A disturbing picture...

[sassa]

Although I don't agree with them being called "criminal" this picture says a lot....

[godfatherbam]

Originally posted by sassa

Although I don't agree with them being called "criminal" this picture says a lot....

ummm i am gonna save what i was gonna say bout that comment about them being criminal....

[johnnyrevs]

it's pretty disturbing but each side has committed atrocities :eek:

[romy20]

WTF I dont even know what to say.

[breakbeatz2]

the angle and the distance at which the guy is standing, there is NO way he can get the body into the picture without a very good wide-angle lens. his camera doesnt have one, and even if it did he wouldnt get it. the way he is standing he'd only be able to get the soldiers from the waist up.

but its funny how people try to make propaganda like this out of NOTHING. a couple of soldiers take a picture, a body is underneath (possibly put there with the use of Photoshop) and now they are criminals. HAHAHA. look at it, the guy ISNT taking the picture of a body but of two soldiers. how gullible do you tihnk we are?????

[Codica3]

Every story has two sides..

But that's still touchy.. :(

[godfatherbam]

Originally posted by breakbeatz2

the angle and the distance at which the guy is standing, there is NO way he can get the body into the picture without a very good wide-angle lens. his camera doesnt have one, and even if it did he wouldnt get it. the way he is standing he'd only be able to get the soldiers from the waist up.

but its funny how people try to make propaganda like this out of NOTHING. a couple of soldiers take a picture, a body is underneath (possibly put there with the use of Photoshop) and now they are criminals. HAHAHA. look at it, the guy ISNT taking the picture of a body but of two soldiers. how gullible do you tihnk we are?????

ok so what makes u the expert in knowin what lens he has when u cant even see it???

[breakbeatz2]

a wide angle lens sticks out a few inches fromt he camera!

my uncle owns a photoshop and used to be a photogropher, and i took a class in photography. think that kind of makes me qualified to say something.

now what makes you an expert to comment on a situation about which you know nothing except what the media feeds you or what you hear from people like the ones who started this thread?

[ghhhhhost]

Im glad someone isnt a member of the MEDIA-LED SHEEP..BEatz good analysis..this is the type of shit which goes on in every war..dont u people know that countries hire public relations firms to spread misinformation..

[loch]

if i were to have access to ALL the photo archives of ALL the conflicts and wars that ever took place, for every picture you show that allegedly display people revelling in the killing of one human life, i will produce a reciprocating picture of the opposing side revelling in the killing of the another human life as well.

is there truth to the picture? probably. is there a picture of palestinians doing the same? probably. propaganda? definitely.

only winners write history. one should also read the losers' account of history as well.

[o-jay®]

Originally posted by loch

if i were to have access to ALL the photo archives of ALL the conflicts and wars that ever took place, for every picture you show that allegedly display people revelling in the killing of one human life, i will produce a reciprocating picture of the opposing side revelling in the killing of the another human life as well.

is there truth to the picture? probably. is there a picture of palestinians doing the same? probably. propaganda? definitely.

only winners write history. one should also read the losers' account of history as well.

Well said. It cuts both ways, unfortunately.

[breakbeatz2]

why is it that in reference to the israeli-palestinian conflict, everyone likes to say botn sides are always to blame, and in all wars everybody's a killer, and evrything is two-sided, etc., but when it comes to the US-Al Qaeda struggle, nobody claims that the US is also to blame and revells in the killing of the terrorists??

i'll tell you why, because in many conflicts, not evrybody deserves equal blame. In WWII, we werent justified taking out Hitler, and mutilating Germany in the process? Now, we arent justifid taking out Al-Qaeda? well in the same way, Israel is justified in defending itself from Palestinian aggression.

[dusted]

*yawn*

more anti-Israeli

pro-Arab propaganda.

Sassa is very emotional

Not able to think rationally at all

therefore Sassa is very influenced by pictures of this nature.

Sassa is the very type of gullible person that these types of pictures are aimed at, since Sassa's thinking is totally clouded by emotion.

Sassa is not able to think about the subject in an intellectual manner. That is why Sassa hasn't been heard from in a while on the Muslim thread.

[breaksny]

LOL Sassa nice timing...right after the other thread falls off page 1...FINALLY! I'm gonna try hard 2 sit this 1 out.

