Guest endymion Posted March 21 Report Share Posted March 21 Also.. how is it that these condos are more concerned about Space than that sleezy titty bar at the corner? They are more concerned about a little noise than prostitution? Thats assbackwards in my opinion.Law enforcement is more prejudiced against nightclubs than strip clubs. Plenty of cops visit strip clubs as customers. Night clubs, not so much.Residents don't care as long as it's quiet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pod Posted March 21 Report Share Posted March 21 Hmm. Change all the clubs to strip clubs then. Free entrance with badge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest endymion Posted March 21 Report Share Posted March 21 Now here is another conspiracy theory. If you own a club at the Hard Rock or down town lauderdale, where they don't fuck with the clubs noise levels how do you protect yourself? Simple, you get Space shut down. Once Space is gone, the whole block falls. That's a fun theory but it suffers from a common flaw that I see in a lot of nightclub industry thinking: overestimation of the importance of the nightclub industry in the grand scheme of things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pod Posted March 21 Report Share Posted March 21 You could say the same about the condo and real estate people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest endymion Posted March 22 Report Share Posted March 22 Sure but not about residents/taxpayers/voters. They aren't overestimating their own importance, the neighborhood really does revolve around them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyTrendy Posted March 22 Report Share Posted March 22 Cool..I still think that winning a major championship and having the Super Bowl in a major city have a possitive effect on tourism.They draw in people that are watching the event on T.V.Maybe not though,you probably have a better idea than i do.Well, winning championships (Detroit Redwings, Detroit Pistons, Detroit Shock have all won in the past few years) - and hosting the Superbowl (2006) - hasn't done diddly squat for my hometown... hell even i don't go there to visit.... homes are being sold for $7000 in detroit... lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pod Posted March 22 Report Share Posted March 22 Sure but not about residents/taxpayers/voters. They aren't overestimating their own importance, the neighborhood really does revolve around them.I hate to say it, but that is their downfall. They're simply not important. I mean like really important. What'd they do to change the world? Nothing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest endymion Posted March 22 Report Share Posted March 22 ... residents/taxpayers/voters ... aren't overestimating their own importance, the neighborhood really does revolve around them.I hate to say it, but that is their downfall. They're simply not important. I mean like really important. What'd they do to change the world? Nothing!Nightclubs are more important to an area than residents who pay property taxes? That kind of delusion is the motivation behind my recent flood of posts about this. People frequently get so immersed in the various reality distortion fields surrounding the nightclub industry that they lose sight of the position of nightclubs in the overall food chain. While Nocturnal's original builders were bullshitting us for years on end with their vaporware PR about their terrace, people a lot higher on the food chain were already ruling against the terrace and taking steps to make sure that it won't be there for long. More important people: residents, nepotistic elected officials, and possibly an honest elected official or two.Gainesville changed. Atlanta changed. South of Fifth changed. The Omni area changed. The writing is on the wall and Park West is changing."Those who cannot learn from history are doomed to repeat it." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest coach Posted March 22 Report Share Posted March 22 So what are we supposed to learn from history? That we can't stop the gentrification and developers and we are just supposed to suck it up and move on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest endymion Posted March 22 Report Share Posted March 22 So what are we supposed to learn from history? That we can't stop the gentrification and developers and we are just supposed to suck it up and move on?Lessons from history for industry people: "Hedge your bets." Most of the owners already understand this.For nightclub patrons: "Enjoy it now."Simon's used to have the most amazing terrace overlooking one of the nicest areas in Gainesville where we would watch the sunrise together over the treetops after partying all night and all weekend long through a maze of different interconnected venues. When I saw the writing on the wall I resolved to enjoy it while it lasted and then go find something cool and new once it was gone. Space opened in Miami right after it was gone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest saintjohn Posted March 22 Report Share Posted March 22 For nightclub patrons: "Enjoy it now."That's good advice for everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pod Posted March 22 Report Share Posted March 22 I'm not saying nightclubs are more important, what I'm saying is that the people moving into these areas have to get off their high horses and realize they don't mean squat in the grand scheme of things. Oh boo fucking hoo, it's noisy!!! Waah! Cry me a fucking river! There's kids starving in Africa, there's kids in Iraq getting maimed by IEDs and friendly fire, and you're complaining about the noise from a nightclub? Get real already. Christ, these people need a wake up call, that their petty bullshit is just that, petty fucking bullshit. Lose an arm to a landmine and then you can complain about the "noise".Yeah, Downtown condo owners, I'm looking at you. I will take you on. I'm the reverse Del-fucking-Vecchio of this hood, and it ain't gonna be pretty. I'm rude, I have plenty of bad habits, and frankly, I'm pissed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest endymion Posted March 22 Report Share Posted March 22 Yeah, Downtown condo owners, I'm looking at you. I will take you on. I'm the reverse Del-fucking-Vecchio of this hood, and it ain't gonna be pretty. I'm rude, I have plenty of bad habits, and frankly, I'm pissed. They own the land, they win. End of story. You're now a guest in their neighborhood. There will be a lot more of them soon in all directions and they own the place now. Pod, if you want to think of them like Israeli settlers then sure but uh... please no intifada okay? A bunch of militant talk from you just makes the Space PR staff cringe."Wise bamboo bends with the wind." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest coach Posted March 22 Report Share Posted March 22 I think you are too resigned to things, Tech. If you don't fight, you definitely cannot win. Some cities *do* have very long running entertainment districts, Dallas being one of them. It can and has been done. Maybe 11th Street isn't the place for it in Miami, maybe it is. At some point the city planners *have* to be made to realize that nightlife *is* an important aspect of a city. If you gentrify the whole place, eventually you end up with what happened to South Beach in the 70s and 80s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest endymion Posted March 22 Report Share Posted March 22 If you don't fight, you definitely cannot win.Agreed. And one side fights and the other is just rhetoric and an obscure network of reality distortion fields.Will a single club kid show up to a single city meeting? It's just not that important to them.Will residents? How often do they have condo association meetings? Neighborhood association meetings? I go to a lot of them where I live and we effectively keep the hotel 100 feet from my bedroom from making noise in the middle of the night. Homeowners are motivated to stay organized because they have millions of dollars at stake. Club kids, not so much... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest coach Posted March 22 Report Share Posted March 22 Will a single club kid show up to a single city meeting?Did you go to the Miami Beach city commission meetings when they were talking about rolling back the closing time? Slammed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest slamminshaun Posted March 22 Report Share Posted March 22 Will a single club kid show up to a single city meeting?Did you go to the Miami Beach city commission meetings when they were talking about rolling back the closing time? Slammed.An exception in my opinion. Generally speaking (99% of the time) club kids are sleeping while the meetings are going on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tres-b Posted March 22 Report Share Posted March 22 There were some strong showings by the clubbing community in Atlanta when the city sucessfully shut the loophole that allowed Backstreet and Riviera to operate 24/7. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V. Barbarino Posted March 22 Author Report Share Posted March 22 City Counciled called a "mandatory" Neighborhood Entertainment Team meeting. From what I gather, they said they will "grandfather in Space and Noc" and prevent new patios from opening. Which makes zero sense!! The problem is not NEW patios it's existing ones... The Condos will force the hands of the city imho. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pod Posted March 22 Report Share Posted March 22 No intifada here. That doesn't work. Angry words at commission meetings, yes. I'm keeping my eye on the schedule. I've given up on South Beach, they're gonna roll back closing times there at some point. I don't live there, so it's pointless for me to go to a meeting there. But I live in the City of Miami, and I don't want them taking away the only nighttime entertainment we have without saying something. They might win, but I'll feel better if I at least get to say my piece. Don't worry, I'm not gonna flip out and rant like a meth'd up chimp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest coach Posted March 22 Report Share Posted March 22 Grandfathering is the dumbest thing ever invented. Of course, that is GREAT news for Space and Nocturnal. Restraint of trade and all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tres-b Posted March 22 Report Share Posted March 22 Grandfathered in...We wont let any other clubs open a terrace and we will eventually deal with these two when the time is right.Then comes the next part once noise isnt the issue...strung out clubbers wandering out the streets at 10am Sunday morning. Perfect site for the church crowd to see This is when the city tries to change closing times.In Atlanta, there was actually a church a block or so south of Backstreet. I loved seeing the church folk leaving. Very inspirational... ;D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest endymion Posted March 22 Report Share Posted March 22 ... and I don't want them taking away the only nighttime entertainment we have without saying something.They did say something, as far back as at least 2003. Refer to this neighborhood plan, fifth page, drawing on the bottom right, captioned, "A parking garage lined with habitable space, on a narrow promenade lot."That's a drawing of Space and Nocturnal, with their roofs covered, and high-density apartment buildings directly across the promenade. Not even across the street, but mere feet from the two terraces. I don't know how much clearer the writing on the wall can get. That drawing has been a matter of public record for at least four years."Hmm, more residents means we don't need to find ways to fill those parking spaces at night any more because area parking will be in use by residents. And the 24-hour licenses to subsidize parking lots was some kind of Teele scam anyway. Gosh those 24-hour licenses have outlived their usefulness and now they hurt property values and stand in the way of more residents moving to the area and increasing the tax base. What? They're having loud outdoor parties on the rooftops at those places? Who knew about this?!? Oh no, no, no, we need to do something about that..." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest endymion Posted March 23 Report Share Posted March 23 Hey Nick: Bluetooth headphonesMaybe Motorola would like to help save the Space terrace. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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