Everything you need to know about E

[Candy]

Originally posted by mrmatas2277

where have u been hiding?

[mursa]

Originally posted by ultracrzy

i found this in my archives, pretty much he best explanation on MDMA use i have ever seen, thought i share:

Ecstasy is a generic name for pills and does not reflect their content. The content of a pill varies not only from brand

to brand but also within brands [between batches]. So buying one E is no guarantee that it will be the same as

another E you had. The contents could be completely different.

The prolonged duration of the pill, as well as the visuals you experienced, would point to the content of the pill being

MDA, as these are characteristic to the substance.

MDMA comparatively has a cleaner comedown, shorter duration of action, no visuals, and feelings of empathy [love]

and euphoria [body buzzes].

MDEA is another variant molecule often found in "E". It has a significant amphetamine effect but does not carry with it

the same emotional stimulation that the aforementioned types provide. It is often the cause of the "e-tarded" feeling

people have - irritable yet speedy. "Heroin" is often blamed for pills high in MDEA content, yet no tests have ever

found heroin - synthetic or otherwise - in ecstasy. Furthermore, pills are cut with other substances mainly to drive

down costs - heroin is more expensive per gram than MDMA and hence it would not make sense to cut a pill with it.

Furthermore the dose of heroin needed to provide an effect is greater than what you could put into a tiny E pill that

already contains other substances. The same holds true for cocaine. Their presence in ecstasy are simply myths.

Other myths regarding ecstasy include it draining spinal fluid [back pain is more likely due to overuse of muscles in

that area because of the energy that ecstasy provides].

Obviously, MDMA is what most people are looking for. But because it is relatively difficult to synthesize [and hence

more expensive] chemists often put in other less expensive substances.

MDMA produces its effects by increasing levels of dopamine and serotonin your nervous system. Serotonin has many

functions in the body, including the regulation of sleep and dreaming, the regulation of eating patterns, as well as

sensations of contentedness and satisfaction. Chronically low levels of serotonin are related to depressive disorders.

Dopamine is a neurochemical that amongst other functions provides the body buzz, speedy and euphoric feelings that

MDMA provides.

Pills can contain other substances [i.e. methamphetamine, caffeine, ephedrine, etc.].

1] Timing is critical. Chemists often wait for a pill to earn a reputation, then pump out copycat batches using garbage

ingredients? Why? Because garbage ingredients cost less. And knowing full well that once a pill has earned a name for

itself, they can ride the reputation generated by the higher quality batch. Case in point: Nothing after the first

generation of Mitsubishis came out last August even came close to the first generation. Many of the ones circulating

now are total bullshit. But still they were bought up readily because people actually thought they were getting their

hands on the real deal. Colors, stamps, etc. mean little after enough time has passed.

Furthermore some pill types have been around since the beginnings of the rave scene in England. Hearts, Diamonds,

E-stamps, Doves, Butterflies, etc. are not exactly unique or hard to find stamps. So simply because you had a heart

two years ago does not mean the one you bought tonight will be any good.

Anyone with a 2nd year knowledge of organic chemistry can perform the reactions necessary to synthesize MDMA.

Getting your hands on the equipment and chemical precursors is not easy but not impossible. And it does involve the

use of toxic chemicals [mercury, etc.]. So don't think that all pills come from one big factory somewhere and that

they're all the same. It could be overseas, in an abandoned building, a suburban home or down your street. Anyone

with a pill press and a stamp can punch out copycats. If you get your hands on pills within 3 weeks of it hitting the

streets then you are in good shape. Anything after that point and that it is right when the copycats usually start

coming in for good pills.

2] Read, read, read. Don't go by your dealer's assurances or what your friend heard or anything else removed from

facts. Read the facts and studies yourself, know the bottom line, don't let someone else tell you what is right and

wrong [including myself. I openly urge everyone to read the research themselves to verify what I'm writing]. "Don't

worry, it's good." is not a guarantee. Drug dealing does not obey the same code of ethics real businesses have to

face. There are no penalties for lying, no penalties for putting out a shitty product, no penalties for screwing people

over to make a buck.

