rjjnyc Posted January 9 Report Share Posted January 9 Never went to the 46th St. space so never thought about posting this anywhere before, but after seeing a clip from an online documentary about Jonathan Peters era SF and re-reading this mailing, I realized that it is actually an irony-filled historical document (e.g. "New York's premier Gay Alternative Underground Nightclub" "gay men and women come to our club to have fun with other gay men and women") that appeared right on the cusp of the big changes that occurred in NYC clubs in the mid-90s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lunic Posted January 10 Report Share Posted January 10 i remember this was one of the , if not the invite for the opening partyon 46th street...jonathan peters was not playing yet...eddie baez played opening night, sf on 46th was trying to push baez at first....jonathan peters came later on..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bella53081 Posted January 10 Report Share Posted January 10 interesting flyers. where did u find that? just as a side note: people are always reminiscing about how things used to b back years ago...i wish i was living down here then to know what went down....moved down here almost 3 years ago......before i moved here i went to exit and centro fly a few times and a rave, but ever since i got here and started going out regularly all i hear about is how the scene is dead now...from what i hear people say, it seems like everything was so much better, better people, clubs, message boards<??>....w/e maybe so, i still have fun now when i go out, just wish i knew to really compare Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wakeup Posted January 10 Report Share Posted January 10 interesting flyers. where did u find that? just as a side note: people are always reminiscing about how things used to b back years ago...i wish i was living down here then to know what went down....moved down here almost 3 years ago......before i moved here i went to exit and centro fly a few times and a rave, but ever since i got here and started going out regularly all i hear about is how the scene is dead now...from what i hear people say, it seems like everything was so much better, better people, clubs, message boards<??>....w/e maybe so, i still have fun now when i go out, just wish i knew to really comparethose who know know Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjjnyc Posted January 10 Author Report Share Posted January 10 It was sent to the mailing list, it's postmarked Jun 1996 so the "Seasons Greetings" are a little weird. Wasn't taking a potshot at the later incarnation of the club by posting this, there was just some comment in the video about the original club being gay only because Junior's following was, which strikes me as a silly rewriting of history. It was interesting to learn that Richard Grant stuck to his ethos in a lot of ways, taking care of the clientele with free fruit and water fountains, maintaining the sound system, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lunic Posted January 10 Report Share Posted January 10 It was sent to the mailing list, it's postmarked Jun 1996 so the "Seasons Greetings" are a little weird. Wasn't taking a potshot at the later incarnation of the club by posting this, there was just some comment in the video about the original club being gay only because Junior's following was, which strikes me as a silly rewriting of history. It was interesting to learn that Richard Grant stuck to his ethos in a lot of ways, taking care of the clientele with free fruit and water fountains, maintaining the sound system, etc.weird about the june postmark cuz i remember opening night being very cold, but don't hold me to that. the orig. sound factory on 27th was 90% gay i'd say.... when you don't have hold of the market you must compromise so it wasn't surprising to see jr's crowd go from very gay to straight during his twilo residency. although richard grant did do a great job with the initial stages fo sound factory on 46th street it just wasn't clicking with the public. back then jr. was running the show and there was nothing the club could've done to bring over the orig. sound factory crowd other than bringing jr. himself., which wasn't going to happen. all the shows, performances & pagentry, huge flyers that sound facotry on 46th street displayed during the height of jon peters was a direct continuation of what was going on at 27th street with jr. vasquez. in the end it's all good cuz jP and richard grant exposed a side of nitelife to straight crowds that they would have never seen cuz it was exclusive and targeted towards gay crowds.....NYC NITELIFE NEEDS TO IMITATE ART ONCE AGAIN!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjjnyc Posted January 10 Author Report Share Posted January 10 I was thinking perhaps it might be Jan not Jun but I don't think so (see below). It's maybe also worth mentioning that the original SF crowd had already undergone at least two big shifts prior to it closing; the influx of more and more Roxy queens in 92/93 (along with a drop in numbers of black & latino gay men and former Garage heads) and then the influx of curious but rather clueless straight people over the course of 94 which, along with Junior's shift to a harder more monotonous sound (or at least longer periods of that kind of sound), changed the vibe of the club dramatically. The tragic reality is also that "the monster" (as people used to call HIV) had cut a terrible swathe through the crowd that populated the club when it first opened in 89. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lunic Posted January 10 Report Share Posted January 10 I was thinking perhaps it might be Jan not Jun but I don't think so (see below). It's maybe also worth mentioning that the original SF crowd had already undergone at least two big shifts prior to it closing; the influx of more and more Roxy queens in 92/93 (along with a drop in numbers of black & latino gay men and former Garage heads) and then the influx of curious but rather clueless straight people over the course of 94 which, along with Junior's shift to a harder more monotonous sound (or at least longer periods of that kind of sound), changed the vibe of the club dramatically. The tragic reality is also that "the monster" (as people used to call HIV) had cut a terrible swathe through the crowd that populated the club when it first opened in 89. well your statements and their accuracy could only come from someone who was around back then, i guess, so cheeers i stepped into sf in 89 and didn't come out until it's last night in 95 i believei did see the phases and shifts in crowds which at the end was kind of annoying as our lil'treasure on 27th was dicovered by the masses..