kfitz73 Posted July 24 Report Share Posted July 24 Kinsler? Besides a good half season, what exactly has Kinsler done to be a part of this conversation?? The fact that he hits leadoff in a bandbox with the best offense in baseball behind him inflates his status a tad...Pedroia? While he's a quality player, I think we need more than a 1.5 yr sample size before we bring him into any "best of" discussions... Besides wouldn't be fair to say that some of his production is due to hitting in front of Manny & Papi (when he's healthy)?Bottom line is that Cano's two best years are better than any single year Kinsler, Pedroia, or Roberts had had in the big leagues. The amazing part about it is that he seems to give those other guys a three month start on compiling stats each year. Yet at the end of the year he pulls it together (in the stretch run when his team needs him the most) and makes it looks easy. If he ever started a season off hot like Roberts does, this wouldn't even be a debate...Basically the only knocks you got on him are that he doesn't walk (which leads to a lower obp & ops), and he doesn't steal bases... As he matures (he's still only 25), he'll learn to be more selective.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtk4 Posted July 24 Report Share Posted July 24 try answering the questions i presented and make comments about the points i'm making instead of hiding from fact by going off subjectand career year at 26? i thought baseball prime years where late 20s early 30s.....but you know so much about baseball. just like you know this argument about roberts and cano ended with last year proving roberts as the better ballplayer (again)btw, who made the all star roster this year? who hasn't made one since 2006 (the year someone hit an average he will never hit again)What points, that you think range factor has something to do with a players range?(hint it doesn't) Nice of you to use it that way though. Watch Kinsler go to his left and let me know about his range. That kinsler is better because he leads off? Please. I bet Kinsler ends the year under .300 with 20 + errors, Tier 1 2nd baseman all the way. Put him on a team that does not play in texas and he would be lucky to hit his weight. Pedroia is a stud and is only 5'5", I will take him on my team over roberts and cano. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kfitz73 Posted July 24 Report Share Posted July 24 Pedroia is a stud and is only 5'5", I will take him on my team over roberts and cano.If I wanted to compare Cano to someone, Pedroia would be it... I still would like to him play at this level a bit more, but he is a solid, solid, player...Should be a fun decade watching these two... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonStephen Posted July 24 Author Report Share Posted July 24 Kinsler? Besides a good half season, what exactly has Kinsler done to be a part of this conversation?? The fact that he hits leadoff in a bandbox with the best offense in baseball behind him inflates his status a tad...Pedroia? While he's a quality player, I think we need more than a 1.5 yr sample size before we bring him into any "best of" discussions... Besides wouldn't be fair to say that some of his production is due to hitting in front of Manny & Papi (when he's healthy)?Bottom line is that Cano's two best years are better than any single year Kinsler, Pedroia, or Roberts had had in the big leagues. The amazing part about it is that he seems to give those other guys a three month start on compiling stats each year. Yet at the end of the year he pulls it together (in the stretch run when his team needs him the most) and makes it looks easy. If he ever started a season off hot like Roberts does, this wouldn't even be a debate...Basically the only knocks you got on him are that he doesn't walk (which leads to a lower obp & ops), and he doesn't steal bases... As he matures (he's still only 25), he'll learn to be more selective....On Pedroia: You guys all touted Cano as the best second baseman in the american league after two years.....On Kinsler: Cano has been hitting in the best lineup in baseball the past four years....the only reason they aren't as potent this year is because of injuries (and maybe age)And both are young as well.....Bad points on Kinsler and Pedroia.....lets stick to Roberts since you have an outside shot on making a case for Cano there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kfitz73 Posted July 24 Report Share Posted July 24 On Pedroia: You guys all touted Cano as the best second baseman in the american league after two years.....On Kinsler: Cano has been hitting in the best lineup in baseball the past four years....the only reason they aren't as potent this year is because of injuries (and maybe age)And both are young as well.....Bad points on Kinsler and Pedroia.....lets stick to Roberts since you have an outside shot on making a case for Cano thereOn Kinsler: Kinsler bats leadoff and gets protected by guys like Young, Bradley, & Hamilton. Cano gets protected (if you can call it that) by Melky, Molina, & Gardner... On past teams he batted 8th or 9th so it's not the same comparison... Put Cano in front of Jeter, Abreu, & A-Rod and his numbers would be off the charts. Cano just doesn't walk enough and doesn't have the speed so it's a bad fit...On Pedroia: And your putting him there after barely 1.5 yrs... You should know better than to annoint players in the middle of seasons. You saw what happened when you praised Roberts & dismissed Cano last May and how did that end up? You still didn't address how Pedroia has benefited from hitting in front of argueably one of the greatest hitting duos of all time... