NIN and Radio Head have put the nail in the coffin

[V. Barbarino]

for record labels...

here

here

Discuss

[V. Barbarino]

My take:

I read an article a while back about the day the record industry lost control. It happened recently and the labels are powerless to stop it. It was the last episode of the Sopranos. When they played Journey at the end the music industry as we know it died. Their song 20 years old, jumped back up on the charts and made the top 20 on itunes. It signaled that us, the people, the consumers are now in control, not them! We make the hits, not the radio stations or labels or MTV.

As for NIN and Radio Head, RH should get over the full album obsession, however think about it, if they both sell on itunes, they keep 100% of the money as opposed to splitting it with the label.

I also think this is great news for the death of the RIAA!!!!!!!

[ryan2772]

first off....

http://www.cooljunkie.com/forum/music-junkies/121366-welcome-future-radioheads-bold-step.html

i pre-ordered my new radiohead album yesterday. gladly paid $20 (that's about £10 for the blokes).

i really hope they find success with this. everything is changing....

[Guest myles hie]

i really hope they find success with this. everything is changing....

Indeed. While i'm glad that autonomy of the major label is fading, they do help serve a purpose with thier marketing. It's going to be harder for a band to "break" if they have little or no $ for marketing. Social networking sites are already jammed with bands trying to make it. What other avenues to have with no $ to spend? They need the muscle and money to really push thier marketing to all potential corners. Who cares if you band makes 90% profit off a .99 download. That won't even buy new strings for you guitar.

[V. Barbarino]

Indeed. While i'm glad that autonomy of the major label is fading, they do help serve a purpose with thier marketing. It's going to be harder for a band to "break" if they have little or no $ for marketing. Social networking sites are already jammed with bands trying to make it. What other avenues to have with no $ to spend? They need the muscle and money to really push thier marketing to all potential corners. Who cares if you band makes 90% profit off a .99 download. That won't even buy new strings for you guitar.

If their track gets bought by 1 million people it will. Also this signals the return of the touring band. Without tours you won't be able to make the serious money.. Which is good for me, I like concerts.

[Guest myles hie]

If their track gets bought by 1 million people it will. Also this signals the return of the touring band. Without tours you won't be able to make the serious money.. Which is good for me, I like concerts.

Bands sell a million because A. They are already established or B. They have a ton of marketing and airplay. How will Joe Garage Band obtain the status to be able to sell a million songs? The band market is a tough nut to crack. With no marketing machine it could take a band years if ever to sell a million songs.

As far as touring goes, the big touring money is made when you reach a certain level. Not everyone is touring in luxury busses or plains playing stadiums or amphitheatres. The majority of these bands are touring in beat up vans living off .99 cent menues.

You need money to make money. The majors as convoluted as it is, gives that "start up" money to bands to get them going. With out that source of capital, it's going to be harder for bands to get going and longer to possibly make it profitable.

[Guest coach]

Myles is correct.

I dub both of these bands assclowns of the week. They can't do without the function that a label provides, all this means is that they have to hire all their own people. For example, who is doing their website? Who is doing their booking? Who is advertising their wares? Are they going to take time out of their recording and touring schedule to learn all these skills and do it themselves? No. They are going to hire functionaries to do them. These employees provide the same services that the label personnel do. So, now RH and NIN get to manage their own people instead of letting someone else do it. Anyone who manages people knows it sucks. And it sucks up time.

[V. Barbarino]

So let me get this straight, they can't outsource their work and hire a few employees? If they spend 500k a year on operating their business, it's still chump change to what the label costs and they are now not forced to adhere to the labels demands..

Oh yea, they make 100% of the profit, so they only need to sell half the amount of records..

[Guest mr.miami]

Kind of cool but who knew NIN was still around. I used to like radio heads old stuff a lot better. They just don't move me anymore.

[Guest myles hie]

So let me get this straight, they can't outsource their work and hire a few employees? If they spend 500k a year on operating their business, it's still chump change to what the label costs and they are now not forced to adhere to the labels demands..

Oh yea, they make 100% of the profit, so they only need to sell half the amount of records..

We are not neccasarily talking about NIN or RH. They are established and have money to experiment with new avenues of sales and distro. Good for them. What about the next potential NIN or RH who don't have the resources to "make it".

If your making 100% (which you never are, unless your selling out of the trunk of your car) of the profits but paying out twice or 3 times the amount to get your product out there, you'll be in the red in no time.

[Guest coach]

So let me get this straight, they can't outsource their work and hire a few employees? If they spend 500k a year on operating their business, it's still chump change to what the label costs and they are now not forced to adhere to the labels demands..

Oh yea, they make 100% of the profit, so they only need to sell half the amount of records..

Sure they can, but they have basically become their own label. And they are spending more for those same services than they would likely spend through a label, thanks to economies of scale. And they are spending more time on those than they would through a label.

And again, as Myles said, and even you commented above, the money it costs them to do it is fairly insignificant to them. I mean, hell, they could retire today and just live off their earning and investments without doing any work. So, they are terrible test cases.