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjjnyc Posted January 10 Author Report Share Posted January 10 well your statements and their accuracy could only come from someone who was around back then, i guess, so cheeers i stepped into sf in 89 and didn't come out until it's last night in 95 i believei did see the phases and shifts in crowds which at the end was kind of annoying as our lil'treasure on 27th was dicovered by the masses.....Big downside of having been around: means you're old. To steal one of Dorian Carey's lines "put me down as 20 and say it's a two-for-one sale honey." And I actually wasn't around in 89, didn't get to go until the end of 90 when Frankie Knuckles was alternating weekends with David DePino. I'm not even sure why I started this thread really, although I guess I was harrumphing a bit because I think a documentary about the Sound Factory could be pretty interesting if it covered the full span of the club's life in a thoughtful way. Also this mailer is kind of a blueprint for Pacha as well so it seemed like something that might be of fairly mainstream interest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lunic Posted January 10 Report Share Posted January 10 Big downside of having been around: means you're old. To steal one of Dorian Carey's lines "put me down as 20 and say it's a two-for-one sale honey." And I actually wasn't around in 89, didn't get to go until the end of 90 when Frankie Knuckles was alternating weekends with David DePino. I'm not even sure why I started this thread really, although I guess I was harrumphing a bit because I think a documentary about the Sound Factory could be pretty interesting if it covered the full span of the club's life in a thoughtful way. Also this mailer is kind of a blueprint for Pacha as well so it seemed like something that might be of fairly mainstream interest.well i'm 32, and that's old? in my case i started going out at 13/14 and considering i was out there so young and seeing those around me, i'm glad i'm alive!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bella53081 Posted January 10 Report Share Posted January 10 . Wasn't taking a potshot at the later incarnation of the club by posting this, there was just some comment in the video about the original club being gay only because Junior's following was, which strikes me as a silly rewriting of history. oh i knew you weren't taking a potshot lol but it got me thinking and i went off on a tangent....explain what you mean about soundfactory - the video said that soundfactory was only gay at one point becuz of junior? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danceshake Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 soundfactory was only gay at one point becuz of junior?That statement was never true. Sound Factory 27th St was mostly gay at the start because Paradise Garage closed and most of them gay on Saturday nights at Paradise Garage went and a good percentage of straights from the Friday nights of Paradise Garage flocked to Sound Factory 27th St also. There was never a door policy of not allowing a particular crowd, but it was mandatory to respect the gays as well as respect each other, of course we know there are many straights that are homophobic from their up bringing and can't deal and would act stupid in the club,so what Richard Grant insisted for the door people to do is to make sure anyone that is straight and wanted entry must show respect for the gays in the club and were tested at the door some times or you were not allowed in, but the ones that could respect the gays were welcomed and many did go to Sound Factory 27th St.Open minded you get in, closed minded you can't get in..That was the door policy at Sound Factory 27th St in other words.I should add, I was one of those straights that was let into Sound Factory 27th ST, being able to convince the door people that I will respect everyone in the club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xtreem Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 interesting flyers. where did u find that? just as a side note: people are always reminiscing about how things used to b back years ago...i wish i was living down here then to know what went down....moved down here almost 3 years ago......before i moved here i went to exit and centro fly a few times and a rave, but ever since i got here and started going out regularly all i hear about is how the scene is dead now...from what i hear people say, it seems like everything was so much better, better people, clubs, message boards<??>....w/e maybe so, i still have fun now when i go out, just wish i knew to really compareTHE DRUGS ARENT AS GOOD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danceshake Posted January 14 Report Share Posted January 14 Documentary of the Junior Vasquez from the Sound Factory days till the closing of Twilo. Victor Calderone is in this interview as well.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlWkZa7d8xI Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skylab Posted January 15 Report Share Posted January 15 Says the video has been removed =/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjjnyc Posted January 16 Author Report Share Posted January 16 Says the video has been removed =/Got moved here:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlWkZa7d8xII put a few screen captures of the great Factory footage here: http://www.scientitian.com/weblogI think that's Willi Ninja you can see walking the floor in the last few shots. You can also see people sitting on the huge Levan bass horn at the base of the speaker stack in the background. Sort of lost track of this thread but danceshake is right, the Sound Factory followed the Garage model and was straight on Friday nights and gay on Saturdays. Fridays didn't run so late though, and those parties got nixed sometime mid-1992. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bella53081 Posted January 16 Report Share Posted January 16 That statement was never true. Sound Factory 27th St was mostly gay at the start because Paradise Garage closed and most of them gay on Saturday nights at Paradise Garage went and a good percentage of straights from the Friday nights of Paradise Garage flocked to Sound Factory 27th St also. There was never a door policy of not allowing a particular crowd, but it was mandatory to respect the gays as well as respect each other, of course we know there are many straights that are homophobic from their up bringing and can't deal and would act stupid in the club,so what Richard Grant insisted for the door people to do is to make sure anyone that is straight and wanted entry must show respect for the gays in the club and were tested at the door some times or you were not allowed in, but the ones that could respect the gays were welcomed and many did go to Sound Factory 27th St.Open minded you get in, closed minded you can't get in..That was the door policy at Sound Factory 27th St in other words.I should add, I was one of those straights that was let into Sound Factory 27th ST, being able to convince the door people that I will respect everyone in the club.what did they ask to prove you would be respectful and how did u convince them? and how were the door guys/girls sure that someone was straight just by looking at them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danceshake Posted January 16 Report Share Posted January 16 what did they ask to prove you would be respectful and how did u convince them? They would ask a simple question, are you able to party with a gay crowd ? Next they would look at your reaction or response, people in the know abouts would respond correctly, people not in the know abouts would freak out or have one of those digusted looks.I would convince them by saying I'm not homophobic, it was that simple and of course having some gay friends with you saying I'm O.K. helped. and how were the door guys/girls sure that someone was straight just by looking at them? They knew by experience,working the door constantly I guess. I can also assume by the way the straights would get upset and act violent because the door people did not trust their response or behavior for one reason or another. Many people look very straight even though they are gay, so perhaps they have to say that's my boyfriend or girlfriend and show it to get in also. I heard rumors you had to kiss your boy friend or girl friend at the door if the door people did not believe you are gay friendly.Sorry about the misspelled words, I was in a rush to go to the gym from work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjjnyc Posted January 16 Author Report Share Posted January 16 what did they ask to prove you would be respectful and how did u convince them? and how were the door guys/girls sure that someone was straight just by looking at them?My recollection, FWIW, is that by the time they belatedly decided to make an effort to regulate entrance like this, the writing was on the wall and the original vibe of the club had been lost. Frank Broughton writes about this eloquently in his "Death of the Sound Factory" article on djhistory.com. The first time I got asked was sometime in early 94 when I took two women friends that were visiting from London, it was simply along the lines of "do you know this is a gay club." I had never been asked, or witnessed anyone else being asked, prior to that. Until stories began appearing in the media, there simply weren't a lot of straight people trying to get in, plus there was also the dangerous reputation (there were still occasional fights among the Tracks crowd as of early 92). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris817 Posted January 17 Report Share Posted January 17 what did they ask to prove you would be respectful and how did u convince them? and how were the door guys/girls sure that someone was straight just by looking at them?Its not like today where there is the internet and news spreads very fast.. Back then it was word of mouth.. Plus you never saw the typical guido showing up for parties.. i have read on this board of bouncers asking straight guys to kiss other guys to prove they were gay to get in.. And guys did it..mostly if you went with gay guys you would get in, not too many straights knew or showed up to those parties.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starscream Posted January 17 Report Share Posted January 17 Got moved here:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlWkZa7d8xII put a few screen captures of the great Factory footage here: http://www.scientitian.com/weblogI think that's Willi Ninja you can see walking the floor in the last few shots. You can also see people sitting on the huge Levan bass horn at the base of the speaker stack in the background. Sort of lost track of this thread but danceshake is right, the Sound Factory followed the Garage model and was straight on Friday nights and gay on Saturdays. Fridays didn't run so late though, and those parties got nixed sometime mid-1992.thats actually Princess Xtravaganza in those last few shots with the long hair.Princess was one of the 1st people i met at SF along with Juan Aviance.Good times! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjjnyc Posted January 18 Author Report Share Posted January 18 thats actually Princess Xtravaganza in those last few shots with the long hair.Princess was one of the 1st people i met at SF along with Juan Aviance.Good times!That's so cool, thank you for the ID. Sorry if I misled anyone, the profile just looked a little like Willi to me and although I can only really conjure up two recollections of late morning vogueing, he was there both times, one time doing these fabulous freeze frame moves to the stabs of "Dub Break" while someone worked the lights in time to give a flash photo effect. Not sure I'd stake my life on it, but think that was the first weekend after I moved here, 1/5/92 (15 years ago...ouch!). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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