Drug testing in high school.

[jennEfer]

Ok, so this doesn't pertain to many of us because most of us are either in college or out of school alltogether. But, there is a supreme court case going to trial today about whether or not high school students can be tested for drugs at the discresion of school faculty. Students participating in sports, clubs, and activities are required to take a drug test in some high schools. I know for a fact that a local catholic school by me requires that ALL students get drug tested on a regular basis and before entering the school.

The argument being made against this is that students involved in after-school activities are more likely to abstain from drug use because they don't have any idle time. Also, if they are able to test certain groups of people, why not test everyone?

What does everyone think about this? How do you think the supreme court will rule on the case?

Let me see if I can find the article somewhere, it might give alittle more insight.

[momadance]

the supreme court will rule that in public scholls, they can not test anybody and everybody. they can however make some loophole that says something along the lines of...for extra curricular activities you have to get tested, and then require all students to participate in at least on activity.

[jennEfer]

High Court Reviews Student Drug Tests

By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS

Filed at 5:59 a.m. ET

WASHINGTON (AP) -- The Supreme Court is hearing a case that should allow it to clarify questions lingering from its landmark 1995 ruling that public schools may test student athletes for drugs.

Lindsey Earls, a top student who had never been in trouble, says her high school had no reason to suspect her of drug use, and no right to demand she submit a urine sample to prove she was clean.

The 1998 drug test was a condition of Lindsey's and other students' participation in extracurricular activities at a rural Oklahoma school. Now it is the basis of a Supreme Court case examining the constitutionality of many student drug tests.

``It was sort of sprung on us,'' said Earls, now a freshman at Dartmouth College who sang in her high school choir and participated on an academic quiz team. ``I felt strongly about it. That is none of their business.''

Unanswered then was whether schools may also test students involved in extracurricular activities apart from sports, or even the entire student body.

Wider drug testing remains relatively rare among the nation's 15,500 public school districts. Lower courts have reached differing conclusions about the practice.

Earls and her younger sister, backed by the American Civil Liberties Union, claim that such ``suspicionless'' drug tests violate the Constitution's guarantee against unreasonable searches or seizures.

The National Education Association, the American Academy of Pediatrics and the National Organization for the Reform of Marijuana Laws are among the other organizations supporting the students. The libertarian Cato Institute and the conservative Rutherford Institute are also on board.

Tecumseh, Okla., school administrators have said drugs were a persistent but not widespread problem among their high schoolers. There was no particular reason to suspect students who participated in activities such as the debate team or competitive choral singing, the school said.

But the school claimed in court papers that the random tests were a deterrent. If students wanted to represent the school in extracurricular activities, they might think twice about using drugs, the school argued.

The Bush administration and a long list of organizations, including the Drug-Free Schools Coalition and the National School Boards Association, are backing the school system.

Solicitor General Theodore Olson, the administration's top Supreme Court lawyer, pointed to a 2000 government survey in which 54 percent of high school seniors reported some illegal drug use in their lifetime. Nearly 25 percent said they had used drugs within the last month.

``School children are not only more vulnerable to drug use than adults, but such abuse is much more likely to devastate their lives,'' Olson wrote in a friend-of-the-court brief.

A federal court initially rejected Earls' suit, but a federal appeals court ruled the other way last year.

In its appeal to the Supreme Court, the school argued that the lower court drew the wrong conclusions from the 1995 athlete case, and that its ruling conflicts with other appeals courts around the country.

The Tecumseh testing program ran for part of two school years. It was suspended after Earls sued.

Only children involved in competitive extracurricular activities were tested on the theory that by voluntarily representing the school, they had opened themselves to greater scrutiny than other students.

The policy covered a range of voluntary clubs and sports, including the Future Farmers of America club, cheerleading and football. Students were tested at the beginning of the school year. Thereafter, tests were random.

Overall, 505 high school students were tested for drug use. Three students, all of them athletes, tested positive, Earls' lawyer said. Two of the athletes also participated in other extracurricular activities.

The school offered drug counseling after a positive test, and those who complied could remain on their teams. Those who refused were barred from competition.

The case is Board of Education of Independent School District No. 92 of Pottawatomie County v. Earls, 01-332.

[jennEfer]

Originally posted by momadance

the supreme court will rule that in public scholls, they can not test anybody and everybody. they can however make some loophole that says something along the lines of...for extra curricular activities you have to get tested, and then require all students to participate in at least on activity.

However, in private schools they can test anyone and everyone. My boyfriend went to catholic school, and when he graduated the drug-test program was optional. Meaning that if you wanted to get drug tested you could go do it. Then they made it mandatory for all who wanted to enter the school right after he graduated in 99'.