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtk4 Posted July 24 Report Share Posted July 24 On Pedroia: You guys all touted Cano as the best second baseman in the american league after two years.....On Kinsler: Cano has been hitting in the best lineup in baseball the past four years....the only reason they aren't as potent this year is because of injuries (and maybe age)And both are young as well.....Bad points on Kinsler and Pedroia.....lets stick to Roberts since you have an outside shot on making a case for Cano thereCano is younger then Kinsler and 10 months older the Pedroia. Nice bid though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonStephen Posted July 25 Author Report Share Posted July 25 On Kinsler: Kinsler bats leadoff and gets protected by guys like Young, Bradley, & Hamilton. Cano gets protected (if you can call it that) by Melky, Molina, & Gardner... On past teams he batted 8th or 9th so it's not the same comparison... Put Cano in front of Jeter, Abreu, & A-Rod and his numbers would be off the charts. Cano just doesn't walk enough and doesn't have the speed so it's a bad fit...On Pedroia: And your putting him there after barely 1.5 yrs... You should know better than to annoint players in the middle of seasons. You saw what happened when you praised Roberts & dismissed Cano last May and how did that end up? You still didn't address how Pedroia has benefited from hitting in front of argueably one of the greatest hitting duos of all time...I'm not gonna keep going on this since you're both beating dead horses....if Cano was as good a hitter as you both say he is, he'd be hitting at the top of the lineup regardless of the team. The reason both Torre and Girardi bury him at the bottom is because he can't handle the top of the lineup. If two coaches won't give him a shot in a lineup, does that tell you maybe he ain't all that?Cano is not the best second baseman in the American League. He's not top 3. End of story Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtk4 Posted July 25 Report Share Posted July 25 Listen I understand what you are saying about him hitting lower in the lineup but on this team, just like youk this year for the sox, he is more valuable down in the order. If he was hitting better earlier in the year (when the yanks had injuries) I bet he would of been in the three spot, where I think he would be for most teams. Pedroia is a stud, honestly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kfitz73 Posted July 25 Report Share Posted July 25 I'm not gonna keep going on this since you're both beating dead horses....if Cano was as good a hitter as you both say he is, he'd be hitting at the top of the lineup regardless of the team. The reason both Torre and Girardi bury him at the bottom is because he can't handle the top of the lineup. If two coaches won't give him a shot in a lineup, does that tell you maybe he ain't all that?Cano is not the best second baseman in the American League. He's not top 3. End of storyIf you say so Jon...Like I said earlier, Cano isn't fast and he doesn't take walks so putting him at the top of a line-up is just bad baseball. Damon & Jeter are ideal 1 & 2 guys. After that you have Abreu, A-Rod, & Giambi who are all .400 on base guys when they're right. So tell me why would you put Cano in any of those slots? Like jtk4 said, his value is lower in the order. How many players can hit .300 / 20hr / 100 rbi's in the 9 hole? If you gonna say the Yankees line-up is/was stacked, well so are the Red Sox, Tigers, & Rangers... How come their 9 hole guys can't do that?"No range" Cano 1 for 1 off Beckett and started a sparkling dp in the 2nd... I know you saw that Jonny boy... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtk4 Posted July 26 Report Share Posted July 26 I almost root for cano now. Almost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonStephen Posted July 28 Author Report Share Posted July 28 If you say so Jon...Like I said earlier, Cano isn't fast and he doesn't take walks so putting him at the top of a line-up is just bad baseball. Damon & Jeter are ideal 1 & 2 guys. After that you have Abreu, A-Rod, & Giambi who are all .400 on base guys when they're right. So tell me why would you put Cano in any of those slots? Like jtk4 said, his value is lower in the order. How many players can hit .300 / 20hr / 100 rbi's in the 9 hole? If you gonna say the Yankees line-up is/was stacked, well so are the Red Sox, Tigers, & Rangers... How come their 9 hole guys can't do that?"No range" Cano 1 for 1 off Beckett and started a sparkling dp in the 2nd... I know you saw that Jonny boy... Did you see the weak comebacker he hit to Lester with the bases loaded and two out?I did.