Good places to get information are the reports page include :

http://www.bluelight.net/mdma http://www.bluelight.nu http://www.ecstasy.org http://www.lycaeum.org/

http://www.erowid.org/ http://www.dropout.freeserve.co.uk/articles/preload.html

Read all of them.

..and for anyone interested in reading the actual studies http://www.infotrieve.com/freemedline

You may need an introductory understanding of physiological psychology, in which you should be able to turn up a

good used textbook at your local university. I suggest the Physiology of Behaviour by Carlson.

Be forewarned that some spineless dealers post glowing reports from time to time to sell their shitty products. So if

it's too good to be true, it probably is. Stick around, read everything that you can. Wait a week or two before you try

digging up a certain pill to see if everyone's reactions are the same. Wait until others have tried things out. Don't

trust everyone's reports, find people who judge hard and are intelligent about their usage and ask them.

3] Know what you want ahead of time, how much you want to pay for it, and don't settle for anything less. Your

dealer needs you more than you need them. Period. If you don't get what you want from someone take your business

elsewhere. As long as people tolerate bullshit from dealers they'll keep trying to pull it.

The whole reason why Mitsubishi's were pressed out was because over the past few years the quality of pills had

decreased significantly. These days the average pill runs about 75mg of MDMA. In 1994 the average pill contained 150

mg of MDMA. In other words you could buy a single pill and split it between yourself and a friend and get the same

effect as a single pill today. People grew tired of this trend and the business suffered accordingly. Mitsu's were

pumped out in the summer of last year from Amsterdam to restore faith in E-trade in London. The first generation of

Mitsu's were tested at 140mg+ of MDMA. For more info check out the article that Mixmag did this year on the

Mitsubishi phenomenon.

The point is, don't tolerate bullshit and people won't feed it to you.

4] Buy ahead of time and never at a party. You will pay 5-10 dollars less and not have to deal with last minute mind

fucks and dealer tricks. If you buy more than $200 at a time you should be entitled to a free tester from your dealer.

Good prices - 180-200 for 10, 20-25 dollars for any quantity less.

5] The taste of a pill is a good indication as to its content. MDMA has a characteristic bitter taste - very bitter.

Scratch off a piece of the pill and put it on the tip of your tongue. If it doesn't make your face wince it probably

doesn't have much good to it. It also has a characteristic "sassafras" smell, because of the use of sassafrole in the

synthesis of MDMA. Pay close attention to the appearance of the pill - its color, how hard it is, the stamp, how thick

it is, whether there is a score [line] down the back, whether there are speckles etc. It will help you distinguish

between copycats.

6] Never depend on only one dealer. Dig for as many connections as you can find. Don't tolerate mind fucks. If

someone plays mind games with you, walk away. Same as in normal business. Accept only the best and that's what

you'll get.

7] Know your dealer, don't ever buy from someone you don't trust or don't like.

8] Never dose more frequently than 1 - 1.5 hours apart. The amount necessary to provide the desired effect varies

from individual to individual but in Alexander Shulgin's original studies it was determined that 120 mg of MDMA is

enough to fuck up the majority of the population. Generally, unless someone has acquired a tolerance from months of

excessive usage, 2 pills should be enough to fuck up the majority of people [assuming that they're of relatively good

quality]. There is probably not a direct relationship with bodyweight and number of pills needed for a potent dose and

more likely a greater relationship with brain mass and # of pills needed, but it's generally true that the smaller you are,

the less you need, and that females can get away with less than males.

9] One can acquire a tolerance for MDMA from excessive usage, necessitating more and more to produce the desired

effect while accumulating more and more side effects. The only thing that can remedy the acquisition of a tolerance is

abstinance.

10] Do not combine E with monoamine oxidase inhibitor drugs. Monoamine oxidase is the enzyme that helps to

eventually slow down the effects of MDMA, without it, your body is like a car speeding without any breaks - it has no

way of controlling itself.

11] Handle your business yourself. Don't leave it to others.

12] Stay adequately hydrated. MDMA enhances serotonin secretion, high levels of serotonin cause hyperthermia

[increase in body heat]. Not to mention the fact that dancing alone works up a good sweat.

13] Take periodic sober breaks...you'll find out whether you're into the scene because of the vibe/music or the drugs

rather quickly. Furthermore it will enhance the quality of your rolls when you do.

