Problem w/ Technics -- please help!

[hoke]

I bought a pair of Technics 1210's on Canal St. on Saturday. I've been fooling around with them and discovered that sometimes -- generally with thicker records -- the platter will slow or even stop when I try to cue the record. Isn't this NOT supposed to happen with Technics?

I did get rid of the rubber mat and I'm using Numark slipmats.

What am I doing wrong? Somebody told me that a lot of what's sold on Canal St. is cheap imitations. Is it possible that I don't really have Technics? Or is this just a question of the slipmat, deck configuration, and/or technique (no pun intended).

Please help!

P.S. I just noticed that when I hold the record, the slipmat spins with the platter. Is that what's supposed to happen, or does that indicate a crappy slipmat?

[entrepreneur]

how much did you pay? usually a technic turntables are $500 each.

[hoke]

389 each.

But that's about the price all the stores down there had, and I've seen the same price on many web sites.

[mysterynyc]

yeah the slipmat is suppose to spin a little..but thats ok. im wondering about the torque of your turntable.maybe its not high enough for the thicker records which are Dubplates...they weigh more obviously so you need enough torque..BUT..

technics has the highest torque out there, so i dont know what to tell you. take it to someone who fixes em and fix the torque on it.

torque is basically the "horsepower" of your turntable. it should be virtually impossible to spin it backwards if you try.thats how you know a good turntable. i have a technics 1300 from like 1981..got it for $100 on ebay...BUT the torque is insane...just as good as 12's

[hoke]

I have no problem spinning it backwards (with my finger directly on the platter, that is).

I'm getting really pissed off.

[hoke]

<Bump>

Anyone?

At this point, I'm inclined to think that I have the world's worst slipmats. I placed a piece of paper towel between the slipmat and the platter, and it was 100x better. Then, for comparison, I tried using just the rubber mat that came with the deck, and got about the same performance as the slipmat.

That must be a pretty crappy slipmat, to be no better than a rubber mat. I'll buy new slipmats this evening and see what happens.

[kb]

dont worry the hole in the center of the record sometimes is not cut big enough it happens to me sometimes and if you put a lot of pressure you can stop the platter .try different slipmats and a lighter touch. peace

[hoke]

In case you're curious, here's the response I got from 1200s.com -- very reassuring:

__________________________

Well, first off, it is very expensive to copy a Technics turntable without noticing alot of real differences. And secondly, it's alot cheaper to bring them in from outside of the U.S. in bulk then to buy them from Technics in the U.S. Also, I've never seen anyone properly copy a 1200. It just can't be done, and if it has been done, I am sure it cost too much to do. Just make sure on the back of your unit, there is a serial number, and usually located above it, there is a 2 or 1 letter mark that should be one of the following: MC, M, E, EK, XL, EG, EB, EH, EF, Ei, XA, PA, PE, PC

If so, you're fine. As for what they sell on Canal st., well, alot of the stuff is Grey/Black market stuff, meaning that the item is not supposed to be sold in the U.S. Different 1200s are meant for different parts of the world. Those letters above tell you which part of the world the item is only supposed to be sold. Alot of times, these Canal St. vendors will group together, buy say 10,000 1200s from another country where the Dollar is more powerful then the local currency, and ship the units to the U.S. Most of these turntables come from Africa, Middle East, South America, Asia, etc... where the Dollar can buy more than the local currency. So they can buy more turntables using the American Dollar then another currency.

This does not make the turntables worst or better, its just that in different parts of the world, they use different electrical settings, different voltage settings, etc. that can affect the performance of the turntable. Essentially, it's still the same 1200, with slightly different electrical components. But 95% of everything else is the same.

Now, on to your problem.... The turntable platter itself should not completely stop unless your holding it(but it does happen), or pressing the record hard enough where the platter slows down or stops, but you will get some fluctuation with speed regardless, simply because you are putting force on the record. The beauty of the 1200 is that even if the platter does slow down when your cueing up a record, as soon as you let go, the platter instantly returns to its normal state. That is what sets it apart from other turntables. The motor is soo powerful, that as soon as you let a record go, the motor instantly returns to normal. Whereas other turntables, it might take like 1/2 a second to get back to normal. So, the platter might slow down, it might not. That is not what makes the 1200s different, what makes it different is the speed in which it returns to normal when you let go of the record. As for your slipmat, yes, it will continue to move, and it might not. A really good slipmat will continue to move as you hold the record. The slipmat is basically used as an anti rotating device, so that you don't have to put alot of pressure on your record to hold it.