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kfitz73 Posted July 28 Report Share Posted July 28 Did you see the weak comebacker he hit to Lester with the bases loaded and two out?I did....I did... Along with the 3 hits, 3 rbi's and the majestic homer yesterday....Good times! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtk4 Posted August 19 Report Share Posted August 19 kinsler could be done for the year with a sports hernia. Fuckin pussy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonStephen Posted August 22 Author Report Share Posted August 22 since when does an athlete gets injured? what a wimp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lolahotass Posted August 23 Report Share Posted August 23 I heard if you don't take care of a hernia it will drop into your balls...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonStephen Posted August 25 Author Report Share Posted August 25 (edited) Coming from the guy that was touting the NL west as the best in baseball last year. I don't know how I coulda missed this one...you're actually trying to knock me down when I claimed at the beginning of last year that the NL West was the best in the NL? (I claimed AL East was the best which you know full well). What I'd like to know is if you realize who made the world series and what division they were from.......and who made that unpopular statement against the mass posters getting their info from the daily news against the NL Eastbut jtk knows baseball better then I because espn.com is just a keystroke in the toolbar away Edited August 25 by JonStephen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtk4 Posted August 26 Report Share Posted August 26 (edited) since when does an athlete gets injured? what a wimpBrady and mcnabb played football with one. Pussy.I am just fuckin around calling him a pussy, I have had a hernia and it sucks. Edited August 27 by jtk4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtk4 Posted August 26 Report Share Posted August 26 I don't know how I coulda missed this one...you're actually trying to knock me down when I claimed at the beginning of last year that the NL West was the best in the NL? (I claimed AL East was the best which you know full well). What I'd like to know is if you realize who made the world series and what division they were from.......and who made that unpopular statement against the mass posters getting their info from the daily news against the NL Eastbut jtk knows baseball better then I because espn.com is just a keystroke in the toolbar awayHuh?You claimed that that the west was the best in like june. You also said something like the padres rotation would dominate in the AL and that was with maddux and fat boy wells. The rockies got smoked in the world series and if toronto or the angels or any other middle of the road AL team was in that terrible division that year they would of won the division by 20 games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonStephen Posted September 16 Author Report Share Posted September 16 sooooo....here we are at the end of the year and Cano is being benched for lack of hustle along with being an inferior player compared to Roberts as well as Kinsler and PedroiaHe's proved he wasn't as good the last two years even though he was doing better at the pretty home run and rbi categories that had half this board convinced otherwise, and he isn't helping his cause at all this year. He's shown he truly is nothing more then a little better then mediocre 2BerPoint has been proven by the play on the field Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kfitz73 Posted September 17 Report Share Posted September 17 sooooo....here we are at the end of the year and Cano is being benched for lack of hustle along with being an inferior player compared to Roberts as well as Kinsler and PedroiaHe's proved he wasn't as good the last two years even though he was doing better at the pretty home run and rbi categories that had half this board convinced otherwise, and he isn't helping his cause at all this year. He's shown he truly is nothing more then a little better then mediocre 2BerPoint has been proven by the play on the fieldLOL...So one bad year determines a career, huh?? I really wish I had your insight, especially when the debate was Jeter vs Nomar? I will grant you that as of now Pedroia is a better player, especially with his likely MVP award coming. However, like I said before, Cano's 2 best seasons are better than any season Roberts & Kinsler have ever had... As bad of a year as Cano has had (along with every position player on the Yankees for that matter), you simply can't dispute that...Have fun in the playoffs... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjrocks7 Posted October 16 Report Share Posted October 16 cano of course Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ridler2013 Posted October 24 Report Share Posted October 24 Cano rock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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