the very least once a month somewhere in the US (not to mention over-seas but for the sake of argument let’s keep it US) 10 years ago and you would be hard pressed to see them in the fashion they are being pushed today (i.e. mixing rock bands with EDM).

well said!

please make paragraphs in the future though!

NO god damnit! You're lucky I at least spell checked!

[V. Barbarino]

From what i see there are more events they are now bigger now then back in the days and more clubs play EDM than back in the days sooooo I dont know how you can its getting smaller. Just Music has changed a bit but still electronic music

Kids these days.. There was a time Scribbles would throw down some house on The Grind, these days unless you pay for XM or Sirus you can't listen to edm music unless you have an Ipod. If EDM was popular you would see it everywhere but you don't, why? The festivals have little to do with the actual music, it's more about the event and entertainement and the "something to do" factor is a huge part of their success. Actually since most festivals loose money, UMF, GG, Bang, there is not much success.

Look for a merger in festivals.. wink wink

[Guest pod]

Festivals definitely need a 'to-do' factor. I remember back when I was a kid, Lollapalooza had all these tents where you could dick around with drum machines and throw rotten food at circus freaks.

[Guest lyrik]

throw rotten food at circus freaks.

That should be a festival on its own.

[Guest spacecadet]

From what i see there are more events they are now bigger now then back in the days and more clubs play EDM than back in the days sooooo I dont know how you can its getting smaller. Just Music has changed a bit but still electronic music

Kids these days.. There was a time Scribbles would throw down some house on The Grind, these days unless you pay for XM or Sirus you can't listen to edm music unless you have an Ipod. If EDM was popular you would see it everywhere but you don't, why? The festivals have little to do with the actual music, it's more about the event and entertainement and the "something to do" factor is a huge part of their success. Actually since most festivals loose money, UMF, GG, Bang, there is not much success.

Look for a merger in festivals.. wink wink

yea yea i see it now no more WMC because the scene is getting so small no XM radio because the scene is getting small and yes i was around the late 90 and there where only a couple of places you can hear EDM lil cracked out parties and shawdow.

Let me ask you this when did space open and do think electronic music has gone up or down since then ?

I see what your trying to say its not all over like hip hop but you cant say its dying to much big biz around.And how can it be for 7 year ultra is around and losing money ???????? Doesnt make sense to do a event 7 years and lose money every year does it ?

[Guest Mattivi]

LiquidX

The fucking problem with our scene and one of the reasons why it is shrinking is the very underground nature that it comes from. Any time an artist gets too successful it suddenly becomes "cool" for all of the trendsetters to start hating on that artist. Look at Oakenfold, tiesto, even Morillo now. As soon as they hit it big, the trendsetters who helped get them there (many of whom reside on CJ) start hating on them.

Now look at rock, or rap, or fucking polka for that matter. Their fans support and continue to support the artists the more successful they get. Look at U2. Do you think their core fans abondoned them when they started having commercial success...no...they embraced them, and bragged about how they were fans with them since way back when.

That is why our scene will never be the dominant one in mainstream.

That is why it pisses me off when I see people on this site hate on some of the people who helped create the scene that they enjoy so much.

Just my .02...but it happens to be the truth.

Many of the people on this site that complain about things going downhill are the very reason why they are.

THINK ABOUT IT

Whether you are right or wrong doesn't matter in terms of the over all health of edm music. It's fan base is shrinking for one reason and on reason only. EDM fans are getting older while the younger kids are not replacing us.

im going to have to agree with the saleen on this one, the hip-hop era has definitly been ushered in.

[Guest ramon]

Festivals definitely need a 'to-do' factor. I remember back when I was a kid, Lollapalooza had all these tents where you could dick around with drum machines and throw rotten food at circus freaks.

we had drum machines at the movie .. it was neat to be able to play with a real 909.

[Guest pod]

I woulda gone but I had to catch a flight to smell-A.

Though I would have canceled it for the chance to throw rotten food at people.

[Guest LiquidX]

WEll, lets say there were raves today... 99% of you people would be cursing those parties right and left.. making fun of the ravers and such... they are perhaps the true EDM heads and they get slapped for supporting the remaining of the movement right? ..

Yea that area was mostly killed by the laws and war on drugs. There is a point about all those little raves that were held in random places .. the Malibu party's among those that I was able to assist in its final days. YEa there were many miniature party's, but I bet it was mostly the same people assisting each one of them.. congregate all those people and you have close to the amount of people that would show up to Ultra. Its because of the laws and permits that most of the parties can not be held.. heck people are just scared that their party gets raided and get fined for it. Its a big process now.. so in conclusion its the laws that have brought the EDM movement to a halt.. moving all that into the Clubs. I think that EDM has survived and has been able to break into the mainstream.. before satellite radio all there was was 93.1 .. but they went dead for their own faults, and before that it was power 96 who had transmiting some form of EDM over nights .. before that, it was only pirate radios that could only be heard close to the radious of where it was coming from.

