pookie23 Posted July 31 Report Share Posted July 31 They give up their two best pitching prospects for two average pitchers...one who's not even guaranteed to stay here after this season when he becomes a free agent? WHAT THE FUCK?!!?This is by far the worst trade in the history of the Mets..if not in all of baseball. I've had it with this teamm....I f'n give up!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magellanmax Posted July 31 Report Share Posted July 31 They give up their two best pitching prospects for two average pitchers...one who's not even guaranteed to stay here after this season when he becomes a free agent? WHAT THE FUCK?!!?This is by far the worst trade in the history of the Mets..if not in all of baseball. I've had it with this teamm....I f'n give up!! First off.. this is one hell of a trade... lets get real for a second, you or any mets fan thought your team would be this close to the div. lead at this stage of the season ?? Ofcoz not, this is bonus baseball your team is giving you... dont get greedy and start sounding off like the initial roster when the season began was a WS calibre. Give the new pitchers a chance to prove their worth. Honestly, the mets never quite had a 5th starter.. it was all a gamble... Jay Seo was a bust... my boy Johnny has a knack of blowing more than ball games.I hear your plight regarding the mortgaging the future by trading prospects.. but look at it from the other side of the fence... the prospects are nothing but a "hope" invested.... they havent proved anything..on the other hand, these new pitchers have a few notches on their belts.. i.e Victor (guy has terrorized the yamkees) just ask the yamkee fanz. Kris has proven potential...I'll bet you, the mets front office is tired of playing second fiddle to the yamkees... they had to take a chance to make a splash and keep the few fans still lingering around. Dont shoot the messenger just yet till you read the letter. It could be a blessing in disguise.Is it me or do the mets have a more formidable pitching staff ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pookie23 Posted July 31 Author Report Share Posted July 31 First off.. this is one hell of a trade... lets get real for a second, you or any mets fan thought your team would be this close to the div. lead at this stage of the season ?? Ofcoz not, this is bonus baseball your team is giving you... dont get greedy and start sounding off like the initial roster when the season began was a WS calibre. Give the new pitchers a chance to prove their worth. Honestly, the mets never quite had a 5th starter.. it was all a gamble... Jay Seo was a bust... my boy Johnny has a knack of blowing more than ball games.I hear your plight regarding the mortgaging the future by trading prospects.. but look at it from the other side of the fence... the prospects are nothing but a "hope" invested.... they havent proved anything..on the other hand, these new pitchers have a few notches on their belts.. i.e Victor (guy has terrorized the yamkees) just ask the yamkee fanz. Kris has proven potential...I'll bet you, the mets front office is tired of playing second fiddle to the yamkees... they had to take a chance to make a splash and keep the few fans still lingering around. Dont shoot the messenger just yet till you read the letter. It could be a blessing in disguise.Is it me or do the mets have a more formidable pitching staff ? You need to stop talking out of your ass...if the Mets finish .500 this year that would be a 16 GAME IMPROVEMENT over last year...which is a success. Kazmir and Peterson would be ready next year - both are strikeout power pitchers, the likes the Mets haven't seen in a loooooooooooooong time! Now you lose power at first, and gain two mediocre pitchers that pushing 30, and sacrificing two of the top pitching prospects in the MAJOR LEAGUES!!All for what? A prayer for this year? A 1,000 to 1 shot? (7 games back and fading) Fuck that - Next year was their time (they would have surely been a favorite to win the division) and all this trade did was set them back two more years.Could they have just waited till Benson was a free agent and sign him without giving up prospects? YES!! And why didn't they do that?BECAUSE THE FRONT OFFICE ARE FUCKING MORONS!!I was gonna go to about 10 games when I came back...now I won't waste my time, energy or money on this backward-ass organization! