terrorists

[babbo]

When we kill an iraqi it is ok because we are freeing iraq and protecting ourselves so it is OK.

When a terrorist kills someone they believe they are ??? ah serving allah, killing infidels. I am not sure but from their point of view they thing they are right.

you have lost your way

[babbo]

NO not me dude.

I am not saying it is ok, and if someone wants me dead i really do not give a fuck why, i just know I have to protect myself. Which is what i hope our country is doing. I was thinking more philisophical then practical. We are past the point in this age to reverse any bad will.

yes you dude..they want you dead, and me..and anyone else...not an islamo-fascist...thats the end of your understanding lesson

[mursa]

in your word..as long as you give any reason..murdering is aok..

It's not Ok by any means , but you also have to understand that THERE IS A REASON for the chechens to do what they are doing .

1...they want their own intependant muslim state ( muslims are a majority in chechyna) and the russians won't allow it .

2... the russians also kill chechens and commit human crimes against an impoverished nation ( just like they did against Afghanies during the Afghan war) ..

..there's always two sides to a coin...thats all im implying .

[babbo]

It's not Ok by any means , but you also have to understand that THERE IS A REASON for the chechens to do what they are doing .

1...they want their own intependant muslim state ( muslims are a majority in chechyna) and the russians won't allow it .

2... the russians also kill chechens and commit human crimes against an impoverished nation ( just like they did against Afghanies during the Afghan war) ..

..there's always two sides to a coin...thats all im implying .

you are whitewashing, justying ,excusing, and appeasing these murderers. they hav e no place in the human race..there is no reason to murder those children- repeat no reason..call them what they are-murderes- and oh, btw- reuters reporting 10 of these murderes in that russian schoool- are from arab nations... how utterly surprising( sarcastic)- why would you justify their murdering actions?? perhaps their grandfather lost a bat gammon game to a moscowite in 1953... that seems like a justifyable reason for them to murder...but not the holocaust survivors actions( sarcastic)

there was a reason why jeffrey dommer ate/killed people- is that aok with you as well.?? there are no excuses, no reasons to murder school children, or the other hundreds or thousands of terrorist acts around the globe..many of them are fueled by islamic fascists- murders- terrorist- it is a war- kill or be killed- proterct the innocent- kill the killers

[jtk4]

So you are comparing voices in a persons head telling you to kill to having your mother raped or killled as the same thing. If your brother or siser was killed would you feel the same way?

Reasons can not be clumped together like that, some are valid some are not.

But there is still no reason to kill kids, imho.

and i am not saying that is why this happened just using an example.

[mursa]

you are whitewashing, justying ,excusing, and appeasing these murderers. they hav e no place in the human race..there is no reason to murder those children- repeat no reason..call them what they are-murderes- and oh, btw- reuters reporting 10 of these murderes in that russian schoool- are from arab nations... how utterly surprising( sarcastic)- why would you justify their murdering actions?? perhaps their grandfather lost a bat gammon game to a moscowite in 1953... that seems like a justifyable reason for them to murder...but not the holocaust survivors actions( sarcastic)

there was a reason why jeffrey dommer ate/killed people- is that aok with you as well.?? there are no excuses, no reasons to murder school children, or the other hundreds or thousands of terrorist acts around the globe..many of them are fueled by islamic fascists- murders- terrorist- it is a war- kill or be killed- proterct the innocent- kill the killers

Definetly understandable.....killing kids is a cowardise shame .....but don't forget that not everybody (like you and me ) think the same ................In their own "warped" mind they believe its excusable .

.

.........im only trying to point out that aspect .

[igloo]

WHEN THE KILLERS COME FOR THE KIDS

BY RALPH PETERS

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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September 4, 2004 -- THE mass murder of children revolts the human psyche. Herod sending his henchmen to massacre the infants of Bethlehem haunts the Gospels. Nothing in our time was crueler than what the Germans did to children during the Holocaust. Slaughtering the innocents violates a universal human taboo.

Or a nearly universal one. Those Muslims who preach Jihad against the West decided years ago that killing Jewish or Christian children is not only acceptable, but pleasing to their god when done by "martyrs."

It isn't politically correct to say this, of course. We're supposed to pretend that Islam is a "religion of peace." All right, then: It's time for Muslims to stand up for the once-noble, nearly lost traditions of their faith and condemn what Arab and Chechen terrorists and blasphemers did in the Russian town of Beslan.