In all honesty, your turntable seems to be working fine. Do not think that the platter must continue to rotate, and that it is sooo powerful that you can't make it stop. As I said, sometimes it slows down, sometimes it stops, and then sometimes it continues. But, as soon as you let the record or the platter go, it should instantly return to normal speed. If it does not, then you have a problem.

Hope this helps.

CustomerCare@1200s.com

www.1200s.com

[phantombass]

Originally posted by kb

dont worry the hole in the center of the record sometimes is not cut big enough it happens to me sometimes and if you put a lot of pressure you can stop the platter .try different slipmats and a lighter touch. peace

I will agree with KB on this one. The problem simply is that the hole in the record is not big enough yet causing the platter to stop when you hold the record for cueing. Simply go back and fourth with the record to make the hole bigger. Its not your slipmat.

[hoke]

Its not your slipmat.

You guys are probably right that the hole has something to do with it. But did you read about my experiment with the paper towel? I really do think my slipmat is sub-par. I'm going to try using wax paper, to avoid spending $ on new slipmats.

I got another reply from 1200s.com that also suggested using wax paper.

Thanks for everybody's input. I'm really new to this and the challenges of getting started are both frustrating and fun -- if that's really possible

[thehacker]

Originally posted by hoke

You guys are probably right that the hole has something to do with it. But did you read about my experiment with the paper towel? I really do think my slipmat is sub-par. I'm going to try using wax paper, to avoid spending $ on new slipmats.

I got another reply from 1200s.com that also suggested using wax paper.

Thanks for everybody's input. I'm really new to this and the challenges of getting started are both frustrating and fun -- if that's really possible

funny thing about the wax paper - old hip hop dudes used to use that to help with their scratch play... it caught on so hardcore that technics now actually gives you a plastic/wax sheet WITH the slipmat that comes with a new sl-1200m3d.

[pangelid]

yeah, i bought a 1210 from a website caus of the price, and when I got it, the directions were in turkish, and it came with a voltage converter. It works fine though. Oh, and those big thick slipmats that come with the tech suck. Take it off, and cut a slipmat size portion out of a plastic shopping back or wax paper and put that under your cloth slipmat. That will help your records slide better. Or just go out and buy some.

Originally posted by hoke

In case you're curious, here's the response I got from 1200s.com -- very reassuring:

__________________________

Well, first off, it is very expensive to copy a Technics turntable without noticing alot of real differences. And secondly, it's alot cheaper to bring them in from outside of the U.S. in bulk then to buy them from Technics in the U.S. Also, I've never seen anyone properly copy a 1200. It just can't be done, and if it has been done, I am sure it cost too much to do. Just make sure on the back of your unit, there is a serial number, and usually located above it, there is a 2 or 1 letter mark that should be one of the following: MC, M, E, EK, XL, EG, EB, EH, EF, Ei, XA, PA, PE, PC

If so, you're fine. As for what they sell on Canal st., well, alot of the stuff is Grey/Black market stuff, meaning that the item is not supposed to be sold in the U.S. Different 1200s are meant for different parts of the world. Those letters above tell you which part of the world the item is only supposed to be sold. Alot of times, these Canal St. vendors will group together, buy say 10,000 1200s from another country where the Dollar is more powerful then the local currency, and ship the units to the U.S. Most of these turntables come from Africa, Middle East, South America, Asia, etc... where the Dollar can buy more than the local currency. So they can buy more turntables using the American Dollar then another currency.

This does not make the turntables worst or better, its just that in different parts of the world, they use different electrical settings, different voltage settings, etc. that can affect the performance of the turntable. Essentially, it's still the same 1200, with slightly different electrical components. But 95% of everything else is the same.

Now, on to your problem.... The turntable platter itself should not completely stop unless your holding it(but it does happen), or pressing the record hard enough where the platter slows down or stops, but you will get some fluctuation with speed regardless, simply because you are putting force on the record. The beauty of the 1200 is that even if the platter does slow down when your cueing up a record, as soon as you let go, the platter instantly returns to its normal state. That is what sets it apart from other turntables. The motor is soo powerful, that as soon as you let a record go, the motor instantly returns to normal. Whereas other turntables, it might take like 1/2 a second to get back to normal. So, the platter might slow down, it might not. That is not what makes the 1200s different, what makes it different is the speed in which it returns to normal when you let go of the record. As for your slipmat, yes, it will continue to move, and it might not. A really good slipmat will continue to move as you hold the record. The slipmat is basically used as an anti rotating device, so that you don't have to put alot of pressure on your record to hold it.

