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Evan

I need relationship advice

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Ok, I need help from you guys. I am confused as all hell.

Let me start this story out by saying that I have been online for over 10 years. I have met many people over the internet. Guys and girls. Some of these girl I have dated. Some have been 1-2 date things. Some have been 6 months- 1 year relationships. It's not where I couldn’t' meet people in real life. I have a great outside social life. It's just that you can get to know more about people online since people open up more when they are not face to face.

The girls I have dated have been from every aspect of life. I am not closed minded and have been open to new experiences with different women. Ultimately, I can say that 90% of the women online I meet, I have hooked up with, or slept with. That's not me bragging. That's just a simple fact. I am very open to people online, and they know I don't want to play any games.

This brings us to my newest girl. Let's call her Debbie (not her real name). Debbie was searching through the Yahoo personals on Thursday late night and came across mine. She messaged me at around 2 a.m. and we started talking. I found out she was a bartender/coat check girl at a strip club in Manhattan, as well as a actor, singer, model, and worked for a marketing firm during the day. I was impressed and told her about myself. She then turned on her web cam for me and I saw her pic for the first time. She was rather cute. She was 27, thin, about 5"3, with a great smile. After about an hour and a half I had convinced her to strip for me and show me the rest of her body. She told me she had never done that before and she seemed rather shy. She then told me she had been a lesbian for about 2 years, and then about two and a half years ago, she had gotten married to a guy. They had just divorced in Dec. and she had not been with a guy since her ex. I was cool with that. Her past is in her past. I invited her to my house in CT for Friday night (about 16 hours from then) to meet in person. She agreed that would be cool and instead of asking for more web cam fun, I decided to save that for that night.

So, basically Debbie came over that night and she looked better in person. Without boring u of all teh details, it took about an hour before we were having sex. We spent the rest of the weekend in bed cuddling, making out, fucking, etc.. I warned myself not to get attached to her cause I didn't know her yet as well as me being a little put off at how easy she had been. She was a little twisted also, buying me a cock ring that weekend, as well as telling me some sex storied in her life I don't think ANYONE wants to hear, Anyways, she left on Sunday afternoon with a promise to see each other soon.

We talked a couple times after that, and I knew she had to work on Monday night. I went online tough and I saw her Yahoo acct. on. I messaged her, but it turned out to be her best friend instead. We talked for a bit, and after about 5-10 minutes he started to tell me things about her that I never knew. The biggest being that she was a Dominatrix for hire. Se didn't fuck her clients (supposedly) but she would whip them and do other S & M stuff. This was something I had not even suspected. He even told me she was due to fly out to Japan in 2 months for a very wealthy client out there. I didn't know how to react, and just waited for her to call me.

Wile at my house this weekend. she had seen that I belong to a website called FlyGuyCrew. If you go to the page (removed) , you'll see me as "Pick of the Week" on the bottom. I know a couple girls and guys on there also and we share details of what we had done with whom. One thing we never did though, was step on anyone's toes. Well, there was one guy, let's call him "Mike" who I had been talking to online for months. I had invited him to a couple parties I have thrown and knew him as a playa online. Well, On Tuesday night I signed on to flyguycrew only to see Debbie's pic and profile on there. Se had done it as a dare by her best friend (the one I had talked to). I saw her and told my friend Mike that she was there. he asked me what my thoughts about her were, and I said that I could never have a relationship with this kind of girl, but would still like to see her a bit more. She messaged me that night, and we talked for an hour and I told her the same thing. She was cool wit that and told me she wanted to see me on Thursday.

I went to sleep that night and woke up Wed. morning. When I got on, Mike messaged me and showed me some pics that kinda shocked me. He had messaged Debbie when I had fallen asleep. It seems that Debbie and him had been talking last night online till late and he got her to masturbate on web cam for him. He told me that the entire time they ad been talking, she ad mentioned me (not by name...se didn't know I knew Mike). He also told me she said she had never masturbated for anyone on web cam before.