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agrkdj Posted July 31 Report Share Posted July 31 You need to stop talking out of your ass...if the Mets finish .500 this year that would be a 16 GAME IMPROVEMENT over last year...which is a success. Kazmir and Peterson would be ready next year - both are strikeout power pitchers, the likes the Mets haven't seen in a loooooooooooooong time! Now you lose power at first, and gain two mediocre pitchers that pushing 30, and sacrificing two of the top pitching prospects in the MAJOR LEAGUES!!All for what? A prayer for this year? A 1,000 to 1 shot? (7 games back and fading) Fuck that - Next year was their time (they would have surely been a favorite to win the division) and all this trade did was set them back two more years.Could they have just waited till Benson was a free agent and sign him without giving up prospects? YES!! And why didn't they do that?BECAUSE THE FRONT OFFICE ARE FUCKING MORONS!!I was gonna go to about 10 games when I came back...now I won't waste my time, energy or money on this backward-ass organization! :bigfinger:im a huge met fan and i can see where your coming from.......but all these guys with potential,im tired of hearing that word...........not too long ago i used to hear,wilson,pulsipher and izzy.......where did that get us,,,,granted izzy has become a good closer but all those years waiting on potential that never blossomed.......in benson u have a proven pitcher who will improve the back end of the rotation 100%...........i agree with the zambrano trade,i wouldnt have given up kazmir..........but whats done is done.......who knows maybe with the better pitching we will pull out a rabbit out our ass and win the nl east Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pookie23 Posted July 31 Author Report Share Posted July 31 im a huge met fan and i can see where your coming from.......but all these guys with potential,im tired of hearing that word...........not too long ago i used to hear,wilson,pulsipher and izzy.......where did that get us,,,,granted izzy has become a good closer but all those years waiting on potential that never blossomed.......in benson u have a proven pitcher who will improve the back end of the rotation 100%...........i agree with the zambrano trade,i wouldnt have given up kazmir..........but whats done is done.......who knows maybe with the better pitching we will pull out a rabbit out our ass and win the nl eastLook at Paul Wilson now - he's tearing it up now as well. Benson is not proven...he's been a sub .500 pitcher for his career. Now I'd be happy if it was Barry Zito and Jason Schmidt - but these two bumbs? Come on...and there's NO WAY they will leapforg three teams and make up seven games to win the division...No way! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agrkdj Posted July 31 Report Share Posted July 31 Look at Paul Wilson now - he's tearing it up now as well. Benson is not proven...he's been a sub .500 pitcher for his career. Now I'd be happy if it was Barry Zito and Jason Schmidt - but these two bumbs? Come on...and there's NO WAY they will leapforg three teams and make up seven games to win the division...No way!paul wilson tearing it up..........ill give u the fact that he got off to a 7-0 start but lately he has been getting hammered,,,,,,,,and how long did it take him to get to this point,its like 10 years later and u tell me that u can wait 10 years for potential...........it might be 3 teams but there so bunched its not as crazy as you think Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magellanmax Posted July 31 Report Share Posted July 31 Could they have just waited till Benson was a free agent and sign him without giving up prospects? YES!! And why didn't they do that?No way he was gonna be available... It would have been a miracle if he wasnt signed b4 the trade deadline. and besides, if he has a stellar performance in the remaining games, you know the mets will offer him a contract after the season he cant refuse. Zambrano is a good pitcher, you guys literally got him for nothing !! He makes around 300k and he's eligible for arbitration at the end of the year which considering his #s should put him at about 1.5 mill per !! its a fuckin steal... and as agrkdj said, the prospect line has been played out, its time something happened. And dont be such a pessimist, the mets are only 7 games out and alotta games to play, stranger things have happened Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captainpec Posted August 1 Report Share Posted August 1 I agree with Spragga. To make blockbuster trades when you team is significantly out of the lead is just foolish. They are acting like they are two or three games out of the lead and need two solid starters. I would have gone for bats if anything, without giving up their two pitching prospects. They will regret their decision in September. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pookie23 Posted August 1 Author Report Share Posted August 1 I agree with Spragga. To make blockbuster trades when you team is significantly out of the lead is just foolish. They are acting like they are two or three games out of the lead and need two solid starters. I would have gone for bats if anything, without giving up their two pitching prospects. They will regret their decision in September.They're regretting it tonight - freefall continues at 8 games Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fliptoniaaa Posted August 1 Report Share Posted August 1 face it....the mets just suck donkey nuts!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Marlins baby!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pookie23 Posted August 1 Author Report Share Posted August 1 No way he was gonna be available... It would have been a miracle if he wasnt signed b4 the trade deadline. and besides, if he has a stellar performance in the remaining games, you know the mets will offer him a contract after the season he cant refuse. Zambrano is a good pitcher, you guys literally got him for nothing !! He makes around 300k and he's eligible for arbitration at the end of the year which considering his #s should put him at about 1.5 mill per !! its a fuckin steal... and as agrkdj said, the prospect line has been played out, its time something happened. And dont be such a pessimist, the mets are only 7 games out and alotta games to play, stranger things have happened They have no chance now...it's over...time to get ready for football now and wait till next year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djrx06 Posted August 1 Report Share Posted August 1 The mets are a bunch of idiots.Why would you trade for two mediocre pitchers when you are 8-10 games out of both the division race and wild card?? Mark my words! Scott Kazmir is gonna be a stud in the majors. Donkey nuts it is!!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kfitz73 Posted August 2 Report Share Posted August 2 Yeah, dumb moves by the Mets... Even if they managed to get in the playoffs, they wouldn't last too long anyway. They should've kept their prospects and signed a pitcher from this years free agent crop... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
majinbuu Posted August 4 Report Share Posted August 4 First off.. this is one hell of a trade... lets get real for a second, you or any mets fan thought your team would be this close to the div. lead at this stage of the season ?? Ofcoz not, this is bonus baseball your team is giving you... dont get greedy and start sounding off like the initial roster when the season began was a WS calibre. Give the new pitchers a chance to prove their worth. Honestly, the mets never quite had a 5th starter.. it was all a gamble... Jay Seo was a bust... my boy Johnny has a knack of blowing more than ball games.I hear your plight regarding the mortgaging the future by trading prospects.. but look at it from the other side of the fence... the prospects are nothing but a "hope" invested.... they havent proved anything..on the other hand, these new pitchers have a few notches on their belts.. i.e Victor (guy has terrorized the yamkees) just ask the yamkee fanz. Kris has proven potential...I'll bet you, the mets front office is tired of playing second fiddle to the yamkees... they had to take a chance to make a splash and keep the few fans still lingering around. Dont shoot the messenger just yet till you read the letter. It could be a blessing in disguise.Is it me or do the mets have a more formidable pitching staff ? i hate to admit it, but for once i agree with you.....those guys traded away werent the next big thing....they were prospects that havent done anything at the major league level....how many times have players like that do nothing in the major leagues? remember generation K? the mets just made their starting pitching look way better than what they started year.....this is not a deal fro the immediate future, but for the next few years.lets face it, the front of the rotation is getting older and the mets need major league talent to fill in those impending holes. do you really think scott kazmir is the answer? thats putting alot of hope on unproven talent...most scouts think peterson will be no more than a # 4 pitcher....and kazmir a poor man's billy wagner.if the mets didnt get benson he was headed to atlanta and would probably sign there....rick peterson will have these guys pitching well....theres no doubt he gets the most out of pitchers and has the rep as one of the best pitching coaches in the majors...besides..this deal isnt that bad, with some better relief pitching and a big bat, the mets could become a really good team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveespa Posted August 4 Report Share Posted August 4 Benson's wife........thats whats wrong......they all want a piece of that ass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonStephen Posted August 4 Report Share Posted August 4 i hate to admit