13] Double stacks are sometimes a trick used by chemists to convince people there is more MDMA in a pill than there

really is. Although some double stacked pills do contain significantly more MDMA they are generally the exception

rather than the rule.

14] Information is regionally specific. Meaning that a pill that was great in England may not be the same as ones

circulating around here, even if the stamps are the same.

15] Metaphorically, think of your brain as the engine of a car. Certain substances floor the gas pedal and make the

car go faster than normal. This is fun. But in driving faster, you use up gas [serotonin, in this specific situation] faster

as well.

When these substances wear off, you are obviously left with less gas than you would have if you didn't do the

speed-racer thing.

With less gas, you can't drive as fast as you normally do. Therefore you operate less efficiently. Low levels of

serotonin can be characterized by changes in eating patterns, sleeping patterns, short term memory and the

appearance of depressive symptoms.

MDMA produces its loved up, empathic effect by increasing levels of serotonin. If the body's "gas" [serotonin] is used

up faster than it is replaced, then one is left with less serotonin when it is all said and done...

..unless you go to a gas station and refill the tank [supplement with 5-HTP, eat foods rich in the amino acid

trytophan like bananas or turkey meat]...

..or put the car in economy mode to use the gas more efficiently [use of an SSRI type anti-depressant]...

..or don't drive as fast, as often [use moderation in usage / frequency].

Because this is purely mathematical it applies to everyone regardless of their prior condition.

It should however be noted that the lower levels of serotonin are not permanent [i.e. the size of your gas tank has

not been reduced], but rather there is temporarily less gas in the tank than normally.

Damage may even occur to the engine if driven hard with no gas in the tank. Depletion of serotonin stores is one step

in a proposed mechanism for the neurotoxicity of MDMA. It can be theoretically counteracted by using engine oil

[antioxidants such as Vitamin C]. I must however warn that studies correlating MDMA with neurotoxicity have only

been performed in animals and only using ridiculously high dosages / frequency of usage.

There are ways in which one can decrease the negative side effects of MDMA and increase the positive ones.

Although no studies have been done on these techniques and MDMA specifically, extrapolating biochemical facts and

observing the experiences of those who have done it support their practice. These practices are called preloading and

postloading. The entire concept behind preloading and postloading is, extending the above metaphor, adding gas to

the tank that MDMA is going to use up.

Serotonin as aforementioned is responsible for the empathic, loved-up feelings from MDMA. Adding more serotonin to

your system enhances these effects. More importantly, it hypothetically counteracts the mechanism MDMA is thought

to induce neurotoxicity with. 5-hydroxytrytophan is the direct precursor of serotonin in the body. It is sold in health

food stores to help people with sleeping disorders [one of serotonin's roles is in the regulation of sleep, as

aforementioned]. It is not a drug, it is an amino acid with a hydroxyl molecule appended to it. Supplementation with

5-hydroxytrytophan enhances the loved-up, empathic feelings and cleans up the comedown.

Hard come downs are usually generated by depletion of intraneuronal serotonin stores. The result of lessed serotonin

stores, as mentioned above, are characterized by disruptions in normal sleeping and eating patterns, difficulty in

verbal processing and committing facts to short term memory, as well as irritatiblity. Most notably the impact of low

serotonin levels is characterized by depression. Supplementation with 5-hydroxtrytophan [5-HTP for short]

counteracts these negative side effects by putting more gas in the tank and ensuring that you don't run out.

In animal studies, it is hypothesized that neurotoxicity from MDMA is due to the following process. I'll put it in layman's

terms.

1] MDMA amps up serotonin and dopamine use.

2] Serotonin runs out

3] Dopamine goes where serotonin normally would

4] Altered dopamine molecules cause damage to nerves

Therefore by preventing the depletion of serotonin you minimize the amount of oxidized dopamine radicals that feed

into pre-axonic serotonin terminals and cause axonic trimming.

One of magnesium's major roles in the body is in muscle relaxation. It is the antagonist [opposite] of calcium, which

helps to induce muscle contraction. The jaw clenching observed on MDMA can be minimized through magnesium

supplementation. Added magnesium can also minimizing cramping due to dehydration.