Personally, I don't think that they should be able to drug test students. If a student wants to fuck up their body by doing drugs, or if they want to experiment with drugs, that is thier business. UNLESS they bring their drugs into school or come to school fucked up on whatever, then I think the school has the right to test. If not, I think it should be up to the parent of the student to give them a drug test, not the school.

[vision]

i'd like to see the supreme court pass a law that drug test politicians n teachers at the public's discretion

[joeg]

why don't we just brand & tag everyone under the age of 18 and lead them around by leashes... and when they get "out of line" we'll use the cattle prod...

Am I the only one who thinks minors are treated like subhumans???

[brickhouse]

I don't see why the hell you can't drug test athletes...every professional league does it, the olympics do it, etc etc....it can create unfair competition, and since use of certain drugs can elevate heart rate and blood pressure, etc, it's more of a safety concern for that than other things...

As far as general drug testing, I think that's probably also OK if it's done randomly. The problem with both of those is that if public schools do drug testing, they're government funded and hence subject to Title VII of the civil rights act of 1964 (pertaining to education), and if the testing is found to disproportionately impact minorities, then it could be outlawed by the courts. Unfortunately, the way society still is in its profiling, if it was not chosen at random it would almost certainly disproportionately impact minorities, although it would also impact kooky looking fellas like ourselves.

Maybe I'm just getting old, but aren't drugs illegal anyway? And if you're a minor, shouldn't your parents have a right to know that you're using them? I mean, it's not illegal to have drugs in your system, so even if there was drug testing there really isn't any legal action that could be taken. However, if it's misapplied, it really could turn people away from school and the like, especially if as punishment the school was to take away the one thing that is keeping a lot of people in school anyway (i.e. music, sports, shop, etc.).

Yeah, I think I'm just getting old. Oh well, time to snort another line...

[joeg]

I think drug testing makes sense for the atheletes dan... especially for steroids and things like that...

As for regular kooky joe/dan/whatever.... I think its just another infringement into the already nonexistant rights of minors... If parents want to know if their kids are taking drugs, then they can be parents and go get their kids tested for drugs...

The idea of herding minors into drug tests at school, just brings my view of prisons and public schools closer together...

[phuturephunk]

Originally posted by joeg

why don't we just brand & tag everyone under the age of 18 and lead them around by leashes... and when they get "out of line" we'll use the cattle prod...

Am I the only one who thinks minors are treated like subhumans???

. . . many of them deserve it . . . and I am of the opinion that the state should be allowed to test everyone . . . EVERYONE, no exceptions . . each quarter students would ALL have to submit . . .

. . . You know . . I find it funny that all these groups are against this type of testing . . . At first, I believed it was sincerely because of civil liberties, but now that I really examine it . . . . and the Rutherford Institute being the biggest factor of my decision . . I can only see this anti-drug testing stance as a way of admitting, without actually admitting that THEIR children, the so called "achievers" of many of the schools in question would be the first one's caught . . .

. . Sad but true . . . Like in the movie traffic, when Michael Douglas's character ponders on how to combat an enemy when that enemy may be in your own family, these people know their guilty, and can come up with no other solution . . .

[djmikedr]

I think a teacher SHOULD have a right to test a student.

After all, parents tend to think they can lighten their responsibilities on teachers anyway. might as well give em some power they can use.

[dr0ne]

Originally posted by joeg

why don't we just brand & tag everyone under the age of 18 and lead them around by leashes... and when they get "out of line" we'll use the cattle prod...

Am I the only one who thinks minors are treated like subhumans???

i'm not sure about this, but i believe the supreme court has ruled in the past that minors do NOT enjoy the same freedoms protected by the constitution as adults do (in this case, 4th unreasonable S&S)

it'll be interesting to see what happens...i'm actually against it....this is basically delegation of parenting which is bullshit....you as a parent should fucking act like one and get your child tested if you have a reason to.

private schools are allowed to do it and many many employers ask for a test as condition for employment.

funny thing is, the kids with a drug problem that get tested always seem to get around it....i knew this kid back in high school who got busted w/ herb and got probation, he'd get tested on a monday every two weeks, so guess what....he stopped smoking herb and became a coke fiend (coke wont show in urine after a day or so in most people).

but make no mistake about it....if this shit passes and they start throwing random tests in public schools, it is very likely that it will lower drug use.....either that or kids will start moving on to other drugs from weed to yay which stays in your system for less time.

of course it all depends on the test....supposedly hair sample tests are getting cheaper now so they may start doing that....most drugs will be in the sample for at least a week after use.

i actually remember hearing some rumor about this drug test the CIA uses for its applicants that could catch weed from 5 years ago but that's an urban legend

[joeg]

Originally posted by dr0ne

this is basically delegation of parenting which is bullshit....you as a parent should fucking act like one and get your child tested if you have a reason to.