Yeah, they utilized the Label's marketing machines to become rich, and now they tell them to shove off. Nice way to do business.

[ryan2772]

....right, not because they're talented bands or anything. it's just fluffy marketing that made radiohead the band they are. pffffft!

coach, you're just talking like that cause your big brother is watching what you type... :-)

radiohead fulfilled a 6-album contract...so what, they're supposed to beg their label for another contract?

[V. Barbarino]

Coach, why should NIN pay for the label tanking with other up and coming bands? Why should they subsidize other bands. No labels now makes the bands their own business. If their music is good and sells, there is no problem. The outcome would be the same with or without the label only the profit would change. Plus a established band can make a digital track at home, put it on itunes and there is almost zero cost.

[Guest saintjohn]

Sure they can, but they have basically become their own label.

And labels have a way of becoming, well, labels. Do you want to play music, or do you want to market music? Sure, you can do both, but it's difficult for most artists to find (and maintain) a balance.

If you have a niche market and low overhead, you can definitely DIY. Just ask the folks at Dischord:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dischord_Records

[Guest myles hie]

....right, not because they're talented bands or anything. it's just fluffy marketing that made radiohead the band they are. pffffft!

QUOTE]

Okay, by that logic Radiohead would be as popular today with no major record label backing? Money given to them by the label) to make an album, to market, to distro, to make them a "buzz band" on MTV, etc..

You can look at it as a chincken/egg thing. But 1 did come first and wouldn't have been able to do it without the other. For every Radiohead giving away thier music and having a million downloads there are 10 Joes' Garage Band thats doing the same thing with only 5 downloads. The difference? 15 years of mega marketing by Radioheads label to insure you knew who the fuck Radiohead is. Where is that push for Joe? But Joe has his own website/myspace page and sells his own music, Joe plays every Fri and Sat night and even out of town twice a month. Joe has the looks and teh sound to be huge, but since there are no labels there are no A&R reps to sign Joe and make him a star.

It was not a perfect system, one hit wonders abound and alot of artists only made one album and faded away. But without some sort of infrastructure, you would have never got to experiance most of the bands you have heard in your lifetime

No one is saying the RH owes their label anything, but dismissing the record label as a key part of the infrastructure of the music business is very shortsighted.

[ryan2772]

yes but radiohead got themselves on a label, then fulfilled a contract.

joe garage band has to work hard, it's that simple. and a myspace music page is NOT hard work.

btw, got their new album today....been listening....it's very mellow (perhaps too mellow). gotta listen a few times to get an accurate opinion...but i'm not too happy at this point, unfortunately.

[Guest myles hie]

yes but radiohead got themselves on a label, then fulfilled a contract.

joe garage band has to work hard, it's that simple. and a myspace music page is NOT hard work.

.

Thats what i was saying. Without future labels to help bands, will there be another Radiohead or NIN or whatever, on the level that they have gotten to?

If Joe doesn't have the budget to buy print ads, go on tour, print posters and flyers and have a network of people all over the country or world to spread the word, where does that leave Joe? Joe could be the hardest working man in showbiz, but without certain resources he cannot potentially move to the next level.

[V. Barbarino]

You are thinking the year is 1995 when it fact it's 2007. A radio head today would be just as successful if their music struck an accord with fans. The only difference is how they reached their audience.

[ryan2772]

everyone is in control of their own destiny.

[Guest myles hie]

You are thinking the year is 1995 when it fact it's 2007. A radio head today would be just as successful if their music struck an accord with fans. The only difference is how they reached their audience.

Your missing the point. How would they get the music out on such a large scale with out help? People would never know to like them if they didn't know they existed.

[Guest myles hie]

everyone is in control of their own destiny.

true and false.

In the music business, no. You destiny is also in the hands of alot of people who come together to make a product successful.

You could be the most talented MF'er out there, but if you can't or don't have the means to get out of your garage then....? Is that truly your destiny?

[Guest Buck White]

everyone is in control of their own destiny.

You bought that lie ?

[Guest myles hie]

The internet has indeed become the great leveler in terms of "being your own boss" or doing things in a non traditional way whether it be on a consumer level or an artist level, but will it in the end be the best thing for the music biz? Probably not.

[ryan2772]

You bought that lie ?

lie? what lie? your defeatist attitude will get you very far in life!

i, on the other hand, will do very well, i'm quite sure. because i will never rely on any entities to dictate where i end up. yes, i am in control of my own destiny. this isn't something someone told me, it is something that i decided on my own.

enjoy your pity party!

[Guest Buck White]

lie? what lie? your defeatist attitude will get you very far in life!

i, on the other hand, will do very well, i'm quite sure. because i will never rely on any entities to dictate where i end up. yes, i am in control of my own destiny. this isn't something someone told me, it is something that i decided on my own.

enjoy your pity party!

I was only joking, guy. Thanks for the five line swan song, though.