To those that have done their research on E.

[sinergygrl]

You know that it takes quite a few weeks for it to be almost completely replenished. Does anyone know of a credible website with this info, I have no idea where they are anymore. Thanx! -SIN

[mp3some]

Originally posted by sinergygrl:

You know that it takes quite a few weeks for it to be almost completely replenished. Does anyone know of a credible website with this info, I have no idea where they are anymore. Thanx! -SIN

For "IT" to be replenished?!!?

What's "IT"?!?

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Peace, Love & Twilo for Everyone!!!

"they wanna fight, we wanna dance"

[arrakis]

Probably referring to endorphins...

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"House music... it can change your soul."

"The second most popular game that we played as children... is house."

[tiestoisgod]

sin - www.lycaeum.org has always been a good place to start, or www.ecstasy.org

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"There was a time before we were born when the soul of each one of us decreed that we be brought into life. We have all made a place for ourselves on this earth, each life precious, each path different. But we all share the same goal of inner peace and it is there within us all to be discovered, and it can only be discovered through love."

[sinergygrl]

My bad, I am talking about your saratonin. I am in retard mode today, sorry. -SIN

[e-tarded]

Those sites are all well and good, but you might also want to check out some pharmacology sites. I have tons of research papers on E usage and Serotonin depletion from school. Let me know if you want them.

Endorphins "Endorphins are a group of substances formed within the body that naturally relieve pain. They have a similar chemical structure to morphine. In addition to their analgesic affect, endorphins are thought to be involved in controlling the body's response to stress, regulating contractions of the intestinal wall, and determining mood. They may also regulate the release of hormones from the pituitary gland, notably growth hormone and the gonadotropin hormones."

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~*P*L*U*R*~

Four Simple Words To Live By....

[This message has been edited by e-tarded (edited 10-09-2000).]

[csumaylo]

It all depends on the person and their respective metabolism rates. It could take anywhere from a week to three weeks to fully replenish Serotonin reserves.

Here's a way helpful site. www.erowid.org

-c

[This message has been edited by csumaylo (edited 10-09-2000).]

[e-tarded]

try this site http://www.maps.org/news-letters/v07n3/07305tan.html

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~*P*L*U*R*~

Four Simple Words To Live By....

[chrismakk69]

www.erowid.org www.ecstasy.org www.dancesafe.org

are the best sites on the net, in my opinion

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...aND oN THaT NoTe, LeTS GeT BaCK To THe PRoGRaM...

[e-tarded]

Neurotoxicity

For an explicit definition of neurotixicity and its legal implications, refer to the site listed below. http://www.epa.gov/ncea/pdfs/nurotox.pdf

To begin, animal studies show that, the list below, accurately defines the process in which neurotoxicity is allowed to manifest into a serious problem.

(Credit to Deep)

1) MDMA amps up seratonin and dopamine levels

2) Seratonin runs out

3) Dopamine goes where seratonin normally would

4)Altered dopamine molocules cause damage to nerves.

To begin, MAPS has done extensive research in the affects of neurotoxicity and their argument stands up to studies performed and released by the Journal of Neuroscience.

"MAPS"

MDMA is no exception to the rule that every drug has serious side effects in some users. Reports indicate that a small number of the millions of people who have taken MDMA over the last several decades have suffered negative consequences. Some people may be predisposed to react unfavorably to typical amounts of MDMA while heavy users may be placing themselves at special risk. MDMA increases blood pressure, posing a risk to people with preexisting heart conditions. MDMA can also increase body temperature which, in combination with hot environments, exhausting physical exercise (prolonged dancing) and lack of fluids has been linked in very rare cases to death from heat exhaustion. MDMA's psychological effects have been occasionally associated with acute anxiety, panic and depression and are substantially context-dependent. Several cases of longer-lasting effects have been identified. While no causal link has been established connecting serotonin reductions to any negative consequences, the potential risks as well as the benefits of MDMA must be carefully weighed before any decisions can be made concerning appropriate uses.

We owe our gratitude to Dr. Ricaurte and associates for conducting this latest study and to the National Institute on Drug Abuse (NIDA) for funding it. Now that this new study is completed, each of us entitled to make our own risk assessment after a careful look at the data. Below is my risk assessment, made with what I hope is a healthy dose of common sense.

The Latest Scientific Study

In August 1995, the Journal of Neuroscience published a scientific study by Fischer et al. investigating the regrowth of rat and primate brain neurons previously exposed to extremely large doses of MDMA.

The study was designed to determine whether there was long-term restoration of normal levels of serotonin in those brain regions in which serotonin levels were previously reduced as a result of exposure to very large amounts of MDMA. Also examined was whether the regrowth of serotonin nerve terminals (reinnervation) restored the original brain structures.

The study concluded that "in some rats and most monkeys, there is a lasting reorganization of ascending 5-HT [serotonin] axon projections following severe MDMA injury. In particular, while some projections (e.g. those to the neocortex) fail to recover for up to 18 months after drug administration, others (e.g. projections to the basal forebrain) recover fully, sometimes in excess." The authors of the paper noted that the "aberrant serotonergic brain reinnervation" had no known functional consequences, but that "if 5-HT [serotonin] function declines with age, MDMA-exposed individuals could be at increased risk for developing age-related cognitive impairment."(2)

The Media Coverage

The results of the study were reported in newspapers all across the United States and Europe. The reports began with an article in the August 15, 1995 New York Times Science Section incorrectly stating that the animals were given "recreational doses of MDMA - the amounts taken by many young people." In terms of human use, Dr. Ricaurte was cited as stating that "people could probably take normal amounts of MDMA three or four times a year without noticing any neuropsychiatric problems but people who took seven or eight doses a night could be inviting problems."