Vitamin C is a potent antioxidant. As aforementioned it is thought that MDMA is neurotoxic due to oxidized free

radicals. As such Vitamin C counteracts these free radicals and helps to minimize damage incurred.

The aforementioned three elements are the most PROTECTIVE elements to a preloading regimen. The following

elements are optional because they enhance the experience rather than protect you from anything specific.

L-Tyrosine is to dopamine what 5-HTP is to serotonin. It is its precursor. Dopamine provides the rushy, body buzz,

speedy effects...increasing L-tyrosine levels enhances these sensations.

DLPA amongst other functions, helps to prolong the duration of action of pleasure inducing neurochemicals.

L-Glutamine is a precursor to neurotransmitters in the brain. It also imparts a protective effect on the brain but not as

heavily as 5-HTP or Vitamin C.

Any substances that you are preloading with need to cross the blood brain barrier to be effective. Amino acids

compete with each other to cross the blood brain barrier, hence eating foods rich with protein lessen the effects of

the amino acids because so many are in competition. It's like having a race with 2 people or 1000 people. Those one

of those two people are more likely to win when they're only racing against themselves.

As such preloads are taken on a relatively empty stomach, 1-1.5 hours prior to rolling. Preferably they are taken with

a sugary juice to help the amino acids cross the blood brain barrier. Grapefruit juice inhibits one of the p450

cytochrome C digestive enzymes in the digestive tract that metabolizes MDMA and hence can make the effects of the

drug somewhat more effective.

It should be noted that preloading can upset some people's stomachs or cause diarrhea due to the acidity of the

stomach. In which case these symptoms are easily counteracted by the following steps:

1] Mix the capped substances into juice, shake thoroughly, and sip the solution slowly over the course of an hour prior

to a roll.

2] Immodium can counteract the diarrhea and does not interfere with a roll.

3] Tums or any calcium carbonate based antacid reduces the acidity of the stomach and counteracts the feelings of

sickness one might encounter when coming up from a roll or after preloading. A newbie I came across on the weekend

was doubled over from their pill hitting them too hard - two tums and ten minutes later they were up on their feet

feeling fine. If necessary you can also eat a non-acidic carbohydrate based food to buffer acidity, such as bread,

muffins, etc.

The practice of postloading is metaphorically to fill up the tank after a long, fast ride. You restore the elements

depleted by MDMA, and in doing so, bypass negative side effects and clean up your comedown while restoring normal

function.

The only elements required in a postloading regimen are the protective ones. It is suggested that one employ 5-HTP,

Vitamin C, Magnesium for the aforementioned reasons. A multivitamin is beneficial to help replace spent micronutrients.

Water is of course beneficial. L-Tyrosine, DLPA are not desired nor necessary.

You will know if you are bypassing the negative side effects of serotonin depletion if you can sleep soundly after

rolling, and do not experience significant post-MDMA depression or disturbances in verbal processing, short term

memory and eating patterns.

Natural sources of trytophan [the precursor to 5-hydroxtrytophan, two steps away from serotonin] include bananas

and turkey meat. Turkey's high level of trytophan is the reason why most people feel sleepy after thanksgiving /

christmas dinners - the high concentration of trytophan converts to serotonin in the bloodstream. Because of

serotonin's relationship to the regulation of sleep, fatigue is induced.

In so far as exact dosages of these elements, it should be noted that it varies from person to person and

experimentation is key. The following are guidelines that have been found to work for many. It should also be noted

that changing the ratio's of elements can provide different effects. I.E. Decreasing 5-HTP and increasing

L-Tyrosine/DLPA can enhance the speediness of a pill, but would not protect the brain from neurotoxic effects as

much as more 5-HTP would. Excessive 5-HTP can mellow out a roll. Not make it mashy, but reduce the speediness of

the pill.

Preloading:

1. 5-HTP - 200-400mg

2. L-Tyrosine - 500-1500mg

3. DLPA - 500-1500mg

4. Vitamin C - 1000+, since it is water soluble and so protective you really can't go wrong going high. Remember that

orange juice and fruits are comparatively lower sources of vitamin C compared to supplements.