The only dispute here is to Saleen who is saying EDM its over.. thats what everyone its disputing, now shrinking its a different matter.

[Guest pod]

Like anything, a few bad apples spoiled the whole bunch. Some of the first events I shot were little one-off festivals. I would joke around with my editor at the time that I had to shoot in tight, and up, since invariably the background looked like a battlefield.

[Guest somefiercehouse]

This thread is outta control. Can't people just be excited that there is another music festival with GOOD acts coming to town. Who the hell cares about how much it costs or who's loosing who's ass.

As far as EDM dying off and younger generations not listening to it. Thats a bunch of lame, negative crap. First of all.....some people on here have already mentioned the boat loads of kids at Ultra and all. Space certainly isn't crawling with 30-40 year olds. There are plenty of young people there dancing, drinking, and having a great time. That should prove something.

Not to mention that everything that was old is new again. EDM will be popular again, just like disco has/had their comeback. Just like the 80s are having their comeback. It will take some time and a lot less people like Saleen saying that it's over and all that other sort of negative crap. Why is Saleen even touting himself as the club legend if he seems to hate every aspect of it? BEYOND ME! And instead of stating that it's dead, why not do something to correct it? I'm sure being the club legend that he is, he's gotta have some sort of trick up his shiney shirt sleeve.

just my 2 cents, for what it's worth.

[Guest lyrik]

yea yea i see it now no more WMC because the scene is getting so small no XM radio because the scene is getting small and yes i was around the late 90 and there where only a couple of places you can hear EDM lil cracked out parties and shawdow.

Let me ask you this when did space open and do think electronic music has gone up or down since then ?

You're still thinking too small scale...think nationally and even globally if you like...oh and BTW in the late 90's the EDM explosion/peak was definitely NOT occurring in its largest capacity in Miami or anywhere in Florida for that matter...NY, Chicago and San Fran, LA, Seattle were thriving among other areas...Orlando maybe Tampa was your best shot at anything comparable here, but Miami didn't come close to what was popping off around the nation in the big 3....which your statement in regards to the late 90's here in Miami only solidifies my point that you are not looking at the grand scheme of this....by the time Shadow opened EDM culture in regards to support was starting on its downward slope on the popularity graph.

Then came Space and its opening and has EDM gone up or down since…in pure numbers terms the over-all EDM population and fan base HAS decreased across the nation and here in Florida and last time I checked Space is a club that resides only in one US city. WMC is seeing smaller and smaller numbers each year and the only reason there were large crowds during this year was due to other things occurring the same time (i.e. MTV SB, BETs week long thing etc) and if you ask anyone there for WMC itself they much rather would have had it smaller this time around if that element could have been removed...take the year prior...it was the slowest WMC/M3/MMC I have even been to...AGAIN...you cannot take Space and a certain one-off event that didn't take place this year as the norm...they are the exception.

As for XM...come on man...they have platforms like polka and weirdo sub-genres I have never even heard of...is there a polka explosion occurring I don't know about just because its on XM....which BTW Luis Baro is the program director of XM's 80 channel he use to be one of the biggest rave promoters and party organizers in the city of Chicago (Vibeonauts) why if throwing these parties was so lucrative and the masses were just getting bigger would he step out? I already answered that in the previous post about how there are no more raves and events of that sort going off anywhere near the numbers they were occurring in...which in other cities 94-98 (again peak) sure there were tiny little events going off 5-6 times a week that could fall into your “cracked out†label but like I said each week there was also 3 big events...1500-3000 kids at each in numerous cities across the nation in addition to the clubs and festivals...the frequency and number of those parties has sharply declined…so where are all those kids and people…sure the hell all of them didn’t move to Miami and now go to Space every weekend…they grew up their scenes declined and now most places are struggling on life support.

What you’re also saying is that everyone goes to Space for EDM...just because a club plays EDM and its packed week and week out doesn't always mean that 100% of the people are there for the music...seriously...do you really believe 20-30% of those people are true EDM fans and know the music? Its to be seen and be at the place that everyone else is at...you all know deep down....not taking anything away from the music...just a statement to the pretentious nature of Miami and SFL population in general...now I'm sure everyone on CJ falls into that other 20-30% because we all know we are the shit and musically versed its just the "other" general clubbing population that makes up the 70-80%...again those there to see and be seen.