I was kinda upset and hurt. Pretty much at both of them. While I was dealing with my feelings, she called me. She started to talk about missing me and seeing me on Thursday night. I couldn't take it anymore and blew up. I asked her why didn't she just go out wit the guy she masturbated for online. So, basically I told her what I knew. She got pissed more at Mike for telling me. We hung up and she called Mike. Mike got pissed at me and told her that I had sent him pics of her and told him everything about her. He didn’t need to say this, but told her just to fuck me. She called me back and cursed me out too. So now I pretty much have ot of them pissed off at me,

Now, let's start with Mike. I was pissed Mike intruded on my turf last night. According to him, once she went online she was fair game. I think that's bullshit. I don't care if someone else had picked her up, but it shouldn't have been Mike. That's like going to a bar and seeing a girl your friend was fucking. Only an asshole would then go up to her and pick her up. Whether or not she went home wit anyone else from the bar doesn't matter. As long as it wasn't your friend. I am the one that showed him her pic. He used the details that I told him, to know how to pick her up. That shit just ain't right, What do you think?

As for her, what am I gonna do? I mean, I know that she is a whore and that there is no future for me with a girl like that, but I am getting sick and tired of girls like this. I don't know ONE girl that doesn't cheat on her boyfriend. I don't know one girl that acts normally. It's like the dating game has gotten soo fucked up, yet no one cares. I have a lot of friends who are girls, and they tell me the dirties things tat they have done. They think it's funny, But it just makes me scared of any future relationship I will get into. I now suspect all women I date of cheating on me and being unfaithful. I know girls that have married their boyfriends who have never known the amount of times they have cheated on one another. In fact, at one wedding, as I was about to walk down the aisle as best man, one of the ushers told me that he had slept with the bride to be the night before. That's just fucked up. So..bascially...is it me? I am not expecting a girl to not have a past. I have a crazy past but if someone would judge me on it, I'd never be able to get a date in the city again. I want to find a girl as freaky and fun loving as I am. But I want her to be mine and no one else’s.

I kinda now want a girl that won’t kiss on the first date. A girl that doesn’t want to go on “Girls night out†with her friends. That wants me included in everything. I see the way that my friends cheat on their boyfriends and know that if a girl really wants to cheat, then she will do it with no way for me to stop her. But I want a girl where I know I won’t ever have to worry about that. Does she exist?

This sux.

Evan

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evan, i'll first start by saying that it's terrible that you feel hurt and sad. that's a bummer.

but you are chock full of double-standards and very quick to judge other people for doing the same things you do. you say that you "could never have a relationship with this kind of a girl," yet you feel you have some sort of rights to her after someone else expresses interest. the "this kind of a girl" phrase alone is a huge insult. really, use a little introspection; just based on what you've written here, you seem to get around quite a lot yourself.

it's really sad to see men (i say men because i have never heard or seen a woman say this) say that they look down on women they've slept with on the first date because they're "easy." you sure liked that they slept with you on the first date, that night.

another thing to keep in mind was that you didn't know this girl before she came to your house, except for a few conversations online. you took a big chance on someone you really didn't know, and a very recently divorced person who's already plastered herself all over the net and doing things for webcams seems less than entirely stable. but she didn't owe you anything just as you didn't owe her anything. one weekend together isn't a promise of anything for the future.

what your friend did wasn't cool. going behind your back after you told him about someone you'd been with wasn't right. i'm with you on that.

but for you to blame this girl in the end for being another "girl like this" or "a whore" is totally unfair. she was good enough for you when she was giving you what you wanted. you just switched to name-calling when your feelings got hurt.

if you want someone who'll be true to you, someone with integrity, you've gotta start looking in the right places. and be sensible as well as learn from experience; people who masturbate in front of webcams and work in strip bars aren't very likely to be old-fashioned girls.

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You should also keep in mind that you don't keep company with the most reputable people in town either. I've read your story on the substances and abuse board and I've seen your website - you hang out with a lot of trashy coke whores, so how do you expect to meet nice girls when you're surrounded by nasty strippers all the time? You even said that this girl was easy b/c she slept w/ you on the 1st night (and let me remind you that 2 people made that decision - not just her) and that you couldn't see yourself being w/ her, so what's the big deal? You knew she was kind of slutty, so what's the big surprise?