it, but for once i agree with you.....those guys traded away werent the next big thing....they were prospects that havent done anything at the major league level....how many times have players like that do nothing in the major leagues? remember generation K? the mets just made their starting pitching look way better than what they started year.....this is not a deal fro the immediate future, but for the next few years.lets face it, the front of the rotation is getting older and the mets need major league talent to fill in those impending holes. do you really think scott kazmir is the answer? thats putting alot of hope on unproven talent...most scouts think peterson will be no more than a # 4 pitcher....and kazmir a poor man's billy wagner.if the mets didnt get benson he was headed to atlanta and would probably sign there....rick peterson will have these guys pitching well....theres no doubt he gets the most out of pitchers and has the rep as one of the best pitching coaches in the majors...besides..this deal isnt that bad, with some better relief pitching and a big bat, the mets could become a really good team.agreed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nomembername Posted August 4 Report Share Posted August 4 I think alot of people who DO agree with the trade are missing the biggest point...I have no problem getting rid of Kazmir because he is just a prospect with no proven talent but he was regarded by many as maybe the top pitching prospect in baseball. I feel like we should have waited till the off season and than used him as trade bait for a more complete pitcher than zambrano. I do like Zambrano and think he has good stuff but he's too much of a project....they could have gotten more is basically what I am saying.And Benson, I really don't have a problem with that trade except that maybe they could have waited till the off season to sign him but either way they gave up Wiggington for him who had no place on this team. Trust me, Benson will be signing a contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pookie23 Posted August 4 Author Report Share Posted August 4 if the mets didnt get benson he was headed to atlanta and would probably sign there....rick peterson will have these guys pitching well....theres no doubt he gets the most out of pitchers and has the rep as one of the best pitching coaches in the majors...Mark my words right now...Benson WILL sign with ATL if he becomes a free agent....write it down.Peterson...he's done nothing here! Why is the bullpen so damn bad if he's such the guru everyone makes him out to be?Kazmir is a STUD prospect...they should've kept him and go for Zito when he becomes available. No one has still given me a valid argument about how this trade was a positive - and I don't wanna hear about Benson's $2 whore of a wife... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrismakk69 Posted August 4 Report Share Posted August 4 I don't have any problems with the Benson trade..You don't need Wiggington..The only problem I have with it is whether he signs with the Mets or not..Now giving up Kazmir for Zambrano = Stupid move. There aren't too many stud pitchers coming up. If he is what they make him out to be, it's a bad move on the Mets part. Zambrano is ok, but he walks people so much its sick.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
majinbuu Posted August 5 Report Share Posted August 5 Peterson...he's done nothing here! Why is the bullpen so damn bad if he's such the guru everyone makes him out to be?Kazmir is a STUD prospect...they should've kept him and go for Zito when he becomes available. he's done nothing? the starting pitching has been one of the bright spots for the mets this year...peterson has gotten alot out of them. but the fact remains, the mets starters are older and cant go as deep into the game....the bullpen isnt bad because of no talent, its bad because most of the guys are used way too much.the mets are near the top of the majors in pitchers used per game...getting these guys not only gets younger pitchers in the starting rotation, it helps b/c these guys will go will add to the top of the rotaion of leiter, trachsel and even glavine.how many times has jae seo or ginter lasted for 3 innings and the bullpen has had to take over? answer... almost every time they pitched... by getting these guys, you avoid those short outings by your starters....giving the bullpen a break.the best answer to why these were good deals is NOW (not in 2 years when kazmir might be ready) they have a strong starting rotation for years to come, and a good starting rotation will make their bullpen better. regardless, the mets arent going to win the WS this year.