If Muslim religious leaders around the world will not publicly condemn the taking of children as hostages and their subsequent slaughter — if those "men of faith" will not issue a condemnation without reservations or caveats — then no one need pretend any longer that all religions are equally sound and moral.

Islam has been a great and humane faith in the past. Now far too many of its adherents condone, actively or passively, the mass murder of school kids. Instead of condemnations of the Muslim "Jihadis" responsible for butchering more than 200 women and children in cold blood, we will hear spiteful counter-accusations about imaginary atrocities supposedly committed by Western militaries.

Well, the cold fact is that Western soldiers, whether Americans, Brits, Russians or Israelis, do not take hundreds of children hostage, then shoot them in cold blood while detonating bombs in their midst. The Muslim world can lie to itself, but we need lie no longer.

The tragedy in southern Russia occurred thousands of miles from the United States, but, in essence, that massacre happened next door. The parents, teachers and students kept for days without water or food in a sweltering school building before being butchered were our children, our sisters, our wives, our parents.

The mass hostage situation wasn't about Chechen rebels (and at least 10 Arabs) opposing the Russian government. It was a continuation of the universal struggle between good and evil. And there is no doubt which side is evil, scorned though the word may be by our own elite.

How can any human being with a shred of conscience dismiss what occurred in that school as anything less than evil?

The attack in Beslan wasn't about Russia's brutal incompetence in Chechnya — as counter-productive as Moscow's grim heavy-handedness may have been. It was about religious bigotry so profound that the believer can hold a gun to a child's head, pull the trigger and term the act "divine justice."

We will hear complaints that the Russian special forces should have waited — even after the terrorists began shooting children. Negotiations are the heroin of Westerners addicted to self-delusion. Who among us would have waited when he or she saw fleeing children cut down by automatic weapons? The urge to protect children is as primal as any impulse we ever feel.

Make no mistake: No blame attaches to the Russians for the massacre at that school. The guilt is entirely upon the Islamic extremists who have led the religion they claim to cherish into the realms of nightmare.

There will be repercussions. Having suffered the hijacking and destruction of two passenger jets, a deadly bombing at a Moscow subway station and a massacre in a primary school all in less than two weeks, the Kremlin will have learned to rue the day it imagined that there was anything to gain by opposing American efforts against terrorists, whether Osama bin Laden or Saddam Hussein.

As they inevitably do, the terrorists reminded the world of their heartless barbarism. Even if France manages to beg the release of its kidnapped journalists in Iraq, it has begun to sense its vulnerability. And all Europeans with a vestige of sense will recognize that the school seizure in Russia could easily repeat itself in Languedoc or Umbria, Bavaria or Kent.

An attack on children is an attack on all of humanity.

No matter what differences Western states discover to divide them, the terrorists will bring us together in the end. Their atrocities expose all wishful thinking for what it is.

A final thought: Did any of those protesters who came to Manhattan to denounce our liberation of 50 million Muslims stay an extra day to protest the massacre in Russia? Of course not.

The protesters no more care for dead Russian children than they care for dead Kurds or for the hundreds of thousands of Arabs that Saddam Hussein executed. Or for the ongoing Arab-Muslim slaughter of blacks in Sudan. Nothing's a crime to those protesters unless the deed was committed by America.

The butchery in Russia was a crime against humanity. In every respect. Was any war ever more necessary or just than the War on Terror?

And what will terror's apologists say when the killers come for their own children?

Ralph Peters is the author of "Beyond Terror: Strategy in a Changing World."

[babbo]

Definetly understandable.....killing kids is a cowardise shame .....but don't forget that not everybody (like you and me ) think the same ................In their own "warped" mind they believe its excusable .

.

.........im only trying to point out that aspect .

its amazes me that you cannot call them what they are...murdering.cowards, not worthy of being in the human race..and not worthy of living..you seem to whitewash them and their" understandable " acti9ons...

[jtk4]

holy shit igloo i was waiting for kerry to be blamed somewhere in that article

babbo we get it the are shitbags, we all understand that. after we get over that fact we try to undeerstand why, but just because we try to understand why it does not mean we condone it. They are still shit bags.