Evan, from reading your story and looking at your website, it looks like you come from a good family, are smart and for the most part, have a good head on your shoulders. You seem like a kind, generous person and I think you deserve to find someone just as good of a person as you are. I really think that for some reason, you are trying to hold onto your past and it's just not working for you anymore. I think that since you've lost the drugs, it's time to get rid of the rest of that lifestyle. Why not concentrate on your recovery, career and finding people who are interested in meaningful, fulfilling relationships?

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True. It takes two to tango, and it was as much my fault as hers that we slept together that first night. I wrote this story while I was still very upset, so name calling was very easy for me.

I have cleaned up my life since I've had those pictures on the web. For the last year, I have not dated any dancers, done any wild orgies, etc. I have dated one grl at a time, looking for a girl worthy of relationship. I am lonely in my life and want someone special to share it with.

I've totally changed my lifestyle, and was hoping to meet someone special. Whether or not she was online or in real life made no difference to me. I do know that not once have I had a long term relationship with a girl that slept with me on the first date. I just feel no passion for a girl that does this. I start to worry how many other guys she does this with, and what will happened if she goes out with her friends and meets another guy and does the same with him too. I know that you're thinking that it's as much as i my fault for sleeping with them too, but I'm a guy. We almost never turn down sex. It's weird. I have a friend, that is always in a relationship. When she meets a man for the first time, she can tell if she thinks there is a future with him and will sleep with him on the first date. So far, she has had NO one night stands.

Two of my longest relationships (one was 2 years and the other was 4 years) were with girls that wouldn't kiss me on the first date. Yeah, I was kind of pissed I didn't get any. And it confused me if the girl was interested or not. But I could respect that and even admire it.

I'm even confused about the age of girl I wanr to date. I'm 27 and am past the the age of clubbing every weekend, doing massive amounts of drugs, and exploring life. The girls under 24-25 still want to do all these things. The girls over that age want to date men in their 30s. I've been best man at 5 weddings already. All my friends I went to high school with are married. I'm known as one of the last bachelors of my class. Do you see why I am bugging? It's never been hard for me to get a girl to sleep with me or fool around. Just been hard to find a girl that I can have a relationship with.

Evan

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evan.

not all girls are sluts and not all girls cheat on their boyfriends...

girls that do are probably girls you wouldn't want to be with me anyways...considering they might do the same thing to you as they did to their men...

i don't have any suggestions as to how you can meet any women...but i do wish you luck...i'm not so keen on meeting people online...but as a word of advice (you can take it or not..whatever...) don't have sex with girls when you have known them for only a day-week. get to know them a little bit..if they are worth your time and attention...then see what happens...

a girl that will fuck you after a few hours or even an hour of knowing you...is a slut, plain and simple.

listen to weyes too...she makes good points.

good luck and i hope you find the love of your life soon....

sassa :)

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Originally posted by Evan

Ok. I removed the damn link. Sorry for trying to show the whole picture.

Now please continue offering me more advice. I'm still fucken confused.

Evan

I feel for ya bro, girls are tuff.. Your a great writer by the way, the story of your life was great.. It just seemed that every story had a link....just got a little suspect as to your intentions...

Man , newbies got mad pull around here, he took the link out just for me..;)

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I included the link not as "spam", since I don't have any financial affiliations with that site, but as a way for you guys to see my pics and my profile, to get a better grasp of who I am. The last thing I want to do is be accused of something that is not true, so I removed it. End of story.

Now can we please go back to the main subject of this post?

Oh.. and thanks for the compliment.

Evan

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Cliff notes:

Found girl. Girl had sex on first date. Girl then masterbated on webcam for (ex) friend. Evan is really disspointed with her and other women. Evan wants to know if there is a girl who will respect a relationship in NYC.

That's pretty much what it boils down to.

BTW. I've been talking to friends from around the country, and they are telling me that in the south/Mid West the girls are totally different. Maybe I need to move. :-)

Evan

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dood what did i tell u about chicks on yahoo? every person willing to meet somoene easily off yahoo messenger has gotta be some kinda emotionally fucked up freak. i hate to say it but that is where weirdos congregate. i know people will say im talking out my ass but like 90% of the people on there who are looking to meet people are depressive/suicidal and looking to leech off or push their shit on u. i dont like to sound like a mean bitch but i have just found this from experience & from stories from friends... say i am close minded or whatever but why would you actually expect her to be normal?? have u ever heard of anyone meeting anyone normal on yahoo?

