Suprise!!!!!!!!!

[obby]

Since no one has mentioned it I will.

Today history was made. I am sure most of you know what I am talking about. Bremer handed over full sovereignty to Iraqi interim government two days ahead of schedule. It was brilliant!!!!!! Pulled the rug out from under the terrorist who probably had planned to sabotage the transfer of power. Paul Bremer is already on his way back to the States and Nato has just agreed to give assistance to Iraq. Don't expect the Bush haters to acknowledge this.....IT WAS BRILLIANT!

[jamiroguy1]

Full sovereignty? lol

[mursa]

.... things are still a mess and will only get worse ..............it was a nice tear jerking ceremony though, i give you that .

[jtk4]

"Here is your country, good luck"

good move doing it early, now those terrorist bomb won't work.

We still have a long way to go with this iraqi quagmire, just to ensure it does not turn into Iran, like in '78. Hopefully everything will work out and the people of iraq learn the democracy is a good thing. Blowing people up is a bad thing. I am glad the un finally realizes that a free iraq is good for everyone, they left us holding our dick for long enough.

[sobeton]

hopefully we start delegating more authority, and surrendering some of ours. then we can start bringing some of our Men and Women home. then perhaps we can see some light at the end of the tunnel.. right now all which is visible is a flicker. I remain cautiously optimistic.

[mrmatas2277]

.... things are still a mess and will only get worse ..............it was a nice tear jerking ceremony though, i give you that .

like the ceremony that Holland will be at after they beat Portugal?

[sobeton]

like the ceremony that Holland will be at after they beat Portugal?

that's a low blow, even for you ..

[mrmatas2277]

that's a low blow, even for you ..

...ur right...i apologize...

[obby]

.... things are still a mess and will only get worse ..............it was a nice tear jerking ceremony though, i give you that .

the sky is falling, the sky is falling. somebody save me! it's all Bush's fault. I'm incapable of any sort of success w/out direct gov't assistance at the cost of the producers of this society to be redistributed to the non-producers of this society.....AKA-> Socialism..............

I thank God (oops, did I just say God? Isn't it "en vogue" to classify "God" as a bad word these days?) that this country had leaders guided by PRINCIPLES rather than public opinion or polls. Without the great leaders guided by CORE PRINCIPLES America would have never taken the great risks which ended slavery, communism and which now combats terrorism.

I've always found I get much more out of life when I live it optimistic rather than pessimistic. As for "conspiracy theories", they're a dime a dozen. I tend to think more logically. If a story sounds too crazy or too twisted, it probably is. That's when I question the source and then use perspective to come to my conclusion. To listen to the news today and any mis-guided or ill-informed person would think anything bad that happens in their life is due to 1 thing and one thing only,,,,,BUSH! BUSH DID IT!.....Wild fires-Bush did it. Twisters- Bush did it. Black out- Bush did it. Terrorism- Bush did it. "Stealing oil- Bush did it. Abusing terrorist prisoners- Bush did it. Beheading civilians and soldiers- Bush did. 9/11- Bush knew and did nothing. And the beat goes on............................................................

Only pure ignorance would lead a human being to make sense of that non-sense I just wrote about Bush. America-hating has become the new fad. As an objective observer I can only say that's the small price to pay for being the BIG DOG. Lots of playa' hater's doing the only thing they know how to do, playa hate! I assume it's because it's easier to just sit back and critique rather than actually do something and make something out of oneself. Damn lazy Americans! LOL

Good day.

[mursa]

It's not about pessimism or optimism ....it's really about REALITY at the moment , and its a mess over there .

[jtk4]

What are the CORE PRINCIPLES you talk about, i am just curious.

Is it life liberty and the persuit of happiness.

Is it democracy.

????

What does everyone think these princibles are?

[bigpoppanils]

the sky is falling, the sky is falling. somebody save me! it's all Bush's fault. I'm incapable of any sort of success w/out direct gov't assistance at the cost of the producers of this society to be redistributed to the non-producers of this society.....AKA-> Socialism..............

its funny that you should say this...considering that the US is helping Iraq set up systems of free health care and free education (including college).

[johnnyrevs]

like the ceremony that Holland will be at after they beat Portugal?

I doubt it

[obby]

I'm kind of tired today so I will try to explain myself and my beliefs as detailed as possible and leave it at that.

It's not about pessimism or optimism ....it's really about REALITY at the moment , and its a mess over there .

It obviously about REALITY, but OPTIMISM is merely the vehicle clear thinking individuals use to reach their goal. MORAL CLARITY lights the way, MORAL BANKRUPTCY never does and only clouds the issue/s. Being "moderate" is not a trait which leads to any greatness. NEVER HAS, NEVER WILL! I challenge you to find me a book, any book, on GREAT MODERATES IN HISTORY. You won't find it because they DON'T EXIST.

In today's world, as we find it, things are tough and more dangerous than ever. This is precisely the time for leaders w/ moral clarity guided by their core principles. Today's problems need cures, not band-aides. Sometimes tough love or medicine is not easy to swallow. Regardless, they're necessary if one expects the REAL PROBLEMS of today to resolved rather than contained.