Published at the same time, but with a decidedly more alarming spin, was a report by the Associated Press (AP) wire service in which Dr. Ricaurte was quoted (he feels misquoted) as stating simplistically that "Results suggest that people who have used (Ecstasy) in the past have some kind of (brain) damage." To emphasize the point, the article quoted Dr. Robert Daroff, chief of staff at University Hospitals in Cleveland and editor-in-chief of the journal Neurology, as saying that "It makes you feel good, but you are going to probably get hurt."

The only counterpoint to these reports that I'm aware of was a letter to the editor that I co-wrote with Neal Goldsmith, Ph.D., published in the August 24, 1995 New York Times. We pointed out that the doses used in Dr. Ricaurte's study were roughly 45 times larger than the typical human dose, and that MDMA had been used "in therapeutic, sacramental and recreational contexts for over 20 years by hundreds of thousands of people without evidence of harmful neurotoxic effects on appetite, sleep, mood, impulsiveness or other neurological functions." On August 31, 1995 another story about the study was published in the British New Scientist magazine, and the London branch of the Reuters News Service distributed a story that was widely disseminated on the Internet. In both these stories, Dr. Ricaurte was quoted as stating, "If there is a margin of safety, it is not a large margin."

On September 2, 1995, yet another letter to the editor was published in the New York Times, this one by Richard A. Friedman, MD, Assistant Professor of Psychiatry, NY Hospital-Cornell Medical Center. He accused Dr. Goldsmith and me of entertaining ideas that were "dangerously naive and without scientific merit." He went on to assert that reports that MDMA had therapeutic benefits were pure speculation because "there are no long-term scientific studies of the effects of MDMA in humans," and that "lack of evidence of MDMA's possible dangers is by no means proof of its safety." Of course, Dr. Friedman was correct to assert that MDMA has not been proven safe; such a proposition can never be proven, only disproven. Furthermore, Dr. Friedman makes the valuable observation that drugs sold as MDMA "on the street" risk being contaminated. This risk of contamination complicates the question of "MDMA neurotoxicity."

(The article then goes on to state more elaborately the arguments suggested, they came to this conclusion)

Tentative Conclusion

As with any substance, some people are likely to be particularly sensitive to relatively small amounts of MDMA. Other people take unusually large amounts, especially in recreational contexts. It would therefore not be surprising if some people took enough MDMA to cause long-term reductions in their levels of serotonin in some brain regions. What would be surprising is if these serotonin reductions are eventually shown to have significant harmful functional or behavioral effects. Such changes, if they do occur, could as easily be beneficial as harmful, especially considering the fact that many people report long-term benefits resulting from their use of MDMA.

Over the last twenty years, millions of people have tried MDMA. This use of MDMA, though not conducted in the context of a scientifically controlled experiment, does provide an opportunity for a very large epidemiological study. Similarly, over fifty million people have tried a prescription drug called fenfluramine, a diet aid prescribed for daily use for months or years at a time that causes the same kind of neurotoxicity in animals as does MDMA.(9,10) The absence of a single confirmed case of functional or behavioral consequences related to serotonin neurotoxicity as a result of the use of fenfluramine(11) or MDMA does not mean that these drugs are without neurotoxic consequences. Appropriate epidemiological studies have not yet been conducted. Nevertheless, the lack of evidence of neurotoxic damage after such an enormous population of people has been exposed to these drugs certainly suggests that if any neurotoxicity-related problems have resulted, they are subtle and rare.

It does seem possible that some physiological mechanism may partially explain the diminishing returns that many people report from continued use of MDMA. This is a negative consequence only to the extent that the MDMA experience is considered beneficial.

After reviewing the new data reported by Fisher et al., I remain of the opinion that the risk of MDMA neurotoxicity is of no practical significance when typical or even somewhat larger doses of MDMA are used on an infrequent basis in therapeutic, sacramental or recreational contexts by people with normal brain function. Of course, I don't know this for sure, and neither does anyone else. I do know or have heard about many people who have used MDMA hundreds of times and seem unharmed and even helped by their use. As a result, I think that Dr. Ricaurte is being conservative when he states that "people could probably take normal amounts of MDMA three or four times a year without noticing any neuropsychiatric problems." While there is evidence that the neurotoxicity of MDMA can be blocked by the co-administration of Prozac or other selective-serotonin reuptake inhibitors (SSRIs) (12, 13) and that such drugs do not alter the MDMA experience in some people, (14) such protective measures do not seem to me to be necessary in normal use. Such measures might possibly be worth the trouble when exposure approaches seven or eight doses a night, a level which Dr. Ricaurte stated "could be inviting problems."

Ironically, one could argue that MDMA neurotoxicity research in humans, with its spinal taps and injections of radioactive substances, is more dangerous than MDMA itself. Nevertheless, it is crucial that MDMA neurotoxicity research continue, and also research into the beneficial therapeutic uses of MDMA, so that the risks and benefits of MDMA can be accurately balanced. " -- Endnote

Now, IMHO, the arguments on both sides were backed by personal beliefs. This is simply one report, I would not suggest using any less caution when using MDMA recreationally simply based on this knowledge. This is also an accurate depiction of how facts can be skewered and misinformation is doled out to the masses via media/news sources.

The foremost thing to remember is that, while there has been no recognizable neurotoxic affects shown in this study, the pills that are sold in the street are most often not pure MDMA. A proper test will verify that your pills substance is pure. This article also states that Pre-Post loading is not necessary; However, the proper precursors to seratonin, namely 5HTP, in other studies, have proven quite affective as a deterrant.

For a more in-depth look at this article, please visit the MAPS site below where this study was taken from. It further explains the arguments and conclusions listed above. http://www.maps.org/news-letters/v06n1/06108neu.html

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Four Simple Words To Live By....