[tribal]

sassa do u really want people to start posting war pictures??? i could post u dozens of palst pictures, with dead israelis. whats your point?? remember a year ago, when those 2 reserve israelis soldiers drove into an arab neighborhood on their way to a base? rememeber what the palst did to them? do u want me to post that? lets just leave it at that

[karch]

Originally posted by tribal

sassa do u really want people to start posting war pictures??? i could post u dozens of palst pictures, with dead israelis. whats your point?? remember a year ago, when those 2 reserve israelis soldiers drove into an arab neighborhood on their way to a base? rememeber what the palst did to them? do u want me to post that? lets just leave it at that

Yeah I did see that. And I've seen tons of video and pictures of the angry palestinian mob that killed the 2 israeli soldeirs. But that's the thing. We see all that all the time in the US media. But the US media fails to show that it's both sides. And there are not really any "good guys" in this war. And this picture shows that it is both sides. And that the US media wouldn't ever show this picture or any like it. Because the US media constantly pushes this idea that "Israel is good, palestinians are bad" But that surely is not the case.

[tribal]

karch, what the fuck are u talking about? show me one news report that says Israel is Good, Palst are Bad! thats bullshit. some stations will obviously be more liberal or more conservative, more pro arab or more pro israeli. They obviously wouldnt show everything, the tv networks never aired the video of the 2 israeli reservists who were slaughtered in front of hundreds. all i keep hearing is everyone is pro israeli and the arabs are not represented. you want to see the real problem, do some research on the arab media and what kind of 'unbiased' news they show. obviously no one is good or bad, but i just dont see how everything is pro israeli as you point out.

[wallflour]

Originally posted by karch

And there are not really any "good guys" in this war. And this picture shows that it is both sides. And that the US media wouldn't ever show this picture or any like it. Because the US media constantly pushes this idea that "Israel is good, palestinians are bad" But that surely is not the case.

I find it hard to have any sympathy for people who do things like:

-attack people who are just chilling at a cafe

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nm/20020307/wl_nm/mideast_dc_664

-attack people who are praying

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20020308/ap_on_re_mi_ea/israel_attack_scene_10

-attack a pre-teen girl's bat mitzvah (there was someone's personal video of it! you call that propaganda?! )

http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/middle_east/newsid_1767000/1767770.stm

-attack a pizza parlor, and then set up a little makeshift monument to glorify the event

http://www.jpost.com/Editions/2001/09/23/LatestNews/LatestNews.35190.html

and the list goes on

I don't think this is your usual "state vs state" warfare

I think Arafat needs to go, but he's not the heart of the matter.

It appears that the Palestinians simply have a bunch of crazy people. There's probably been some brain-washing involved to make it so. It's probably individuals or groups (who don't represent a majority of Palestinians) who are behind all the violence. This is probably a bigger "hearts and minds" matter than US vs. Al Queda. But I don't know if these fanatics, or rather, potential suicide bombers (or gunmen) can be saved. Maybe they could have been saved if someone had taught them how to be more productive with their lives, but at this point, it appears they need to be terminated. There's going to be no serious "peace plan" until these wackos are taken are of.

Here's an idea: Forget about creating their own state. If the Palestinians behaved and then assimilated into Israeli society, they could conceivably reap the benefits of democracy and capitalism, and have a better life. After all, isn't poverty supposedly one of the "root causes" of terrorism?

[dannyf82]

Can we say Propaganda

[dusted]

You want to see a disturbing picture? Here's a fucking disturbing picture.

Some people on this board care more about trouble making terrorists than they do for their own people.

[lonelyboy]

Originally posted by dannyf82

Can we say Propaganda

Can we say dumbass who wasnt there when the bus full of kids blew up 50 yeards away from him?

[dusted]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The Trojan Horse

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Posted: March 7, 2002

1:00 a.m. Eastern

By Joseph Farah

Why can't more people see it? Why doesn't the whole world get it?

I'm talking about Yasser Arafat's "Trojan Horse" approach to the destruction of the state of Israel.

Maybe too many people are not reading any more. Perhaps they have just forgotten, or are unfamiliar with, Homer's "The Illiad" and the tale of how Troy was overtaken by stealth.

