igloo Posted December 10 Report Share Posted December 10 US bar on war opponents from Iraq contracts sparks new storm with alliesWASHINGTON (AFP) - The United States has barred countries that opposed the Iraq (news - web sites) war from bidding for billions of dollars of reconstruction contracts sparking a new storm with allies who did not join the US-led coalition. Germany said the US decision was unacceptable. France said it would see if the move could be legally challenged. Russia's foreign minister insisted the contracts be open to all countries. The three countries led international opposition to the US-British invasion of Iraq in March. The US administration has decided that only countries that joined the coalition can bid for an estimated 18.6 billion dollars of prime reconstruction contracts in Iraq. Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz, in a decision dated December 5, cited "essential security interests" of the United States and the need to encourage countries to provide troops for Iraq as the reason for limiting competition. The contracts range from equipping the new Iraqi army to rebuilding and refurbishing power and water plants, roads, oil installations and communications systems. The Defense Department memorandum listed 63 countries eligible to compete for 26 lead contracts that cover the sweep of Iraq's reconstruction needs. "It is necessary for the protection of the essential security interests of the United States to limit competition for the prime contracts of these procurements to companies from the United States, Iraq, coalition partners and force contributing nations," Wolfowitz said in the memorandum. "Thus it is clearly in the public interest to limit prime contracts to companies from these countries," it said. The document said "every effort must be made to expand international cooperation in Iraq." It noted that since the end of major combat operations, the number of coalition troops from countries other than the United States has increased from 14,000 to 23,7000, allowing the number of US troops to drop by 12,000. "Limiting competition for prime contracts will encourage the expansion of international cooperation in Iraq and in future efforts," it said. Funding for the contracts will come from 18.6 billion dollars approved by Congress last month to underwrite a massive reconstruction program in Iraq. Companies barred from competing as prime contractors will still be able to work as sub-contractors on the Iraqi projects, said Major Joe Yoswa, a Pentagon (news - web sites) spokesman. But Wolfowitz's decision indicates that Washington intends to use the contracts to increase pressure on countries that oppose its Iraq policy. In Berlin, Germany's government spokesman, Bela Anda said that if the memorandum was confirmed "it would be unacceptable." "It would not correspond either to the spirit of what we had agreed together, which is about looking together toward the future and not the past," Anda said. The French government is studying the legality of the US decision, the foreign ministry in Paris said. "We are liaising with our partners, notably the European Union (news - web sites) and Commission, to look into whether these decisions are compatible with international competition law," said ministry spokesman Herve Ladsous. Russian Foreign Minister Igor Ivanov said all countries should be allowed to help rebuild Iraq. "All those countries that are ready to take part in reconstruction in Iraq should be given the opportunity to do so," Ivanov said after talks in Berlin with German counterpart Joschka Fischer. US efforts to raise troops and international funding for Iraq have so far fallen short of Washington's expectations. The European Union pledged 1.3 billion dollars for Iraq's reconstruction, but France and Germany have withheld individual contributions. The United States has also failed to find troops to fill a third multinational division in time for deployment early next year, forcing the redeployment of a Marine division that recently returned from Iraq. The army has warned that returning divisions will be at a low state of readiness for up to six months, leaving only two combat ready divisions available as reinforcements in the event of a conflict in Korea or another trouble spot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr mahs Posted December 10 Report Share Posted December 10 Payback is a bitch..They had a last chance to send support with troops and funds but scoffed at the idea. Typical of the ass backward europeans, they could've given a little up front and their economies as well as the arab world would have benefitted 10 fold in the long run.... TOOLS! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamiroguy1 Posted December 10 Report Share Posted December 10 edit: delete me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamiroguy1 Posted December 10 Report Share Posted December 10 I don't think this is anything to gloat over. If the contracts were being shared with more countries then we probably wouldn't have as many soldiers killed and injured.The United States has also failed to find troops to fill a third multinational division in time for deployment early next year, forcing the redeployment of a Marine division that recently returned from Iraq. The army has warned that returning divisions will be at a low state of readiness for up to six months, leaving only two combat ready divisions available as reinforcements in the event of a conflict in Korea or another trouble spot.How rediculous is this? Make these soldiers pay with they're lives for a political move so Bush can tell France to go fuck themselves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr mahs Posted December 10 Report Share Posted December 10 Originally posted by jamiroguy1 I don't think this is anything to gloat over. If the contracts were being shared with more countries then we probably wouldn't have as many soldiers killed and injured.How rediculous is this? Make these soldiers pay with they're lives for a political move so Bush can tell France to go fuck themselves. Are you retarded? Were you under a rock when we went to the U.N for help and even hinted at dividing the contracts up and they told us to go fawk ourselves? The French wouldn't send troops even if we told them they could have all the contracts, it's matter of saving face for Chirac. We thought the U.N would bury the hatchet and help for the good of Iraq's... we were wrong so now we hit them in their companies pockets... The dollar is mightier then the gun my friend.NO ONE WANTS TO HELP......They want us to fail, why can't you deranged tree huggers get this through your bong hit rotted brains.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
igloo Posted December 10 Author Report Share Posted December 10 Originally posted by mr mahs Are you retarded? Yes, he is...and jamirodick proves it with every post Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmatas2277 Posted December 10 Report Share Posted December 10 Originally posted by jamiroguy1 If the contracts were being shared with more countries then we probably wouldn't have as many soldiers killed and injured. how so? u think France/Germany/Russia would send troops if we gave them contracts? if u do, i underestimated u... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamiroguy1 Posted December 10 Report Share Posted December 10 Originally posted by mrmatas2277 how so? u think France/Germany/Russia would send troops if we gave them contracts? if u do, i underestimated u... Absolutely. They are going to send them for fun. It's about money. They want it just as much as our gov't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmatas2277 Posted December 10 Report Share Posted December 10 Originally posted by jamiroguy1 Absolutely. They are going to send them for fun. It's about money. They want it just as much as our gov't. i disagree...if they cared that much...they would have tried something by now...but they contiually distance themselves from us...u dont want to send troops? fine...but when the war is over, start kissing ass and start "acting" like a superpower (which is an oxymoron when speaking about France)... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamiroguy1 Posted December 10 Report Share Posted December 10 Originally posted by mr mahs NO ONE WANTS TO HELP......But isn't that what the article that igloo posted is all about? They want to help... "Give us some contracts so we can help" but the US is banning them from getting contracts. You just contradicted yourself.Originally posted by igloo Yes, he is...and jamirodick proves it with every post Go fuck a vacuum cleaner you mindless bafoon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamiroguy1 Posted December 10 Report Share Posted December 10 Originally posted by mrmatas2277 i disagree...if they cared that much...they would have tried something by now...but they contiually distance themselves from us...u dont want to send troops? fine...but when the war is over, start kissing ass and start "acting" like a superpower (which is an oxymoron when speaking about France)... That's just it... France doesn't care, I'm sure. They do care about lost pre-war debt owed to them or reconstruction contracts that may never recieve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigpoppanils Posted December 10 Report Share Posted December 10 http://www.nytimes.com/2003/12/10/international/middleeast/10DIPL.htmlA Republican congressman who recently returned from Iraq said in a telephone interview on Tuesday that it was a mistake to exclude particular countries from the rebuilding effort. "It strikes me that we should do whatever we can to draw in the French, the Germans, the Russians and others into the process," said the congressman, Representative Christopher Shays of Connecticut. "I would expect that most of the contracts would go to countries who have done the heavy lifting, but I wouldn't want to see any arbitrary effort to shut anyone out." In a report that he issued on Tuesday with Representative Frank R. Wolf, Republican of Virginia, Mr. Shays said, "The administration should redouble efforts to internationalize the rebuilding of Iraq." also keep in mind that German, French, ad Russian firms can still be subcontractors in Iraq. Many firms from these countries have subcontracting projects underway already. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr mahs Posted December 10 Report Share Posted December 10 Originally posted by jamiroguy1 But isn't that what the article that igloo posted is all about? They want to help... "Give us some contracts so we can help" but the US is banning them from getting contracts. You just contradicted yourself.: It's not supoosed to be "give me contracts and we will help" We didn't go into Iraq for the contracts.. We went in because he was a threat and needed to be removed. The reward of contracts would have easlily been transfered if France for example didn't do everything possible to sidetrack us... from stating they would veto ANYTHING to sending delegates to camaroon for the ney vote... And save the "war for oil" rebuttal because our economy farts 18billion a day in activity.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cintron Posted December 10 Report Share Posted December 10 well i do admit that i'm actually glad to see nations get treated as they SHOULD when they try and shove another nation into the toilet.simply voting against the UN resolution would have been fine - i mean, hell that's part of having the ability to choose...but it's a whole other matter when they go ahead and form an entire coalition AGAINST us, piss us off royally by trying to chop the legs out underneath our every move... [and dont t hink for a second France doesn't enjoy having control over the united states like that]then we offer them a part in all of this, they say no. we go to them and the UN, hat-in-hand, they say no.we say "fine fuck you we'll do it ourselves."now they come to us, hat-in-hand asking for the rewards without having shared a single damn bit in ANY of the suffering and effort...and i am glad we had the balls to tell them to go fuck themselves. About damn time nations start realizing that the world really IS like one big neighborhood, and your neighbor isnt obligated one bit to be nice to you if you've gone through lots of effort to fuck him over and piss him off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
igloo Posted December 10 Author Report Share Posted December 10 Originally posted by cintron well i do admit that i'm actually glad to see nations get treated as they SHOULD when they try and shove another nation into the toilet.simply voting against the UN resolution would have been fine - i mean, hell that's part of having the ability to choose...but it's a whole other matter when they go ahead and form an entire coalition AGAINST us, piss us off royally by trying to chop the legs out underneath our every move... [and dont t hink for a second France doesn't enjoy having control over the united states like that]then we offer them a part in all of this, they say no. we go to them and the UN, hat-in-hand, they say no.we say "fine fuck you we'll do it ourselves."now they come to us, hat-in-hand asking for the rewards without having shared a single damn bit in ANY of the suffering and effort...and i am glad we had the balls to tell them to go fuck themselves. About damn time nations start realizing that the world really IS like one big neighborhood, and your neighbor isnt obligated one bit to be nice to you if you've gone through lots of effort to fuck him over and piss him off. Excellent and on point!It seems there are many here who wish to be revisionist historians in the continual effort to ALWAYS figure out a way to point a finger of blame at the U.S.......If anything, the behavior of Russia, France, and Germany becomes more deplorable with each passing day.....for their behavior against the U.S., and for their behavior against the Iraqi people....The anti-war folks should be in an uproar about the behavior of these countries....after all, the anti-war folks are sooooooo concerned with the welfare of the ordinary Iraqi...aren't they?.....What has these countries done to help the Iraqi people??Avert war and continue to support Saddam Hussein?......Refuse to help in the reconstruction efforts?...Refuse to improve stability and security?....Russia, Germany, and especially France have made this entire situation worse, from the very beginning and continue to do soAnd put simply, it has cost lives....I do not care what side of the fence you sit on with respects to whether the U.S. should have fought this war........but to ignore the detriment that these countries have caused is shameful, disgraceful, blind, and completely hypocritical....To defend these countries in any way is an absolute joke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr mahs Posted December 10 Report Share Posted December 10 Originally posted by cintron well i do admit that i'm actually glad to see nations get treated as they SHOULD when they try and shove another nation into the toilet.simply voting against the UN resolution would have been fine - i mean, hell that's part of having the ability to choose...but it's a whole other matter when they go ahead and form an entire coalition AGAINST us, piss us off royally by trying to chop the legs out underneath our every move... [and dont t hink for a second France doesn't enjoy having control over the united states like that]then we offer them a part in all of this, they say no. we go to them and the UN, hat-in-hand, they say no.we say "fine fuck you we'll do it ourselves."now they come to us, hat-in-hand asking for the rewards without having shared a single damn bit in ANY of the suffering and effort...and i am glad we had the balls to tell them to go fuck themselves. About damn time nations start realizing that the world really IS like one big neighborhood, and your neighbor isnt obligated one bit to be nice to you if you've gone through lots of effort to fuck him over and piss him off. I couldn't agree with you more Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamiroguy1 Posted December 10 Report Share Posted December 10 There's a thin line between having balls and being stupid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