LOL. u got played. you really believed she works in a strip place but has never gotten naked on her webcam before? you think shes innocent but she is gonna be naked fucking u within an hour of your first encounter. shes is just a dirty hoe, she probably gets more ass on yahoo from the nasty, dirty pervs and pedophiles than u would ever imagine. yahoo is a place where there are no standards imo. i can only imagine how many guys this girl gets with her little innocent first time routine. :vomit3:

i think your problem is you are attracted to the wrong type of girls. also, i think u should rule out yahoo as a place to find a decent girl... honestly, i think if you wanna look online, you have a better shot on aol or match, i have heard good things about match (never tried it myself).

:half: kara

...and anyone who disagrees with my description of yahoo messenger people can keep it your youself. i am stating my honest opinion not trying to start drama.

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LOL..I was waiting for you to see this thread.

I agree about Yahoo. I've had tooo many yahoo girls doing web cam masterbation in the last couple weeks. As for the dating sites.. I've been on Match.com. I canceled my subscription after watching other people on it. Two friends of mine would date somone off of it, meanwhile still talking to the hundred guys that were e-mailing them. They would go from one guy to the next. I don't want to be one of those guys.

Wow..is it me, or is this starting to souns pathetic. Am I the only one going through this?

Evan

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I really think that you are just looking in the wrong places for potential mates. There's no need to move, just try out some new places to meet people. Maybe check out new bars, restaurunts, lounges and cafes? What about an upscale dating service? You're not pathetic, you just can't catch a break because like most of us, you're in limbo. You've been through a lot in your life and are going through a lot of changes and it doesn't help that things have changed so much with dating, sex and relationships. Maybe you're not ready for a relationship with all that you've been through and are trying to overcome. Maybe you need to figure yourself out first before you involve somone else in your life. There's no rush - you're still young and while being alone can suck, maybe that's what's best for you right now. Don't stress it, try and make the best of the situation right now. You'll find somebody soon (probably when you least expect it) and you'll be happy...

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how about getting away from the personals/online services entirely for a while and trying to meet people the old-fashioned way, face-to-face? that way, you can get a better sense of who a person really is. if a person is a liar, weirdo, sexual deviant, or anything else undesirable, you can move on and save yourself a lot of time and heartbreak.

a lot of people think that they're meeting more people online and thereby increasing their chances of finding "someone," but because these people turn out to be bad matches (freaks) most of the time, i feel that talking to these people every night in order to get to know them is wasting more time.

go out there in the world and see who's out there. i think you'll find humans, not twisted words.

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you seem to be attracting the wrong type of girl. Maybe you should try some new activities and within these activities you might meet a potential mate. Stop wasting your time with online dating, it's wack.

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My problem is I don't go out enough to meet new people. There are not that many girls in my field of work (Wall St. Technologies) and I don't go to clubs, bars, or lounges really anymore since I've been sober. I go to rehab/NA twice a week, but the last thing u are supposed to be doing is trolling for dates there. When I hang out with my friends, we go out to a resturaunt or back to their apartments.

When I do meet girls, all they want to do is go out drinking at a bar or lounge, something I'm not comfortable with. Do u see my predicament? No life after drugs = no way to go out and have fun and meet new people.

Lurker

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Sorry...this post is starting to sound pathetic. I am just really depressed right now. On top of everything, I just got more bad news this morning, that will negatively effect the rest of my life. Basically, I'll never be able to work on Wall St again. And that sux because that is what I have excelled at for the last decade.

Evan

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Originally posted by Evan

Sorry...this post is starting to sound pathetic. I am just really depressed right now. On top of everything, I just got more bad news this morning, that will negatively effect the rest of my life. Basically, I'll never be able to work on Wall St again. And that sux because that is what I have excelled at for the last decade.