In all honesty, your turntable seems to be working fine. Do not think that the platter must continue to rotate, and that it is sooo powerful that you can't make it stop. As I said, sometimes it slows down, sometimes it stops, and then sometimes it continues. But, as soon as you let the record or the platter go, it should instantly return to normal speed. If it does not, then you have a problem.

Hope this helps.

CustomerCare@1200s.com

www.1200s.com

[thehacker]

i dunno man

i have the rubber mat, the plastic/wax sheet, and the cloth mat on top and it's all good.

[entrepreneur]

you buy something on canal you get anal..

[pangelid]

Originally posted by thehacker

i dunno man

i have the rubber mat, the plastic/wax sheet, and the cloth mat on top and it's all good.

the thick mat is too high for me. It doesnt let me twist the spindle in the middle, so i take it off.

[thehacker]

that's what the rekkid label and the pitch selectah are for

naw, i hear ya.

[quoth]

Originally posted by hoke

I bought a pair of Technics 1210's on Canal St. on Saturday. I've been fooling around with them and discovered that sometimes -- generally with thicker records -- the platter will slow or even stop when I try to cue the record. Isn't this NOT supposed to happen with Technics?

I did get rid of the rubber mat and I'm using Numark slipmats.

What am I doing wrong? Somebody told me that a lot of what's sold on Canal St. is cheap imitations. Is it possible that I don't really have Technics? Or is this just a question of the slipmat, deck configuration, and/or technique (no pun intended).

Please help!

P.S. I just noticed that when I hold the record, the slipmat spins with the platter. Is that what's supposed to happen, or does that indicate a crappy slipmat?

hey not for nothing...dont know if it means much...but maybe theres a problem because u have the 1210 models instead of 1200!! models?? the 1210 models were mainly made for europe...so maybe its simple a Euro/USA configuration of somewhat with how its made cause also dont forget we run our voltage current at a different rate then they do. But as far as canal st....yer just better off going through the whole typical new dj deal of dropping down the $500 each for Tech 1200's. The rubber mat BTW is suppose to stay on there and helps control vibration as well as fricition.

[breakbeatz2]

Originally posted by mysterynyc

yeah the slipmat is suppose to spin a little..but thats ok. im wondering about the torque of your turntable.maybe its not high enough for the thicker records which are Dubplates...they weigh more obviously so you need enough torque..BUT..

technics has the highest torque out there, so i dont know what to tell you. take it to someone who fixes em and fix the torque on it.

torque is basically the "horsepower" of your turntable. it should be virtually impossible to spin it backwards if you try.thats how you know a good turntable. i have a technics 1300 from like 1981..got it for $100 on ebay...BUT the torque is insane...just as good as 12's

as soon as i saw the title of the thread i knew greg would be in here somewhere

by the way, greg, you ever heard a guy named DJ Craze... sickkk breaks and drum and bass type stuff i just DLed a set of his. never heard of the fella, but hes suppsed to be a scratching champion or something

um.... this post has absolutely nothing to do with the thread but hey, i was bored

[hoke]

maybe theres a problem because u have the 1210 models instead of 1200!!

Yeah, the 1210's are European, but they're also voltage-switched. If you lift the platter, theres a knob there for switching between 110 and 220. I have it set to 110, which is right for the U.S.

The rubber mat BTW is suppose to stay on there and helps control vibration as well as fricition.

Are you sure? Almost everything I've seen has said to take off the rubber mat.

Anyway, I put waxpaper between the platter and the slipmat, and it's all good now. I must just have *really* non-slippy slipmats.

[thehacker]

the rubber mat is good.

you really wanna f' up your platter, or worse, your drive system?

quoth is spot on with the advice.

maybe you have a misconception about how 'easy' it's supposed to be to scratch-play a record - there are Reasons shops like turntable lab sell 'exercise' units which consist of a woodblock and a spring loaded simulation quarter-piece of vinyl... scratch/battle dj's WORK their wrists to get the effects they do...

[hoke]

the rubber mat is good.

you really wanna f' up your platter, or worse, your drive system?

quoth is spot on with the advice.

maybe you have a misconception about how 'easy' it's supposed to be to scratch-play a record - there are Reasons shops like turntable lab sell 'exercise' units which consist of a woodblock and a spring loaded simulation quarter-piece of vinyl... scratch/battle dj's WORK their wrists to get the effects they do...