Troy was a walled and well-defended city. The Greeks attacked Troy for nine years, but could not overcome its defenses. Ulysses hatched a plan to construct a huge giant horse that could conceal 100 men. After sealing themselves in, the rest of the Greeks sailed away.

In the morning, the Trojans celebrated their victory. Despite warnings from a priest to beware of Greeks bearing gifts, the people of the city wanted to claim the horse as their victory prize. They even tore down some of their walls to get the horse – and the unseen enemy – inside the gates.

When Ulysses and his men disembarked from the Trojan Horse, they burned the city, killed the king and robbed Troy of all its wealth.

For more than 30 years, Arafat has been following the same ploy in his conduct toward Israel. When he talks of peaceful coexistence between his Palestinian state and the Jewish state, he is building a Trojan Horse. And just like the people of Troy, many Israelis and much of the rest of the world want to believe peace is at hand.

Historical precedent means nothing. Terrorist act followed by terrorist act means nothing. Warnings from the priests and prophets mean nothing.

Even when Arafat explains his Trojan Horse strategy – in English, no less – many people don't hear it.

This Trojan Horse ploy by Arafat is the subject of a dramatic and compelling new documentary by some French filmmakers – one that uses the actual words of Arafat and his henchmen to make the undeniable case that the establishment of a Palestinian state is only the first act of a two-act play. Arafat is the proverbial Greek bearing gifts.

This time, however, it won't be 100 men disembarking from a big horse. It will be 30,000 armed Palestinian "policemen" inside the walls of the city – a city, by the way, already surrounded by a billion hostile neighbors.

"The Trojan Horse" documentary is one of a pair produced in France – with more on the way. A companion video, "Israel and the War of Images" is equally compelling and emotionally gripping – showing for once the real human cost of the ongoing terror war that has consumed the Jewish state ever since the Egyptian Arafat emerged as the self-proclaimed leader-for-life of "Palestine."

Together they show that nothing has changed since Arafat laid out the Trojan Horse strategy in English in a speech in South Africa in 1994.

"I don't consider the [Oslo] agreement any more than the agreement which was signed by our prophet Mohammed and the Qurayish," he said.

What is Arafat talking about? It's the model of Hudayblya. Before Anwar Sadat signed the Camp David accords, he first sought the counsel of an Islamic leader in Cairo. He wanted to know if there was any precedent to make peace with the infidel. He was told about the peace pact Mohammed made at the small oasis of Hudayblya – between Mecca and Medina.

In the early years of Islam, Mohammed found himself fighting a losing battle. So he signed a 10-year peace agreement with the Qurayish tribe in Mecca. Two years later, when his forces were stronger and the Meccans were living securely off their guard, Mohammed marched into the city and captured it.

In Arabic, there is a concept known as Takiya – it is the right within Islam to fake peace when you are weak, so that you can wait for better timing to conquer your enemy. There's a famous Arab saying: "When your enemy is strong, kiss his hand and pray that it will be broken one day."

And that's the game Arafat is playing today. If you have any doubts, you can see it and hear it for yourselves with your own ears from the mouths of Arafat and his top officials and spokesmen. Over and over again, in these two compelling videos, available only through the WorldNetDaily online store – ShopNetDaily – Palestinian leaders explain that their ultimate goals remain a Palestine from "the sea to the river" – meaning from the Jordan to the Mediterranean.

Can facts change people's perceptions? Is it too late to reverse course? Is the enemy already inside the gates? Will the people of Israel make the same mistake the ancient Meccans and the people of Troy made? Remember Hudayblya.

[kramadas]

Source? Link?

Originally posted by dusted

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The Trojan Horse

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Posted: March 7, 2002

1:00 a.m. Eastern

By Joseph Farah

Why can't more people see it? Why doesn't the whole world get it?

I'm talking about Yasser Arafat's "Trojan Horse" approach to the destruction of the state of Israel.

Maybe too many people are not reading any more. Perhaps they have just forgotten, or are unfamiliar with, Homer's "The Illiad" and the tale of how Troy was overtaken by stealth.

Troy was a walled and well-defended city. The Greeks attacked Troy for nine years, but could not overcome its defenses. Ulysses hatched a plan to construct a huge giant horse that could conceal 100 men. After sealing themselves in, the rest of the Greeks sailed away.