Evan

it's not pathetic; don't apologize :) .

and i'm sorry to hear that.

it's not necessary to always be in a relationship; sometimes it's best to be alone for a while. i know hearing that old "something will happen when it's meant to be" line sucks ass, but the wait-and-see approach can work wonders in many arenas. the night i was approached by 4 men (usually it's 1 or none) and ended up meeting my next bf was a night i just threw on a random shirt and spent no time getting made-up. normally that would've made me feel self-conscious and shy, but there are just too many factors in life for any set few to determine any certain outcome.

all this blahblahblah is just to say that the girl you're looking for is out there, and, if i'm saying this, that's gotta be true; i'm generally pretty jaded about this stuff. what you're asking for - trustworthiness, loyalty, integrity - isn't hard to find if you're in the right places.

and as for the drugs and drinking, once again, the wrong people. i don't drink, and i've spent many a sober night out at clubs. find a girl that's more mature. heck - find a woman.

and i don't know if you have any friends in program, or if any of the ones you know are recovered enough, but i know that a lot of program veterans i've known in my life were great, solid people. see where they hang out, what they do for fun, where they meet people.

i hope i haven't seemed too preachy. i hope we all have been helpful to some degree. be well and take care of yourself :) .

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Originally posted by Evan

Ok, I need help from you guys. I am confused as all hell.

Let me start this story out by saying that I have been online for over 10 years. I have met many people over the internet. Guys and girls. Some of these girl I have dated. Some have been 1-2 date things. Some have been 6 months- 1 year relationships. It's not where I couldn’t' meet people in real life. I have a great outside social life. It's just that you can get to know more about people online since people open up more when they are not face to face.

The girls I have dated have been from every aspect of life. I am not closed minded and have been open to new experiences with different women. Ultimately, I can say that 90% of the women online I meet, I have hooked up with, or slept with. That's not me bragging. That's just a simple fact. I am very open to people online, and they know I don't want to play any games.

This brings us to my newest girl. Let's call her Debbie (not her real name). Debbie was searching through the Yahoo personals on Thursday late night and came across mine. She messaged me at around 2 a.m. and we started talking. I found out she was a bartender/coat check girl at a strip club in Manhattan, as well as a actor, singer, model, and worked for a marketing firm during the day. I was impressed and told her about myself. She then turned on her web cam for me and I saw her pic for the first time. She was rather cute. She was 27, thin, about 5"3, with a great smile. After about an hour and a half I had convinced her to strip for me and show me the rest of her body. She told me she had never done that before and she seemed rather shy. She then told me she had been a lesbian for about 2 years, and then about two and a half years ago, she had gotten married to a guy. They had just divorced in Dec. and she had not been with a guy since her ex. I was cool with that. Her past is in her past. I invited her to my house in CT for Friday night (about 16 hours from then) to meet in person. She agreed that would be cool and instead of asking for more web cam fun, I decided to save that for that night.

So, basically Debbie came over that night and she looked better in person. Without boring u of all teh details, it took about an hour before we were having sex. We spent the rest of the weekend in bed cuddling, making out, fucking, etc.. I warned myself not to get attached to her cause I didn't know her yet as well as me being a little put off at how easy she had been. She was a little twisted also, buying me a cock ring that weekend, as well as telling me some sex storied in her life I don't think ANYONE wants to hear, Anyways, she left on Sunday afternoon with a promise to see each other soon.

We talked a couple times after that, and I knew she had to work on Monday night. I went online tough and I saw her Yahoo acct. on. I messaged her, but it turned out to be her best friend instead. We talked for a bit, and after about 5-10 minutes he started to tell me things about her that I never knew. The biggest being that she was a Dominatrix for hire. Se didn't fuck her clients (supposedly) but she would whip them and do other S & M stuff. This was something I had not even suspected. He even told me she was due to fly out to Japan in 2 months for a very wealthy client out there. I didn't know how to react, and just waited for her to call me.

Wile at my house this weekend. she had seen that I belong to a website called FlyGuyCrew. If you go to the page (removed) , you'll see me as "Pick of the Week" on the bottom. I know a couple girls and guys on there also and we share details of what we had done with whom. One thing we never did though, was step on anyone's toes. Well, there was one guy, let's call him "Mike" who I had been talking to online for months. I had invited him to a couple parties I have thrown and knew him as a playa online. Well, On Tuesday night I signed on to flyguycrew only to see Debbie's pic and profile on there. Se had done it as a dare by her best friend (the one I had talked to). I saw her and told my friend Mike that she was there. he asked me what my thoughts about her were, and I said that I could never have a relationship with this kind of girl, but would still like to see her a bit more. She messaged me that night, and we talked for an hour and I told her the same thing. She was cool wit that and told me she wanted to see me on Thursday.