Look, no offense, but every online tutorial I've seen has said to ditch the rubber mat. The people at 1200s.com said to ditch the rubber mat.

Visit the DJ Source forums and do a search for "rubber slipmat". See what I mean?

I'm a house DJ, not a scratch DJ -- maybe that has something to do with the difference in advice?

[quoth]

Originally posted by hoke

Look, no offense, but every online tutorial I've seen has said to ditch the rubber mat. The people at 1200s.com said to ditch the rubber mat.

Visit the DJ Source forums and do a search for "rubber slipmat". See what I mean?

I'm a house DJ, not a scratch DJ -- maybe that has something to do with the difference in advice?

look no offense but just STFU and listen to us because u are just starting out and WTF??? u think that they sell Technics with that rubber mat for their health or just to fuckin make money????? HELL NO...its there for a reason...USE IT!!! i really think yer whole problem has to do with 2 things...A) that u bought it from canal st. not very refutable such as a Sam Ash or PSSL.com 2) its the 1210 model NOT the 1200mk-2 or mk-3d model. Furthermore...just fuckin read this if u are gonna be a know-it-all and not use the rubber mat...it is an essential part of the turntable. Specs of the Technics turntable and WHY the rubber mat is used FOR DAMPING SOUND VIBRATION SO THAT THE PLATTER DOESNT JUMP AND THE NEDDLE SKIP!!

The reason why all those UK websites say not to use that shit is cause A) thats how europe does it and thats because they are not amateurs and they do that for specified reasons such as only being a Scratch battle DJ. Me for example...here is my setup...i got Reg slipmats...and i traced a slipmat with pencil on a piece of typical wax paper that u use to wrap frozen foods. i cut it out..then poked a hole in the center just the right size for the spindle. But u do what u want and shit u know. if u think that its easier to use without the rubber mat then fine...but if u find that yer needles or cartridges start skippin then u will know why. As far as paper towels go...dont even bother...wax paper is the way to go no doubt..reduces friction WAY more and doesnt produce lint that can get on yer records due to static electricity thus lettin dust build up on yer neddles...thus makin yer shit skip or scratch and ruining the duration. I hope this provides somewhat helpful for thats all im tryin to do though sometimes i just get really into discusion but mean no harm just tryin to lead u the right way lad. Any more questions or shit...drop me a PM. peace. -Quoth

btw..did i ever meet u at a meetup or some shit?? i could swear i did.

[alexgerman68]

Whoever said they knoew greg would hopin here is a tad funny. I hear he is a nice guy. You kinda have to be obsessed with djing and music to get out there..yah know?

[hoke]

quoth,

Look, I'm not a "know-it-all", I'm just trying to reconcile the fact that I'm getting conflicting advice -- and your advice is in the minority of what I've seen so far!

There's really no need to curse and give me a hard time the way you are -- yes, I'm just starting out, and that's why I'm trying to find out exactly what the right thing to do is. And I did ask a legitimate question about the difference between house and scratch DJs. You've actually confused the issue even more for me, because you say that the rubber mat is there for absorption, but they you say that the UK DJs don't use them because they're scratch DJs. First of all, I don't know how you judged that, but even if it's true, then wouldn't scratch DJs need the absorption even more?

Here are some more points where I'm confused.

1) Yeah, I bought my decks at Canal St. But that doesn't necessarily make them sub-par. I've been reassured that it would be too costly to imitate Technics. The decks I bought were likely bought as part of a bulk shipment in a struggling European country. That explains why they were so cheap, and also why they came with two sets of instructions -- one in English and one in Russian. But I'm definitely interested to hear a more detailed explanation as to why my decks might be inferior.

2) As far as I know, there's nothing wrong with 1210s. Many people in the US use them. Yes, they're European models, but I'll say this again: they are voltage switched. They have a setting for 110 or 220; other than that, they're about the same as 1200's. That said, if you have any real insight into a problem with the 1210's, I'm all ears. Really, I am.

3) The link you gave is an advertisement. They're going over all of the included features in an attempt to sell the thing -- not as advice to new DJs. Do you have any other sources that talk about the rubber mat?

4) Why on earth would European DJs configure their TT's any differently than American DJs? Also, keep in mind that the DJ Source forum is a globally accessible web site. It's not restricted to British posters. From what I can tell, there are plenty of people from the US posting on that board, too.

5) Did you read my second-to-last post? I *am* using waxpaper. The paper towel was just an experiment to see if the slipmat was really my problem. Again, everything seems to be working just fine now.