5. L-Glutamine - 2-5 grams

6. Magnesium - 500-1000mg

Post load:

1. 5-HTP - 200-400mg

2. Vitamin C - 1000mg+

3. Magnesium - 500-1000mg

Remember to experiment and take these things slowly as the sheer volume of pills ingested can upset the stomach. All

elements are legal and can be found readily in health food stores and at online health food retailers.

It may seem expensive to buy all these things but to protect your brain against neurotoxic effects and reduce other

negative side effects it is well worth it.

SSRI type antidepressants have been shown to impart a neuroprotective effect after a roll as well. Specifically

fluoxetine [Prozac] has been shown to prevent neurotoxic effects in animals.

I have never met a person who has wanted to go back to rolling without preloading / postloading once they tried it. I

don't benefit from any of this information directly nor do I have reason to lie. I just hope that this helps makes things

safer for people out there.

You have to believe that you have control over what happens to you and that you don't have to get screwed into

anything.

I hope that this information helps someone out there. I'm not normally a quote person because people never practice

what they preach, but here are some maxims to roll by:

Knowledge is power

It is best to err on the side of caution

Moderation is key

Nice article ................ give credit to BLUELIGHT.NU though .

Knowledge is power

[shroomy]

Originally posted by mrmatas2277

where have u been hiding?

Jes, check the date.

[Candy]

Originally posted by shroomy

Jes, check the date.

He was just trying to do some thread jacking

[twiloguy]

that postloading part is 100% the truth. I swear by 5-HTP and proper eating after a night of partying...so much so, that I won't party unless I have all this at my disposal for the week or two afterwards.

goooooodbye Tuesday blues!

[gemerald]

thanks for the info!!! i actually read every single word!!!!.......

[stdiamante]

Wow that was a crazy yet great article!!

[sexxichikk]

g0od article, good to read be4 doing!

[tranzwhore]

What is E?

[Guest gabo]

Originally posted by tranzwhore

What is E?

lol

[Candy]

Originally posted by tranzwhore

What is E?

It's the fifth letter of the alphabet

[tranzwhore]

oh E.....yeah, it's between D & F

[Guest gabo]

Originally posted by tranzwhore

oh E.....yeah, it's between D & F

hmmm are you sure?

[tranzwhore]

Originally posted by gabo

hmmm are you sure?

did it move from there and I wasn't told?

[Candy]

Originally posted by tranzwhore

did it move from there and I wasn't told?

It's all over the alphabet now:D

[elpapi]

Bump..

[cj7dave2]

Originally posted by shroomy

Good article!!!

But worth pointing out a few things.

There is no cross toleranc between MDMA MDA and MDEA. The vast majority (90+%) of "real" pills contain MDMA. So if you roll even somewhat often you will build a tolerance to MDMA. Find a pill with MDA and you will think you found the best rolls in the world because you have no tolerence to it.

The pre and post loading thing is valid... but it takes your body days to turn 5-htp into seratonin, so doing anything hours before or after a roll isnt really going to make much difference except for psychologically.

But your body can produce dopamine very quickly, but there isn't really much of a dopamine release in relative terms. Say about 20% or what coke would release.

The part about

_______________________________

I'll put it in layman's

terms.

1] MDMA amps up serotonin and dopamine use.

2] Serotonin runs out

3] Dopamine goes where serotonin normally would

4] Altered dopamine molecules cause damage to nerves

________________________________

is simply incorrect, it is the reuptake of all of the free seratonin that can cause damage to nerons. (not nerves, there are no nerves in your brain, and you cant alter a molecule with out it becoming something else, dopamine is not altered)

The gas tank analogy is a good one, but the problem is your brain has an internal gas guage, keep rolling and keep your levels of seratonin constantly low (since it takes over a week to recover to pre roll levels even if you havent rolled in forever) and your brain can readjust so it thinks that a half tank is really a full tank and doesnt produce more seratonin.

and little nitnoid crap... mercury is not used in the synthesis of MDMA, and taste is a very unreliable indicator because most of the cutting agents used are bitter as hell to. And since there isnt exactly high quality control, even pills from the same batch can have vastly different amounts of MDMA due to poor mixing. You would really have to mix for a day or two in tumbler (or rock polisher) to have it mixed well

my 2 cents to add to a great article

I dont mean to offend you shroomy, but you are a little misled in your biology and how E works...

