Who determined that going to clubs has to be about

[abuglio]

I agree completely...go for whatever the hell you want

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I'm going to a pretty place where the flowers grow...I'll be back in an hour or so. I always tell the truth, even when I lie. Ecstasy is god!

[gravity]

Originally posted by PFloyd40:

elitism

its and elitist attitude that says "dont' come here its all about the music". I go to twilo all the time yet never tell anyone that. I try and bring my friends there all the time. I also stick to objective criticsm of other clubs. Me saying that jonathon peters plays a song for an hour, or uses drum rolls throughout the nite, is not bashing, its the truth.

but at the same time, those people do have a point in my opinion. club culture stems from a point where it in fact was all about the music, b/c it was so misunderstood. It's derivative is one who's focal point is that music, not the scene or to hookup. so while i do in fact understand certain people saying that b/c for them it is true, its wrong to put down others for not going out for that reason. some may say that as clubs grow and change, it gets away from their true origin and essence. but clubs changes just as the times do. nothing stays the same, social adaptation coincides just the same w/ club culture. its' like when your parents tell you that the times are different.. its true

then theres the business aspect of this argument which brings in the issue of superficiality.. but i'm at work and that could go on for days...

-Rob

You're statements are very keen and intuitive as usual and I appreciate your perspective.

Just for the record, I have been involved in the scene for many years and my interests have changed and grown throughout the years. It started out for the hook up thing, then got into the promoting side, then (thank god) completely fell in love with the music and started going sober and enjoying it more than ever. Recently I havent been that active, but when I do go out, I find a happy mix of hooking up (well not since I've been w/ my baby), getting a bit fucked up, and ofcourse dancing and getting completely lost in the music. Thus, I see things from a variety of different perspectives and can appreciate the variety of reasons why people enjoy to go to clubs...as I have experienced many of them first hand.

However, as for the points you made, I have a few things to add/question. Clubs most definitely stem/evolve from the music and corresponding culture, however it is impossible to think that with this evolution, the people involved will stay the same. Unfortunately, "older" clubbers tend to mistake commercialization w/ popularity...and I think this is where a lot of the animosity towards "clubbing reasons" stem from. A lot of people think that clubs lose their underground flavor when "uniformed" people start coming or come with intentions that differ from those that "made" the scene... However, it is impossible to expect that when things gain popularity, "other" people wont join on. Maybe it is the bandwagon effect, however, there are definitely many people out there who never knew what the club scene has to offer and it can only be beneficial to welcome such people in as new faces bring fresh ideas. Furthermore, something can only remain underground for so long before it loses that edge. Twilo is definitely seeing that the most out of any NY club at the moment. It is understandable to be annoyed or whatever at people coming in to a place and ruining whatever vibe "you" think should exist, however, clubs have always been a place for self expression and such is the case that it is better to embrace different forms of enjoyment and adapt to others just as they would be expected to adapt to the withstanding scene.

Sorry for rambling...definitely more to say, but I gotta bounce for now.

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"The world is a better place because of those who refuse to believe they can't

fly."

I go places, I interact...

(What places?)

Certain, clubs. Like, Paradise. It's not bad.

It's just that feeling when you can take your shirt off and really dance. When the music owns you. Do you understand?

[djustinh]

i thought clubs were all about dancing/dj's/music/picking up/having a good time all in one? who is to say we should seperate them?

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"a mind stretched by new dimensions can never be the same again"

[exit2heaven]

i have no right to keep anybody from a club...but yes i do get bothered by it...for example....when it gets too packed and i cant even enjoy it....thats fucked up especially when people are asking me whats the Dj's name....(PV fuking D).

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"Beware of PHAZON"

"The Future is Now...

forget the past...presents gone until the gorgeous night.

.Outrageous, mindblowing nightmares....end up..

in the never ending.. FIGHT"

[jammy]

Now you should know, I do like to stay DRAMA free. I don't go to clubs solely because of the music. Sometimes, I do go to meet people and probably could be filed under "looking to hook up" but thats been rare. Like I said before, its just all about having a good time and meeting new mates in the process.

-Jamms "againone"

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Haben Sie Ihr Schuhe auf tanzt?

[ReginaP]

gravity check pms please

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=)

reginadp121@aol.com

[rparadox]

IMHO, If it's purely about the music, then make a tape or burn a CD and listen to the music in a walkman, while dancing in your apartment.