You're right, terrorism IS A MESS! Hence, it's definition:

TERRORISM

n : the systematic use of violence as a means to intimidate or coerce societies or governments

So, either we stand up to terrorism for the good of humanity or we cower to it as some nations have done and continue to do (I.e.. America, Saudi Arabia & Spain -> we should all NOW KNOW that "containment" does not work. Trying to "understand their pain" does not work and IGNORING it does not work.). Terrorist declared war on America in 1993, we basically ignored it (and every attack,,,wtc 93, kobar towers, USS Cole, etc..) and that led to 9/11. Saudi Arabia makes deals w/ terrorists so they'll leave them alone, only to have these killers continue to bomb and kill in their nation, let alone having 15 of 19 9/11 hijackers on-board those planes. Spain elected a pacifist after losing almost 200 people in a train bombing. So, my point is simple, WEAKNESS does not deter terrorist, it only emboldens them to do more acts of terror (hence, the examples I just wrote).

I don't know about you, but I'm tired of tripping over the same rock. It's about life and death now. The stakes have never been greater! We are in uncharted territory in the war on terror. There is no "blue print" which will be accepted by ALL as to "how" to combat it (if you've got one, by all means, SHARE IT!). But make no mistake, it must be fought, ON ALL FRONTS or life as we know it will cease to exist. Call me crazy, but my perspective on this is logical (to me at least). ONE SIDE HAS TO WIN BEFORE ANY PROGRESS CAN BE MADE. Guess what? I WANT TO WIN! WE NEED TO WIN! Later, after we've won, then I'll worry more about "UNDERSTANDING" why they hate us and how we can help them better understand why we believe "freedom and democracy" is a God given right which betters the entire world. We are living proof of what freedom, democracy and capitalism can provide. No, it's not perfect and guess what, NOTHING EVER WILL BE (so let's not kid ourselves). But it's by far the best and a proven system with the best hope for all.

For me, it doesn't get any more "REAL" than that.

Good day

What are the CORE PRINCIPLES you talk about, i am just curious.

Is it life liberty and the persuit of happiness.

Is it democracy.

????

What does everyone think these princibles are?

prin·ci·ple ( P ) Pronunciation Key (prns-pl)

n.

A basic truth, law, or assumption: the principles of democracy.

A rule or standard, especially of good behavior: a man of principle.

The collectivity of moral or ethical standards or judgments: a decision based on principle rather than expediency.

A fixed or predetermined policy or mode of action.

A basic or essential quality or element determining intrinsic nature or characteristic behavior: the principle of self-preservation.

Core principles IMHO can be defined simply as the ability to clearly decipher the difference between right and wrong. Moral clarity. This is a trait ALL great leaders have had. It cannot be faked. One either has it or they don't.

Soooooooo to put this into context, I truly believe the president we have in office today is guided by his core principles. He has taken strong stands on some unpopular issues. He has shown leadership. A leaders job should be to make the tough decisions most people are unwilling or incapable of doing. History has proven that leaders who have been guided by these "core principles" have not always been the "most popular". Lincoln was so unpopular, we had a civil war. He stuck to his principles and he freed the slaves. Reagan & JFK believed communism was wrong and was just another form of enslaving human beings. They both drew lines in the sand when it wasn't the most popular thing to do, taking HUGE risks doing so, because they were guided by their "core principles", etc.................. History has proved them right.

Good day

its funny that you should say this...considering that the US is helping Iraq set up systems of free health care and free education (including college).

Look man, with all do respect this is what I mean when I stress some folks here stop being lazy and "educate" themselves before spewing some of this psycho-babble. NOTHING IN LIFE IS FREE! Remember that, write it down, take a picture, I don't give a f*%k. NOTHING IS FREE! Someone is paying for it. This goes back to re-distribution of wealth. No nation has even become great nor wealthy by EXTORTING from the PRODUCERS of society to re-distribute it to the NON-PRODUCERS of that same society. It's NEVER, EVER worked. It's been tried (aka-communism/socialism), and it's proven to NOT WORK. So, again, with all due respect, get a clue!

Good day

[bigpoppanils]

Look man, with all do respect this is what I mean when I stress some folks here stop being lazy and "educate" themselves before spewing some of this psycho-babble. NOTHING IN LIFE IS FREE! Remember that, write it down, take a picture, I don't give a f*%k. NOTHING IS FREE! Someone is paying for it. This goes back to re-distribution of wealth. No nation has even become great nor wealthy by EXTORTING from the PRODUCERS of society to re-distribute it to the NON-PRODUCERS of that same society. It's NEVER, EVER worked. It's been tried (aka-communism/socialism), and it's proven to NOT WORK. So, again, with all due respect, get a clue!

if it doesnt work...then why is the US setting it up in iraq?

is it the US that needs a clue? if so, i want to know why you hate the US so much.

[jtk4]

We have to set up free health care and education in Iraq because the mojority of people are to poor. Now i understand in the us there are people in the same boat, but i will go on a limb and say these people are worse. Until the country gets on their feet, and people start to make more money then you will see it change.

"Core principles IMHO can be defined simply as the ability to clearly decipher the difference between right and wrong. Moral clarity. This is a trait ALL great leaders have had. It cannot be faked. One either has it or they don't."

the problem is what some people consider right and wrong is not what other people do. It seems that the princibles are on a sliding scale, that differ from one person to the next. You also have to consider what might be right for your family might actually harm your neighbors. Good answer though i was just curious what everyone thought.