In the morning, the Trojans celebrated their victory. Despite warnings from a priest to beware of Greeks bearing gifts, the people of the city wanted to claim the horse as their victory prize. They even tore down some of their walls to get the horse – and the unseen enemy – inside the gates.

When Ulysses and his men disembarked from the Trojan Horse, they burned the city, killed the king and robbed Troy of all its wealth.

For more than 30 years, Arafat has been following the same ploy in his conduct toward Israel. When he talks of peaceful coexistence between his Palestinian state and the Jewish state, he is building a Trojan Horse. And just like the people of Troy, many Israelis and much of the rest of the world want to believe peace is at hand.

Historical precedent means nothing. Terrorist act followed by terrorist act means nothing. Warnings from the priests and prophets mean nothing.

Even when Arafat explains his Trojan Horse strategy – in English, no less – many people don't hear it.

This Trojan Horse ploy by Arafat is the subject of a dramatic and compelling new documentary by some French filmmakers – one that uses the actual words of Arafat and his henchmen to make the undeniable case that the establishment of a Palestinian state is only the first act of a two-act play. Arafat is the proverbial Greek bearing gifts.

This time, however, it won't be 100 men disembarking from a big horse. It will be 30,000 armed Palestinian "policemen" inside the walls of the city – a city, by the way, already surrounded by a billion hostile neighbors.

"The Trojan Horse" documentary is one of a pair produced in France – with more on the way. A companion video, "Israel and the War of Images" is equally compelling and emotionally gripping – showing for once the real human cost of the ongoing terror war that has consumed the Jewish state ever since the Egyptian Arafat emerged as the self-proclaimed leader-for-life of "Palestine."

Together they show that nothing has changed since Arafat laid out the Trojan Horse strategy in English in a speech in South Africa in 1994.

"I don't consider the [Oslo] agreement any more than the agreement which was signed by our prophet Mohammed and the Qurayish," he said.

What is Arafat talking about? It's the model of Hudayblya. Before Anwar Sadat signed the Camp David accords, he first sought the counsel of an Islamic leader in Cairo. He wanted to know if there was any precedent to make peace with the infidel. He was told about the peace pact Mohammed made at the small oasis of Hudayblya – between Mecca and Medina.

In the early years of Islam, Mohammed found himself fighting a losing battle. So he signed a 10-year peace agreement with the Qurayish tribe in Mecca. Two years later, when his forces were stronger and the Meccans were living securely off their guard, Mohammed marched into the city and captured it.

In Arabic, there is a concept known as Takiya – it is the right within Islam to fake peace when you are weak, so that you can wait for better timing to conquer your enemy. There's a famous Arab saying: "When your enemy is strong, kiss his hand and pray that it will be broken one day."

And that's the game Arafat is playing today. If you have any doubts, you can see it and hear it for yourselves with your own ears from the mouths of Arafat and his top officials and spokesmen. Over and over again, in these two compelling videos, available only through the WorldNetDaily online store – ShopNetDaily – Palestinian leaders explain that their ultimate goals remain a Palestine from "the sea to the river" – meaning from the Jordan to the Mediterranean.

Can facts change people's perceptions? Is it too late to reverse course? Is the enemy already inside the gates? Will the people of Israel make the same mistake the ancient Meccans and the people of Troy made? Remember Hudayblya.

[breaksny]

More right wing propaganda. Probably made by people who thought that ludicrous netanyahu.org site u and malone were raving about yesterday was too moderate. This is complete bs people. There's no way it can happen and besides being racist, it grossly simplifies what Fatah or the Palestinian people, quite separate from Fatah stand for. The so called "facts" this sort of video is purporting to portray are only a portion of what the Palestinian elite or its people stand for. Arafat is here to stay, unlike Sharon or Netanyahu, and if any of you SERIOUSLY think things are gonna get better before Palestine does come into being, you're sadly deluding yourselves. The only solution I can see that would achieve said result is the ethnic cleansing which the late Minister Zeevi's party is recommending. Maybe you should consult them or Milosevic or the former leadership of Serbia for advice on how to achieve that. Then Israel will really have a war on its hands, and the US will probably lose support throughout the entire middle east. Fortunately, none of that nonsense is gonna happen.

[massad]

wow what a nice picture, too bad only one fucking dead arab int aht picture!!!

made my day, thanks sassa