Why would anyone go to a social setting (i.e. thousands of people in a small space), and then get upset when people are being social? I can understand not wanting to be bothered sometimes, but that's why clubs exist, so people can be around other people and have a good time.

I'm not trying to insult anyone, but this attitude sometimes seems a little bourgeois when it's directed at the "fair weathered fans" that "ruin" the vibe.

[rparadox]

[Damn double posts]

[This message has been edited by rparadox (edited 03-02-2001).]

[rparadox]

IMHO, If it's purely about the music, then make a tape or burn a CD and listen to the music in a walkman, while dancing in your apartment.

Why would anyone go to a social setting (i.e. thousands of people in a small space), and then get upset when people are being social? I can understand not wanting to be bothered sometimes, but that's why clubs exist, so people can be around other people and have a good time.

I'm not trying to insult anyone, but this attitude sometimes seems a little bourgeois when it's directed at the "fair weathered fans" that "ruin" the vibe.

[tribehouse]

its all about attidute and sleazefactor when

you talk about clubs besides music. in nyc

there are clubs for everyone's taste that

should be respected and not being bashed.

I understand why some ppl get very defensive

about their club (e.g.twilo)when they see how it gets invaded by the "wrong" clubbers and

changes the vibe. I am on their side. a lot

of girls don;t go to clubs anymore b/c they don;t feel like to be part of a meatmarket

scene. No girls no party. Guys should understand its not their god;s giving right

come friday to get laid.

[foxyroxy20]

Originally posted by George Glass:

Would you stand in line for an hour and pay the cover w/o knowing what to expct?

Seems kinda foolish to me.

Fair weathered fans are also the first to go when a trend dies. Clubs based around the music know how to survive and often book lil known djs that don't guarantee a packed house w/o the help of 7854732895794 promoters.

If I had all the records the djs play then I possibly wouldn't need to go out, but there are a few new tracks I always don't have.

I don't have room in my apt for bassbin tho.

Well not knowing what to expect is part of clubbing, i mean u cant stick to same places , unless u tried them all and picked your favorites like i did. And just cause u have every track a dj spins doesnt mean u need to stay home, i have most of the songs in clubs, but a club isnt just for the music, i mean yes it is to hear new songs, ur favorites, but its all about being with ppl that love the same thing, meeting new ppl, being with friends, etc...its not as fun to stay home and listen to ur favorite track , as hearing it in a club, its a total different experience..

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aim: amafrk1

amafrk1@yahoo.com

Exit, Tunnel & SoundFactory r the places to be ;o)

[foxyroxy20]

Originally posted by tribehouse:

its all about attidute and sleazefactor when

you talk about clubs besides music. in nyc

there are clubs for everyone's taste that

should be respected and not being bashed.

I understand why some ppl get very defensive

about their club (e.g.twilo)when they see how it gets invaded by the "wrong" clubbers and

changes the vibe. I am on their side. a lot

of girls don;t go to clubs anymore b/c they don;t feel like to be part of a meatmarket

scene. No girls no party. Guys should understand its not their god;s giving right

come friday to get laid.

but what is a "wrong clubber" to u??? i mean come on, everyone can go and come as they please they paid for their admission. I think that everyone has a right to have fun in any club, yeah theres assholes in every club, but it cant be changed theres always one or a couple that like to start trouble no matter where they r , club, school, work..etc..

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aim: amafrk1

amafrk1@yahoo.com

Exit, Tunnel & SoundFactory r the places to be ;o)

[crobra]

I think the only rule about going to a club is to have a good time - the one problem I have is with people who start fights and people who give attitude when they get bumped - it's a club and there is a lot of people jumping around and doing there thing - if someone bumps by accident, they didn't intend to do it! How do you go to a club and not expect to be bumped into - I know there is a limit, but you should expect to be bumped into!! As far as people dancing, what they wear, or what dj they know - who cares - there is a first time for everyone!!

Also - if you want to hook up with some girls - that's cool - but show some respect - there is no reason to attack a girl - if she isn't down, I am sure someone else will be!!

[tribehouse]

to fox: there are no wrong clubber, only clubber going to the wrong club. e.g. somebody is looking for a date is probably

better off going to exit or centro fly than

say twilo. as long as everybody knows where

he belongs to you have less friction,frustation and all get what they want hopefully.

