mrmatas2277 Posted November 18 Report Share Posted November 18 Originally posted by starvingartist I do not understand how the Iragis can be considered heros? If Jessica Lynch and the others were carrying supplies, they should not have been captured in the first place. It is quite disturbing that anyone would label soldiers from any side of the front line a hero for the capture and torture of a non combat unit. ummm....correction....although she was a stocking clerk, she is STILL a soldier...u are first a soldier and then the title given...but i agree with the rest of ur statement... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kramadas Posted November 18 Report Share Posted November 18 Originally posted by starvingartist I do not understand how the Iragis can be considered heros? If Jessica Lynch and the others were carrying supplies, they should not have been captured in the first place. It is quite disturbing that anyone would label soldiers from any side of the front line a hero for the capture and torture of a non combat unit. Further going back to what someone wrote previously, I believe that a hero is someone who in the face of immediate danger of their own lives is willing to take a risk to either make a positive statement or for the greater good of a situation. However when it comes to this war in particular it is quite debatable "what the greater good" actually is. Further I would say those who voluntarily join the armed forces because they believe they are fighting for the right cause are heroic in some sense. Even if I disagreed with their viewpoints. Doesn't matter if they were carrying supplies, RPGs, nuclear weapons, or bubble gum...they were in combat uniform in a soverign country, carrying arms...ie, part of the US military. That makes them as viable a target as anybody. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starvingartist Posted November 18 Report Share Posted November 18 Originally posted by ghhhhhost from what I remember..supreme NATO commander at the time was GENERAL WESLEY CLARK...AMERICANfrom what I remember..every NATO leader wanted to cease with the bombing except for Clinton and Blair...from what I know..the Mexicans arent killing farmers down in Texas...they also havent waged a guerilla war on ur Police Officers....or begun to smuggle arms into the US with intention of annexing Texas to Mexico...if this did happen..i seriously doubt the US would show restraint..listen..coming from a person who's last 2 presidents r liars..draft dodgers..adulterers ...morons..u are in no position to question the integrity of my people...how come when the US drops bombs on Japan its called "necessary evil"...yet when Serbs to try resolve a terrorist situation WITHIN their own borders..its labeled genocide....why is ur genocide justified and mine cant be? once again i go back to my earlier statement..i can admit my country is fucked up..and i cant justify everything we've done...but at least im fucking real. u live in this little bubble..where everything is peaches...and keep lying to urself that the US is immaculate in all its doings..OPEN UR EYES man...in closing...im not biting the hand that feeds me. this country gave me NOTHING.....my scholarship..I EARNEDmy job ..I EARNEDmy education..I EARNEDive never taken a handout from this country and never will u can talk all that BEING HERE IS A PRIVELIGE IN AND OF ITSELF crap...but u dont even know where i came from..as a matter of fact...u dont know anything about me..or my country..so ur opinions dont even count...unlike me..who lives in ur world..and can tell u about it I come from a very fascist country, and have lived in 3 different countries. I agree with some of your points but I disagree on what the history of the U.S. translates in the sense of its hypocrisy that you point out. The U.S. is full of imperfections as all governments are. However I will say that it is one of the most progressive countries to ever exist. Radical change has occured since its existence which is short in comparison to its European counterparts. I noticed that you used the term earn frequently. In most parts of the world this word fails to carry any meaning. The merits, the knowledge, the skill, the aptitude, and hardwork of an individual is rarely compensated. I am not niave to say that the U.S. is free from any shortcomings, but earning and actual compensation is commonplace here more then most of the world. ( I hope that made sense, hehe). Overall my point is Progression is what makes this country appealing, it exists. Even if at times it is slow it is much faster than the rest of the world. I hate to draw comparisons but I am sure you can think of various countries who women have no rights, no voice, etc.(sorry for the length) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starvingartist Posted November 18 Report Share Posted November 18 Originally posted by mrmatas2277 ummm....correction....although she was a stocking clerk, she is STILL a soldier...u are first a soldier and then the title given...but i agree with the rest of ur statement... I stand corrected, hehe. Actually I think I got that "fact" from a comedy skit, lol. Where they pointed out those in combat just wears big X's on their helmets since they are targets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmatas2277 Posted November 18 Report Share Posted November 18 Originally posted by starvingartist I stand corrected, hehe. Actually I think I got that "fact" from a comedy skit, lol. Where they pointed out those in combat just wears big X's on their helmets since they are targets. i was just messing with u...dont mind me i am the sarcastic Moderator.