6) No, I've never met you. I can't tell if you mean that in a good way or a bad way, but honestly, with the type of response you gave me, I don't *want* to meet you -- whether or not everybody else says you're a "nice guy".

"Peace"

[quoth]

Originally posted by hoke

quoth,

Look, I'm not a "know-it-all", I'm just trying to reconcile the fact that I'm getting conflicting advice -- and your advice is in the minority of what I've seen so far!

There's really no need to curse and give me a hard time the way you are -- yes, I'm just starting out, and that's why I'm trying to find out exactly what the right thing to do is. And I did ask a legitimate question about the difference between house and scratch DJs. You've actually confused the issue even more for me, because you say that the rubber mat is there for absorption, but they you say that the UK DJs don't use them because they're scratch DJs. First of all, I don't know how you judged that, but even if it's true, then wouldn't scratch DJs need the absorption even more?

Here are some more points where I'm confused.

1) Yeah, I bought my decks at Canal St. But that doesn't necessarily make them sub-par. I've been reassured that it would be too costly to imitate Technics. The decks I bought were likely bought as part of a bulk shipment in a struggling European country. That explains why they were so cheap, and also why they came with two sets of instructions -- one in English and one in Russian. But I'm definitely interested to hear a more detailed explanation as to why my decks might be inferior.

2) As far as I know, there's nothing wrong with 1210s. Many people in the US use them. Yes, they're European models, but I'll say this again: they are voltage switched. They have a setting for 110 or 220; other than that, they're about the same as 1200's. That said, if you have any real insight into a problem with the 1210's, I'm all ears. Really, I am.

3) The link you gave is an advertisement. They're going over all of the included features in an attempt to sell the thing -- not as advice to new DJs. Do you have any other sources that talk about the rubber mat?

4) Why on earth would European DJs configure their TT's any differently than American DJs? Also, keep in mind that the DJ Source forum is a globally accessible web site. It's not restricted to British posters. From what I can tell, there are plenty of people from the US posting on that board, too.

5) Did you read my second-to-last post? I *am* using waxpaper. The paper towel was just an experiment to see if the slipmat was really my problem. Again, everything seems to be working just fine now.

6) No, I've never met you. I can't tell if you mean that in a good way or a bad way, but honestly, with the type of response you gave me, I don't *want* to meet you -- whether or not everybody else says you're a "nice guy".

"Peace"

:laugh: bro would u calm the fuck down??

1) i always fuckin curse and everyone who knows me...which is almost this whole board knows this.

2)totally no need to fuckin come on strong with yer post cause as i said twards the end...i mean no harm its just how i am personality wise...and this is a goddamn messageboard and it aint no tech-support helpline where the product is right in front of me (my decks are upstairs)

3)hey man it really doesnt bother me if u dont *want* to meet me i just said that cause i could swear u introduced yerself sometime at a club. but i could be wrong

4)hell, im just tryin to help like everyone else here

5) yes that link was an advertisement but if u read everything u would see the part where it says what the rubber mat is used for but like i said to each his own

6)no i DID NOT say that UK DJ's ARE scratch dj's all i said was that they use them for different dj-ing purposes such as scratchin and the whole bottom line of the rubber mat and why it comes with the product in the first place is to dampin bass reasonance. So that when yer playin the vibration from a speaker system doesn't make the platter unstable and the neddle to skip.

7)though u may not think there is not much difference in the way a 1210 is manufactured and a 1200 manufactured...the voltage thing doesn't even matter cause all TECHNICS both 1200's and 1210's have the switch so that they can be universal.....but what i was saying is europe is different all together mainly just look at the fact they the use the metric system and we use the Standard system which BAM!! right there shows that europe is europe and america is america. But i honestly dont even see after readin all of yer posts yer basic problem...cause it could be that maybe there IS a difference since they are 1210's and not 1200's and maybe there IS a chance that u need to be lighter on yer fingers cause its all technique and hand co-ordination after some time that u get it down pat..hence why i give props to people who wanna learn how to dj because in fact DJ-ing IS NOT FOR EVERYONE..and if in general u cant get the hang of it then u are stuck with a huge investment.

well look i really seriously aint gonna sit here and post my brains out on one friggin thread...think what u will about me..cause i dont give a fuck..just tryin to help yer ass as best as i can over a messageboard. So sorry for any "misinterpetation" that u have about me. and like i said...if u seriously have a question then drop me a PM instead of responding on this thread.

good luck and hope yer problem is takin care of with yer decks. peace...-Quoth