[foxyroxy20]

Originally posted by tribehouse:

to fox: there are no wrong clubber, only clubber going to the wrong club. e.g. somebody is looking for a date is probably

better off going to exit or centro fly than

say twilo. as long as everybody knows where

he belongs to you have less friction,frustation and all get what they want hopefully.

see but ur generalizing, people getting rhooked up everywhere, u cant tell me that no one from the board ever hooked up at twilo??? Even if no one wants to admit it...sometimes u meet some cool ppl and u excange digits and take it from there..nothing wrong with that.

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aim: amafrk1

amafrk1@yahoo.com

Exit, Tunnel & SoundFactory r the places to be ;o)

[tribehouse]

fox, iam not generalizing, those clubs mentioned were only an excample. iam not

saying ppl at twilo don;t hook up there,

but, i hope, that is not there primarily

objective of going there. if you meet someone

there to chill and exchange digits, that;s cool. that;s diff. than in some other venues

what i see and hear from other girls, that

touching and hitting on them is so annoying.

[jolie1]

there are two things that piss me off when im out at a club

1- when guys try to grab you and make you dance with them. girls hate that, if u want to talk to us then come and say whats up dont ever grab me.

2- fighting, the last two times ive been to sf ive seen fights. the first time my friend and i got caught in the middle of two juiceheads fighting and last fri at factory two girls strarted fighting, it was so trashy they were literally rolling around on the ground with earrings and shoes flyin everywhere.

enough of my ranting and raving, have a good day =)

love,

jolie

[tastyt]

(Sorry, double post!)

[This message has been edited by tastyt (edited 03-05-2001).]

[tastyt]

Originally posted by George Glass:

Would you stand in line for an hour and pay the cover w/o knowing what to expct?

What other way is there to expose yourself to new djs and new syles of music? Granted, if I didn't know the dj I would most likely stick to a club I knew- in other words, I wouldn't have a problem going to Twilo if I'd never heard the dj before because I know they have good djs nearly every weekend.

But it is silly to say, 'oh, people hook up in this club but not that one' I would be more likely to hook up in Twilo (in fact that's where I met my boyfriend) than in SF because Twilo is more likely to have 'my type of crowd'.

No one goes out for one reason and one reason only. Everyone wants to hear good music and hang out with cool people. If that entails hooking up or getting fucked up, as long as you're not encroaching on anyone else's personal space then you are not "ruining the vibe."

[charrails]

Originally posted by gravity:

In all actuality...this post wasn't really directed to those that share my point of view...although it is nice to see that others agree. I was really hoping to hear some reasoning from those who in fact believe that people that go to clubs for reasons other than music, etc ruin the so-called vibe and dont have a place in the scene because they "dont know what its all about"...

I think you make a good point. Although I love it when I'm in a club and everyone is there "just for the music/DJ/Dancing", actually I like it much better that way, BUT your 100% right that there is nothing wrong with going to a club for meeting people,etc... I think what many of us forget is that not everyone who wants to hook up is one of those people grabbin every girls ass, and its not mutually exclusive, like you either a) love the music or b)want to hook up....I personally love the music, and have a great girl, so I'd rather be in a room full of people who are there for the music...

I also like to MEET these people, def. met some chill peeps at the clubs...

We do get hypocritical though,

We say that we like a diverse, open minded crowd, but when a place is packed, we wish that the closed-minded people would leave..well that means we're not being open minded to them...

Some people who love Phish, etc are similar to this,...they act all open minded, like its all love, and people have argued with me that hip hop, or techno is about a certain style, and not as open minded as Phish's crowd, but then when I went to a Phish show wearing my normal gear, the hippie-dressed folk were looking at me like "what the hell is he doing here..." I really enjoyed hearing/seeing them jam, but it was just funny to think about how they also have a certain style, although they act like clothes don't matter, how come they all dressed almost the same...I'm talking about kids who were normally Gap/Eddie Bauer styles all of a sudden pulling their baggy-patched (fake dirt ass style) clothes out of the closet and becoming a hippy for a day....

SORRY to go off...but I'm glad you brought this up...maybe I fell into the same trap that I made fun of my Phish-head friends for.....from now on, bring on the meatheads, the swingers, the guidettes, and the non-techno heads...may we all end up dancing together....but like exit2heaven said "just don't grab my girls ass"