[babbo]

holy shit igloo i was waiting for kerry to be blamed somewhere in that article

babbo we get it the are shitbags, we all understand that. after we get over that fact we try to undeerstand why, but just because we try to understand why it does not mean we condone it. They are still shit bags.

understand your response...after the war is over..take time to "understand"..in the menatime elimainate them b/4 they kill you..or some one close to you...basically they want us all dead....DO YOU UNDERSTAND THAT???

[jtk4]

damn that was quick, whats happening? this saturday work shit blows.

When i started this thread it was more of a look at tactics that would have to be used by countries or people that could not have a conventional war. Art of war shit you know. i mean shit Iraq really couldn't have a conventional war against us.

I really did not want to turn this into this. Do you think it would be easier to kill the terrorist if we understand them? Or would that not really matter?

just throwing shit out there

[babbo]

damn that was quick, whats happening? this saturday work shit blows.

When i started this thread it was more of a look at tactics that would have to be used by countries or people that could not have a conventional war. Art of war shit you know. i mean shit Iraq really couldn't have a conventional war against us.

I really did not want to turn this into this. Do you think it would be easier to kill the terrorist if we understand them? Or would that not really matter?

just throwing shit out there

to understand them is not the issue..do you need to understand a bomb before it blows up a bus full of civilians, do the kids in russia need to understand why over 340 people died there the other day...answer the questions yourself

[jtk4]

no, but it would be easier to defuse that bomb if you understood it. What about if you know your enemy you miht be able to tell where they will strike next. I do not believe this war on terror can be won. There will always be someone willing to give up their life to kill us.If we catch the leaders thee will be other that come up.The kids over there now are getting trained to hate us. I mean is there an answer? kill everyone? Do you undestand that?

[babbo]

no, but it would be easier to defuse that bomb if you understood it. What about if you know your enemy you miht be able to tell where they will strike next. I do not believe this war on terror can be won. There will always be someone willing to give up their life to kill us.If we catch the leaders thee will be other that come up.The kids over there now are getting trained to hate us. I mean is there an answer? kill everyone? Do you undestand that?

yes..i understand that..i also understand they are hell bent on eliminating us..and the only thing they understand is the sword.. not words, not negotiations, not understanding of them, or they understanding us, no peace, there is no understanding on THEIR part

[igloo]

holy shit igloo i was waiting for kerry to be blamed somewhere in that article

QUOTE]

lol......but I think that article was completely on point

[fresinha12]

since when did u get to be the judge who belongs to human race and who doesnt?? as for one sound principle, I have lived by, dont piss off anyone to the extent that they are willing to kill u, even if it means their own death...

I believe what we all need to understand is that fanatism is a very dangerous disease, even more than aids etc, and it inflicts a lot more of humans than we like acknowledge. fanasticsim infects us americans as much as it does to other nationalities..maybe a bit more for us, since we are brought up watching too much violence on TV....

I remember during one of my tours of duty prior to 9/11 one of our privates (he happened to be hispanic) came to me that there was short fall of amunition, I asked what the hell happened, he replied they guys at the base were using the bullets on seagulls as target practise....I dont know about you, but it shocked me that those seagulls were shot so we could sharpen our skills to kill...even though it meant taking a life of a creature...without knowing its language, we didnt even know if those seagulls were part of family or not....since we dont speak and those birds dont belong to our species somehow we were OK to use as targets...

you are whitewashing, justying ,excusing, and appeasing these murderers. they hav e no place in the human race..there is no reason to murder those children- repeat no reason..call them what they are-murderes- and oh, btw- reuters reporting 10 of these murderes in that russian schoool- are from arab nations... how utterly surprising( sarcastic)- why would you justify their murdering actions?? perhaps their grandfather lost a bat gammon game to a moscowite in 1953... that seems like a justifyable reason for them to murder...but not the holocaust survivors actions( sarcastic)

there was a reason why jeffrey dommer ate/killed people- is that aok with you as well.?? there are no excuses, no reasons to murder school children, or the other hundreds or thousands of terrorist acts around the globe..many of them are fueled by islamic fascists- murders- terrorist- it is a war- kill or be killed- proterct the innocent- kill the killers

[fresinha12]

no i think the article is a piece of shit...more like moslem hating...just like anti-semitism...based on prejudicial view points, I notice that its a lot more common amongst people from NY...and i believe Igloo is one of those!

chechens are at least thought to be moslem but actually some are totally ignorant of islam. The famous black widows of chechenistan are group of women who lost a loved one either a husband, father, son or brother at the hands of the russian army. they are just simply out to take revenge on the russian and settle a score...one of these black widows was arrested and later interviewed by a british paper, and the author was shocked to learn that these women didnt know abc of islam, there is an excellent program on BBC on the black widows, I suggest you watch b4 u cut paste total crap...