Strongly Agree.

[bigpoppanils]

i have to agree with the educators on this one

i have seen/heard of too many peoples lives being ruined by drug habits that most often began in high school. So many of my fellow classmates began taking drugs in high school, and screwed themselves when they entered college. Most of the time their parents didnt have a clue (and some parents still don't to this day). If testing exposes these kids drug habits maybe they might get help and not grow up to be total screwups.

[dr0ne]

Originally posted by bigpoppanils

i have to agree with the educators on this one

i have seen/heard of too many peoples lives being ruined by drug habits that most often began in high school. So many of my fellow classmates began taking drugs in high school, and screwed themselves when they entered college. Most of the time their parents didnt have a clue (and some parents still don't to this day). If testing exposes these kids drug habits maybe they might get help and not grow up to be total screwups.

see from my experience i've seen more of the opposite to be true but i have no data to back it up so in general case you may be right. here's the thing....the kids who started using in high school, some became fiends and ruined their lives but the majority went along just fine and by the time they hit college they're just jaded about it....then you have the kids who never even drank a beer in high school then they hit college and bam....binge drinking, drug addicts just because it hits them all at once, like all of a sudden they have this new freedom, new friends, (and LOTS more parties )

and seriously, if you're someone with a serious drug problem, not the occasional bowl smoker, but the fiend who smokes cock for crack rock and your parents have no clue about it isn't that a problem right there? i mean how hard is it to tell that you have a coke problem for example? you're spending 50 bucks a day on dope, you look all fucking crooked, and you're probably too busy thinking about banging lines then doing your homework, what kind of a parent who spends maybe 10 minutes a day with their kid wouldn't notice this? I knew kids with serious drug problems....their parents all knew about it.....they all went to rehab.....multiple times and still didn't learn their lesson. i don't think this testing thing's gonna change that.

[echostar]

i think the parents should worry about it

[thehacker]

if drug testing had been implemented while i was going to high school i would have dropped out and gone for my GED just based on the principle of the thing...

[bigpoppanils]

Originally posted by dr0ne

see from my experience i've seen more of the opposite to be true but i have no data to back it up so in general case you may be right. here's the thing....the kids who started using in high school, some became fiends and ruined their lives but the majority went along just fine and by the time they hit college they're just jaded about it....then you have the kids who never even drank a beer in high school then they hit college and bam....binge drinking, drug addicts just because it hits them all at once, like all of a sudden they have this new freedom, new friends, (and LOTS more parties )

and seriously, if you're someone with a serious drug problem, not the occasional bowl smoker, but the fiend who smokes cock for crack rock and your parents have no clue about it isn't that a problem right there? i mean how hard is it to tell that you have a coke problem for example? you're spending 50 bucks a day on dope, you look all fucking crooked, and you're probably too busy thinking about banging lines then doing your homework, what kind of a parent who spends maybe 10 minutes a day with their kid wouldn't notice this? I knew kids with serious drug problems....their parents all knew about it.....they all went to rehab.....multiple times and still didn't learn their lesson. i don't think this testing thing's gonna change that.

my graduating class must be an exception to that....most of the druggies in HS are still the druggies now, in some cases worse

and about the parents...never forget the power of denial

[dusted]

Originally posted by bigpoppanils

i have to agree with the educators on this one

i have seen/heard of too many peoples lives being ruined by drug habits that most often began in high school. So many of my fellow classmates began taking drugs in high school, and screwed themselves when they entered college. Most of the time their parents didnt have a clue (and some parents still don't to this day). If testing exposes these kids drug habits maybe they might get help and not grow up to be total screwups.

So basically, you believe that the government, via the public schools should have the right to intrude on the privacy of the students, who do not have the option of "opting out" of school.

You support the fact that the Constitution does not apply to minors. And you support the notion of the government socially engineering people and the government superceding parental discretion.

So do you believe in freedom at all? Doesn't sound like it.

[dusted]

Repeat after me people:

IT IS NOT THE GOVERNMENTS JOB TO LEGISLATE MORALITY!

IT IS NOT THE GOVERNMENTS JOB TO RAISE PEOPLES KIDS FOR THEM!

Jesus, if they spent as much energy teaching kids how to read and do math,as they do with this bullshit, maybe the American populace wouldn't be so damn ignorant.

[bigpoppanils]

so you disagree if a social worker stops an act of child abuse?