First of all the brain is a soft mass of nerve cells connected to the spinal cord, the nerves in the brain and spinal cord transmitt messages throughout the body

Secondly, it is in fact the dopamine entering the empty axons(where serotonin is stored) of the serotonin that causes the brain damage. Since the serotonin is released in great quantities and destroyed by MAO, the serotonin axons are left empty causing the excess dopamine to enter, and when it reacts with MAO, it creates hydrogen peroxide, and then it oxidizes the axon, destroying it. The brain can no longer hold as much serotonin. This is also why anti-oxidants, such as vitamin-c make the effects of E less harmful on the brain. The whole process has been proven, because they have compared the damages to the brain when they have removed all the dopamine prior, to when they have left the dopamine normal or even increased it, and damage only occured with the dopamine present....

This all leads to the fact that you should not take L-tyrosine prior to rolling because it is a precursor to dopamine, more dopamine is why you get a more speedy roll and may cause added damage. The long term 5-htp regiment is a very good thing and the taking of prozac within 6 hours of the E has proven effective due to the fact prozac blocks the dopamines path into the serotonin axon, thus preventing dopamines adverse reaction with MAO, and also preventing the destuction of the axon, which carries the serotonin. Since serotonin has been found to remain largely depleted for around 24 hours, and prozac protects the axons for 30 hours, the brain seems to be undamaged by the E.

Sorry if that was complicated, but basically the original simplified version of the long article was correct, and the corrections made by shroomy were incorrect. Just wanted to inform people so that no one makes any mistakes with vitamins and the pills.

If you want info on what pills contain you can look on dancesafe.org, they might have tested some of the pills you take, and they also have a great slideshow about exactly what e does to your brain.

[phuturephunk]

..Hmm..I seem to remember writing an etardism post way back......

[ninadd]

Since you guys are talking about dopamine and seratonin levels - dont forget that what your body can replace is limited. Once you run out of Seratonin or even just diminish it slightly by doin this drug you are doing permanat damage. This damage includes a lifetime of being depressed and severe anxiety which not r*****ble.

[disk-ofreak]

WOW!! :eek: this thread fuckin KICKS!!

anyway, i thought your brain could repair some of the damage due to e if you stop using it early enough, young enough?? it can cause permant damage right from the get go????

[phuturephunk]

Originally posted by ninadd

Since you guys are talking about dopamine and seratonin levels - dont forget that what your body can replace is limited. Once you run out of Seratonin or even just diminish it slightly by doin this drug you are doing permanat damage. This damage includes a lifetime of being depressed and severe anxiety which not r*****ble.

...Incorrect...

[ninadd]

Originally posted by phuturephunk

...Incorrect...

How do you figure?? Are you saying it does nothing to your brain????

[tommyarmani]

Originally posted by ninadd

How do you figure?? Are you saying it does nothing to your brain????

i thought these imbalances or the depletion could be corrected by medication?? someone help me out here.

On a related note, i went to a wedding on Saturday night & did enough coke to make Tony Montana envious & was tired & depressed until Tuesday/Wednesday. But now im better. Does this mean i depleted certain Nuerotransmitters & now they are replenished?

please advise. thanks

[mursa]

Originally posted by tommyarmani

i thought these imbalances or the depletion could be corrected by medication?? someone help me out here.

On a related note, i went to a wedding on Saturday night & did enough coke to make Tony Montana envious & was tired & depressed until Tuesday/Wednesday. But now im better. Does this mean i depleted certain Nuerotransmitters & now they are replenished?

please advise. thanks

With cocaine you deplete Dopamine , and with E ,serotonin ......... if you do too much of each substance you usually go through 2-3 days of mild-mid depression (feeling Blank !) ........but with a good diet and enough sleep after usage you can somewhat surpass these symptoms .

[PCR]

what cj7dave2 said....

pay attention peeps - the damage is not caused by the depletion of neurotransmitters but by the complex reactions that cause permanent damage to the neurons. This can be minimized by the post-loading/ SSRI administration.

Of course if you do 2-5 pills a week for prolonged periods of times (months at a time) I don't think any post-loading will help and you may suffer some health problems down the road.