I for one have no particular desire for any religon, but I take as duty to learn what so many fellow humans follow, this concept of god and haven seems very strange to me personally but, I see some very logical and socially beneficial aspects to all religons...I think after talking to some of my chrisitan, jewish, moslem, hindu friends...I have come to a conclusion each person describes religon based on their personal views...forget the rituals, I am talking about the essence, the spirit of the religion and its unique to each person.....therein lies the problem in my opinion, It is not the fault of a religon but rather the fault in humans who follow it...

holy shit igloo i was waiting for kerry to be blamed somewhere in that article

QUOTE]

lol......but I think that article was completely on point

[babbo]

since when did u get to be the judge who belongs to human race and who doesnt?? as for one sound principle, I have lived by, dont piss off anyone to the extent that they are willing to kill u, even if it means their own death...

I believe what we all need to understand is that fanatism is a very dangerous disease, even more than aids etc, and it inflicts a lot more of humans than we like acknowledge. fanasticsim infects us americans as much as it does to other nationalities..maybe a bit more for us, since we are brought up watching too much violence on TV....

I remember during one of my tours of duty prior to 9/11 one of our privates (he happened to be hispanic) came to me that there was short fall of amunition, I asked what the hell happened, he replied they guys at the base were using the bullets on seagulls as target practise....I dont know about you, but it shocked me that those seagulls were shot so we could sharpen our skills to kill...even though it meant taking a life of a creature...without knowing its language, we didnt even know if those seagulls were part of family or not....since we dont speak and those birds dont belong to our species somehow we were OK to use as targets...

..so you are aok with acts of terrorism,-murdereing terrorists-- like those kids killed in russia recently, and all the others over the years, your post adds up to whitewashing and appeasement.. understanding why some one kills you...= appeasement, might be aok if you want to wait till they come for you, its not aok with me

[fresinha12]

ASk yourself why would anyone come after u to kill u.....I for one havent hurt anyone or violated anyone, I have no reason to believe anyone will come after me....

if u believe u r wanted, then its clear u have some shady past to hide...y dont u come clear explain what u did babbo?

..so you are aok with acts of terrorism,-murdereing terrorists-- like those kids killed in russia recently, and all the others over the years, your post adds up to whitewashing and appeasement.. understanding why some one kills you...= appeasement, might be aok if you want to wait till they come for you, its not aok with me

[babbo]

ASk yourself why would anyone come after u to kill u.....I for one havent hurt anyone or violated anyone, I have no reason to believe anyone will come after me....

if u believe u r wanted, then its clear u have some shady past to hide...y dont u come clear explain what u did babbo?

you are extremely naive...extremely.....keep your head in the sand...they won't be able to kill you, you will die of asfixiation...tell me..what did those school kids do to deserve to be murdred, what did those people in the trade towers do to be murdered..on and on and on...darn..you are naive

[thrillfire]

holy shit igloo i was waiting for kerry to be blamed somewhere in that article

QUOTE]

lol......but I think that article was completely on point

I agree, i think that article was good in pointing out unresolved issues,

the number is not 200 dead but much more and growing to be closer to 800... I hope the russian goverement wakes up from its corruption and ignorance and reconstructs the way the country is governed. There is no excuse for the terrorists i don't care where they are from.. its doesn't matter, the thing that matters is that they have killed children, hundreds of them, chechnia is a horrible place and the terrorists from that region have spilled over the other muslim republics nearby killing muslims in Uzbekistan and other nations.. who have been nutruel and peaceful and in good relations with Russia. I know people from Moscow who had to leave their lives behind to go back to their country/republic (muslim) to protect their families from chechens..

I think almost all religion has had blood on its hands... Uneducated people with no influence or communication with the developed world is a serial weapon cause he can be easily brainwashed and used as a weapon of his religion.

[jtk4]

we do not get all up in arms when russians kill chechian kids. That place is fucked.