I went to sleep that night and woke up Wed. morning. When I got on, Mike messaged me and showed me some pics that kinda shocked me. He had messaged Debbie when I had fallen asleep. It seems that Debbie and him had been talking last night online till late and he got her to masturbate on web cam for him. He told me that the entire time they ad been talking, she ad mentioned me (not by name...se didn't know I knew Mike). He also told me she said she had never masturbated for anyone on web cam before.

I was kinda upset and hurt. Pretty much at both of them. While I was dealing with my feelings, she called me. She started to talk about missing me and seeing me on Thursday night. I couldn't take it anymore and blew up. I asked her why didn't she just go out wit the guy she masturbated for online. So, basically I told her what I knew. She got pissed more at Mike for telling me. We hung up and she called Mike. Mike got pissed at me and told her that I had sent him pics of her and told him everything about her. He didn’t need to say this, but told her just to fuck me. She called me back and cursed me out too. So now I pretty much have ot of them pissed off at me,

Now, let's start with Mike. I was pissed Mike intruded on my turf last night. According to him, once she went online she was fair game. I think that's bullshit. I don't care if someone else had picked her up, but it shouldn't have been Mike. That's like going to a bar and seeing a girl your friend was fucking. Only an asshole would then go up to her and pick her up. Whether or not she went home wit anyone else from the bar doesn't matter. As long as it wasn't your friend. I am the one that showed him her pic. He used the details that I told him, to know how to pick her up. That shit just ain't right, What do you think?

As for her, what am I gonna do? I mean, I know that she is a whore and that there is no future for me with a girl like that, but I am getting sick and tired of girls like this. I don't know ONE girl that doesn't cheat on her boyfriend. I don't know one girl that acts normally. It's like the dating game has gotten soo fucked up, yet no one cares. I have a lot of friends who are girls, and they tell me the dirties things tat they have done. They think it's funny, But it just makes me scared of any future relationship I will get into. I now suspect all women I date of cheating on me and being unfaithful. I know girls that have married their boyfriends who have never known the amount of times they have cheated on one another. In fact, at one wedding, as I was about to walk down the aisle as best man, one of the ushers told me that he had slept with the bride to be the night before. That's just fucked up. So..bascially...is it me? I am not expecting a girl to not have a past. I have a crazy past but if someone would judge me on it, I'd never be able to get a date in the city again. I want to find a girl as freaky and fun loving as I am. But I want her to be mine and no one else’s.

I kinda now want a girl that won’t kiss on the first date. A girl that doesn’t want to go on “Girls night out†with her friends. That wants me included in everything. I see the way that my friends cheat on their boyfriends and know that if a girl really wants to cheat, then she will do it with no way for me to stop her. But I want a girl where I know I won’t ever have to worry about that. Does she exist?

This sux.

Evan

ID LOVE TO HELP BUT THATS TOO MUCH 2 READ BRO...SORRY

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screw the online thing...weyes has given u great advice...go the old fashioned, the face to face way...u can tell right off the bat (not always, but most of the time) what type of woman she is...see the kinds of ppl. she hangs around, gauge how "easy" she is, her mannerisms and so on...lil things like that can never be seen online but they give big clues abt the type of person u're dealing with...plus its tons more exciting than sitting in front of a stupid electronic box for hours!

also take up activities...go hiking/biking or do anything else in which there are groups of ppl. involved...start working out, do things on your own every once in a while, it'll build your confidence and u'll find that being single isn't as bad as its made out to be...the club/bar scene is really not the best place to meet relationship material, so i've heard...also dont sweat it too much...women can see a desperate guy a mile away, so it wont do u any good to feel bad abt yourself (i know its easier said than done, but u're gonna have to try, life's hard)

good luck, you'll be alrite...just give it some time

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