igloo Posted December 10 Author Report Share Posted December 10 Originally posted by jamiroguy1 There's a thin line between having balls and being stupid. And you are have clearly crossed the line on the side of stupid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr mahs Posted December 10 Report Share Posted December 10 Originally posted by jamiroguy1 There's a thin line between having balls and being stupid. Let me ask you something....What makes you think France can lend the resources that would make Iraq a Disney Land overnight? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
igloo Posted December 10 Author Report Share Posted December 10 Originally posted by igloo Excellent and on point!It seems there are many here who wish to be revisionist historians in the continual effort to ALWAYS figure out a way to point a finger of blame at the U.S.......If anything, the behavior of Russia, France, and Germany becomes more deplorable with each passing day.....for their behavior against the U.S., and for their behavior against the Iraqi people....The anti-war folks should be in an uproar about the behavior of these countries....after all, the anti-war folks are sooooooo concerned with the welfare of the ordinary Iraqi...aren't they?.....What has these countries done to help the Iraqi people??Avert war and continue to support Saddam Hussein?......Refuse to help in the reconstruction efforts?...Refuse to improve stability and security?....Russia, Germany, and especially France have made this entire situation worse, from the very beginning and continue to do soAnd put simply, it has cost lives....I do not care what side of the fence you sit on with respects to whether the U.S. should have fought this war........but to ignore the detriment that these countries have caused is shameful, disgraceful, blind, and completely hypocritical....To defend these countries in any way is an absolute joke I would also like to add the following:Akila al-Hasemi, the Iraqi Governing Council member now fighting for her life (she has sinced passed away)in an American military hospital after an assassination attempt on Sept. 20. Only ten days earlier, the former diplomat had visited the Quai D'Orsay and, according to the New York Times, "admonished the French not to try to drive a wedge between the U.S. and the new Iraqi government by offering a tempting plan for quick sovereignty."It is al-Hasemi's parting words to her French hosts that bear repeating: "Don't think the Iraqis will ever forget what the Americans did in liberating them. We will not allow the Americans to fail."Too bad the French do not feel the same way Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cintron Posted December 10 Report Share Posted December 10 yeah seriously. France is really pissing me off.like i said it's one thing to disagree with the stance of another nation, but it's another thing to actively go and try to derail everything that nation does just so you can bring them to heel and feel like one of the big boys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmatas2277 Posted December 10 Report Share Posted December 10 Originally posted by jamiroguy1 There's a thin line between having balls and being stupid. yea i hear u...but we have gone this far without any help...why should we turn over on our sides b/c NOW the OTHER greedy countries want in? i am sorry...call it pride or stupidty...but if u werent there for us AT ANY point, why should we let u in now that there is SOME kind of stability? just makes no sense... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmatas2277 Posted December 10 Report Share Posted December 10 Originally posted by cintron like i said it's one thing to disagree with the stance of another nation, but it's another thing to actively go and try to derail everything that nation does just so you can bring them to heel and feel like one of the big boys. well lets see how well they do wearing the "Big Boy" pants now... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamiroguy1 Posted December 10 Report Share Posted December 10 Originally posted by igloo And you are have clearly crossed the line on the side of stupid Go fuck your motherOriginally posted by mr mahs Let me ask you something....What makes you think France can lend the resources that would make Iraq a Disney Land overnight? Our military is streached too thin and we're not going to do it by ourselves. France, Russia, Germany could only help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cintron Posted December 10 Report Share Posted December 10 "The interests of a political settlement of the situation in Iraq and the rebuilding of Iraq are best served by uniting the efforts of the international community, and not splitting it," Russian Foreign Minister Igor Ivanov said, visiting Berlin. hilarious.I wonder where he was a year ago when we were asking that exact same thing of HIM, France and Germany.fuck europe and their self righteousness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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