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starvingartist Posted November 18 Report Share Posted November 18 Originally posted by mrmatas2277 i was just messing with u...dont mind me i am the sarcastic Moderator.... No worries, I left my self wide open with that comment. Someone can easily point out the U.S. did not follow war time laws, why should the Iraqis, etc. Then someone else would point out, following the example would make the Iragis no better then the U.S. etc etc. Hypocrisy is inevitable especially in war, unless you are a sadist and do not mind death as a consequence of nobility. food for thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starvingartist Posted November 18 Report Share Posted November 18 Originally posted by normalnoises Q: Why did Italy lose WW2?A: They ordered ziti instead of shells. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starvingartist Posted November 19 Report Share Posted November 19 Originally posted by marksimons I'm gonna take the piss out of your country's history mr mah. and it's easy.italy. fucking italy.don't mention the romans, they weren't italians...let's mention that italy was a *drumbroll pleaseeeee*Nazi allyitaly.at least france had some principles, even if they were shit at defending their countries.italy.I can see why mr mahs likes the current war so much. because it's in italian nature, and seemingly americas.wannabee fascist dictator, loves war, needs something to do, oooh let's go bomb a fucked up country, fuck it up some more and fuck up fucking it up.or something."Following yet another incident on 5 December 1934, the already strained relations between Italy and Abyssinia (today called Ethiopia) rapidly deteriorated further. The resulting conciliation efforts, particularly on the part of the League of Nations, came to nothing. On the night of 2-3 October 1935, Italian forces invaded Abyssinian territory from Eritrea. At the end of an unequal struggle, during which the Italian army used chemical weapons, Abyssinia was finally conquered at the beginning of March 1936 and annexed by the Kingdom of Italy.""The Abyssinian government mainly protested about raids by the Italian air force aimed particularly at ambulances and medical units protected by the red cross emblem, and the use of gas - confirmed by the ICRC delegates themselves - by Italian forces in violation of the 1925 Geneva Protocol. However, when the ICRC approached the Italian Red Cross about this, its president replied that the Protocol contained no provision prohibiting the use of chemical weapons in reprisal for the ill-treatment of Italian prisoners of war. The ICRC, in turn, reminded the Italian National Society that, as far as humanitarian law was concerned, chemical weapons were very clearly prohibited."btw I do love italy and italians. but not that much as I've not been there yet. and it's late. and this threat is fucking stupid. but anyway. fuckit. How on earth does a 3in length writing describe or as you say "take the piss out of your contry's history"? Do you have any idea that more then half of Italy's existence stems further back then WWII. Also you point out that wanting war is Italian nature, how is that so? Actually war is the nature of government not man. And to say that Italy has no principles is just ridiculous. Overall you make a baseless ignorant point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghhhhhost Posted November 19 Author Report Share Posted November 19 Originally posted by starvingartist I come from a very fascist country, and have lived in 3 different countries. I agree with some of your points but I disagree on what the history of the U.S. translates in the sense of its hypocrisy that you point out. The U.S. is full of imperfections as all governments are. However I will say that it is one of the most progressive countries to ever exist. Radical change has occured since its existence which is short in comparison to its European counterparts. I noticed that you used the term earn frequently. In most parts of the world this word fails to carry any meaning. The merits, the knowledge, the skill, the aptitude, and hardwork of an individual is rarely compensated. I am not niave to say that the U.S. is free from any shortcomings, but earning and actual compensation is commonplace here more then most of the world. ( I hope that made sense, hehe). Overall my point is Progression is what makes this country appealing, it exists. Even if at times it is slow it is much faster than the rest of the world. I hate to draw comparisons but I am sure you can think of various countries who women have no rights, no voice, etc.(sorry for the length) i agree with pretty much everything u said. like u, i was raised in a diff country and i know how hard it is to be recognized over there. my point is that americans will never admit to their shortcomings..theyll never admit that this country has its drawbacks and injustices...they just paint this beautiful " a day on the grand la jatte"-esque image and pretend everything is gravy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marksimons Posted November 19 Report Share Posted November 19 woah woah woah!radical change in the US?yes, the civil rights movement is impressive in it's speed, but lest not forget that this was the 1960's when some parts of america still wanted legalised racism... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmatas2277 Posted November 19 Report Share Posted November 19 Originally posted by ghhhhhost my point is that americans will never admit to their shortcomings..theyll never admit that this country has its drawbacks and injustices...they just paint this beautiful " a day on the grand la jatte"-esque image and pretend everything is gravy. maybe thats the way many come across...but i admit to many of the problems of this country and this administration...my parents dealt with many of the injustices of this country when they came here...but i will tell u this, with all the faults this country has and with all that STILL needs to be fixed in this country....there is NO PLACE i rather live then here...and apparently u too... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmatas2277 Posted November 19 Report Share Posted November 19 Originally posted by starvingartist Hypocrisy is inevitable especially in war, unless you are a sadist and do not mind death as a consequence of nobility. food for thought. its part of war...i have many "first hand" stories given to me by my father when he was in Vietnam...things that the V.C. did and things that WE did in return...part of war....goes to show, u cant ALWAYS follow the rules...especially when ur opponent isnt following them.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skince55 Posted November 19 Report Share Posted November 19 Originally posted by normalnoises You go yee ha to war but yet you don't have the balls to actually fight one. You see, I'm fighting a war already........against war. Keep up the good work soldier :laugh: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr mahs Posted November 19 Report Share Posted November 19 Originally posted by skince55 Keep up the good work soldier :laugh: I bet he wakes up every day wishing he was in the 60's ...ANNOUNCEMENT TO NORMAL..................You are not a hippie and this isn't the Vietnam WAR so stop trying to be important because your existenace on this planet is the equivalent of gum under my show walking to my REAL job.... Now go play with some index cards and figuring out how to dodge another alimoni payment... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghhhhhost Posted November 19 Author Report Share Posted November 19 Originally posted by mr mahs I bet he wakes up every day wishing he was in the 60's ...ANNOUNCEMENT TO NORMAL..................You are not a hippie and this isn't the Vietnam WAR so stop trying to be important because your existenace on this planet is the equivalent of gum under my show walking to my REAL job.... Now go play with some index cards and figuring out how to dodge another alimoni payment... announcement to Mahs...1)u cant spell..2) for u to shit on normal is retarded...when he labeled u chickenhawk he couldnt have been more right..the point is u talk all this pro war bullshit..but ,as u said , ur still WALKING TO UR JOB...ur not fighting shit..u just talk a good one..the only person who deserves any credit..any respect on this whole board is NYCMUZIK..cause he didnt sit back and talk about it..he did it...and no matter how jaded my view of the US may be..i respect that..and him..and every last soldier fighting for this country Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr mahs Posted November 19 Report Share Posted November 19 Originally posted by ghhhhhost announcement to Mahs...1)u cant spell..2) for u to shit on normal is retarded...when he labeled u chickenhawk he couldnt have been more right..the point is u talk all this pro war bullshit..but ,as u said , ur still WALKING TO UR JOB...ur not fighting shit..u just talk a good one..the only person who deserves any credit..any respect on this whole board is NYCMUZIK..cause he didnt sit back and talk about it..he did it...and no matter how jaded my view of the US may be..i respect that..and him..and every last soldier fighting for this country Who the fawk are you to judge my action? you don't know shit about me or anyone on this board you punk!Once again you make a assumption that I wouldn't fight if it came down to it. We are ALL involved in this war either up front and personal like NYCMUZIK or in other ways like showing support for dealing with what ever dangers are put infront of us... You made this lame attempt to twist my support into having less courage why? because I support a war that we didn't start? NATO should have nuked your country maybe the chances of another ungtreatful, twisted, euro-trash punk coming to my country would have decreased...Oh and one last thing Vagina.. Spelling doesn't count.. I don't pay attention to it while posting in between phone calls at work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skince55 Posted November 19 Report Share Posted November 19 Originally posted by ghhhhhost announcement to Mahs...1)u cant spell..2) for u to shit on normal is retarded...when he labeled u chickenhawk he couldnt have been more right..the point is u talk all this pro war bullshit..but ,as u said , ur still WALKING TO UR JOB...ur not fighting shit..u just talk a good one..the only person who deserves any credit..any respect on this whole board is NYCMUZIK..cause he didnt sit back and talk about it..he did it...and no matter how jaded my view of the US may be..i respect that..and him..and every last soldier fighting for this country To say people do not have the courage to fight in the war because they didn't actually go is unfair. The soldiers that fought the war in Iraq and are still over there now were in the military before this whole thing started. Those who were not in the military chose different lives for ourselves. We either go to college, have jobs or sometimes both. I was for the war and I would have fought if I felt my country really needed me. But I wasn't about to drop my classes mid-semester, quit my job, loose my apartment and have my girlfriend out on her ass just to go fight some war that would probably be over by the time I made it out of basic training. It's called common sense. If this was a war on the scale of WWI or WWII, where we needed all the resources and manpower we could get I would have joined in a heartbeat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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