Anyway you slice it…the over-all popularity of the culture has declined in this Country. Try to take Space out of the equation and what are you left with in Miami? Don’t blame me…I love the music and have been doing this for a long time now…before Space, before Shadow…before Miami…even before I graduated high school and I’m working on 12+ years removed from that. I have lived in Chicago, through-out the Midwest, the South…Houston, Dallas and now Miami did a fair bit of traveling over those years as well to events across the US…and I wish it weren’t true but its reality…it is what it is. I guess I’ll jump on the wagon and say what others say…just feel lucky to live here in Miami to able to take advantage of what the city does offer in regards to night life or EDM in particular.

now shrinking its a different matter.

Simple...on point..

[V. Barbarino]

This thread is outta control. Can't people just be excited that there is another music festival with GOOD acts coming to town. Who the hell cares about how much it costs or who's loosing who's ass.

As far as EDM dying off and younger generations not listening to it. Thats a bunch of lame, negative crap. First of all.....some people on here have already mentioned the boat loads of kids at Ultra and all. Space certainly isn't crawling with 30-40 year olds. There are plenty of young people there dancing, drinking, and having a great time. That should prove something.

Not to mention that everything that was old is new again. EDM will be popular again, just like disco has/had their comeback. Just like the 80s are having their comeback. It will take some time and a lot less people like Saleen saying that it's over and all that other sort of negative crap. Why is Saleen even touting himself as the club legend if he seems to hate every aspect of it? BEYOND ME! And instead of stating that it's dead, why not do something to correct it? I'm sure being the club legend that he is, he's gotta have some sort of trick up his shiney shirt sleeve.

just my 2 cents, for what it's worth.

If i'm asked to help bring back EDM, then I should also bring back Beta Max, Tape Decks, Disco Music, and the making of ash trays in 3rd grade art classes for our parents who don't smoke.

[Guest somefiercehouse]

This thread is outta control. Can't people just be excited that there is another music festival with GOOD acts coming to town. Who the hell cares about how much it costs or who's loosing who's ass.

As far as EDM dying off and younger generations not listening to it. Thats a bunch of lame, negative crap. First of all.....some people on here have already mentioned the boat loads of kids at Ultra and all. Space certainly isn't crawling with 30-40 year olds. There are plenty of young people there dancing, drinking, and having a great time. That should prove something.

Not to mention that everything that was old is new again. EDM will be popular again, just like disco has/had their comeback. Just like the 80s are having their comeback. It will take some time and a lot less people like Saleen saying that it's over and all that other sort of negative crap. Why is Saleen even touting himself as the club legend if he seems to hate every aspect of it? BEYOND ME! And instead of stating that it's dead, why not do something to correct it? I'm sure being the club legend that he is, he's gotta have some sort of trick up his shiney shirt sleeve.

just my 2 cents, for what it's worth.

If i'm asked to help bring back EDM, then I should also bring back Beta Max, Tape Decks, Disco Music, and the making of ash trays in 3rd grade art classes for our parents who don't smoke.

I don't get it. Sorry. All I was getting at is music styles come and go. I'm sure we haven't seen the LAST of EDM in pop culture. It's in more commercials now it seems, maybe that's somewhat of a plus. It will come back, hopefully. But saying that its no longer alive or popular is just sort of a lame statement. Also, isn't one of the greatest things about EDM the fact that it's NOT mainstream? I like the fact that it's underground and not EVERYONE is listening to it. And I guess it's still popular enough to do music events because they are happening all over the world. I know you know your stuff Saleen, but I think on this you may just be missing the point that you shouldn't be hating on music festivals/EDM, just support them so they don't die out.

[Guest JMT]

This thread is outta control. Can't people just be excited that there is another music festival with GOOD acts coming to town. Who the hell cares about how much it costs or who's loosing who's ass.

As far as EDM dying off and younger generations not listening to it. Thats a bunch of lame, negative crap. First of all.....some people on here have already mentioned the boat loads of kids at Ultra and all. Space certainly isn't crawling with 30-40 year olds. There are plenty of young people there dancing, drinking, and having a great time. That should prove something.

Not to mention that everything that was old is new again. EDM will be popular again, just like disco has/had their comeback. Just like the 80s are having their comeback. It will take some time and a lot less people like Saleen saying that it's over and all that other sort of negative crap. Why is Saleen even touting himself as the club legend if he seems to hate every aspect of it? BEYOND ME! And instead of stating that it's dead, why not do something to correct it? I'm sure being the club legend that he is, he's gotta have some sort of trick up his shiney shirt sleeve.

just my 2 cents, for what it's worth.

If i'm asked to help bring back EDM, then I should also bring back Beta Max, Tape Decks, Disco Music, and the making of ash trays in 3rd grade art classes for our parents who don't smoke.

ha ha ha

[Guest Major]

[Guest Bang]

SICK LINEUP!!!!!!!!

[Guest saintjohn]

SICK LINEUP!!!!!!!!

Definitely.

Can we keep all of the Bang info in this thread, please?

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