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codica3 Posted August 5 Report Share Posted August 5 Mark my words right now...Benson WILL sign with ATL if he becomes a free agent....write it down.Peterson...he's done nothing here! Why is the bullpen so damn bad if he's such the guru everyone makes him out to be?Kazmir is a STUD prospect...they should've kept him and go for Zito when he becomes available. No one has still given me a valid argument about how this trade was a positive - and I don't wanna hear about Benson's $2 whore of a wife...You keep your googling little Mets eyes OFF Barry Zito. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bxbomb Posted August 5 Report Share Posted August 5 Mark my words right now...Benson WILL sign with ATL if he becomes a free agent....write it down.Peterson...he's done nothing here! Why is the bullpen so damn bad if he's such the guru everyone makes him out to be?Kazmir is a STUD prospect...they should've kept him and go for Zito when he becomes available. No one has still given me a valid argument about how this trade was a positive - and I don't wanna hear about Benson's $2 whore of a wife...THe bullpen is so bad cause there is NO talent left there ...the starting pitching has been a+Your words have been marked ...the only reason the mets made the deal is cause BEnson came out and said he would sign with the MEts if they traded for him Kazmir is like 5'10 ...outside of pedro how many little guy power pitchers have succeded ??from espn:MetsTrue, they were seven games out of first place. True, they've never been more than two games over .500 at any point all season. So we understand why people looked at the Mets' two deals -- for Kris Benson and Victor Zambrano -- and thought, "Have they lost their minds?"But in the end, we bet, they'll wind up looking smarter than many people think -- as long as Rick Peterson lives up to his reputation as Best Pitching Coach on Earth, and as long as Scott Kazmir doesn't go on to win 12 Cy Youngs.It's up to Peterson to tap the magic in Zambrano's arm. To do it, he's going to have to make a whole bunch of walks and hit batters disappear. (Had Zambrano not been traded, he was on track to join Randy Johnson as the only American Leaguers in the last half-century to lead the league in walks and HBPs in back-to-back seasons.)The Mets took a gamble in trading for Victor Zambrano. Now he must deliver for them. But this is also a guy who throws 96 miles an hour and was holding opposing hitters to a .230 batting average. So he's eminently salvageable. In fact, Peterson reportedly told the Mets he could get Zambrano straightened out "in 10 minutes." And if he's right, that Mets rotation just got very dangerous.Peterson is also the big reason Benson immediately told the Mets he wants to sign and stick around. Benson and Tom Glavine share the same agent (Greg Clifton). So Benson is well aware of what the pitching coach did for Glavine this year.Obviously, Benson's 43-49 lifetime record doesn't make you think, say, Tom Seaver. But scouts who have been following Benson say he's cleaned up his delivery, figured out how to pitch and made himself a far more attractive commodity than the numbers on his baseball card might suggest.So if that's his real self, and the Mets can get him signed, this potentially gives them maybe the NL East's deepest rotation for the rest of this year and beyond.But what people are wondering is: At what price?On paper, the three minor leaguers they traded -- Kazmir, pitcher Matt Peterson and catcher Justin Huber -- looked like their three best prospects. But there are mixed reviews on all of them.Peterson was described by one scouting director as "a No. 5 starter" and by another as "a No. 4, at best." The same scouting directors questioned Huber's instincts and projected him as no better than a backup catcher in the big leagues.So it's Kazmir who will ultimately determine the wisdom of these deals. And one scouting director called him "the best prospect traded by anyone this year."But two other scouting directors we surveyed had their doubts. Both think he'll wind up as a relief pitcher. And, given his size (6-feet, 170 pounds), he'll draw comparisons to Billy Wagner -- not necessarily for the better.Wagner, said one scouting director, "is much stronger physically than Kazmir. So to me, the best he'll be is a poor man's Billy Wagner."Kazmir could prove everybody wrong -- or right. But you know there will be a lot of people in baseball -- and in New York -- watching him try.__________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kfitz73 Posted August 5 Report Share Posted August 5 It really depends on your perspective. Benson & Zambrano are solid back end of the rotation pitchers... nothing more, nothing less. Kazmir has the chance to be something special but you just never know with prospects... (A certain ex Yankee phenom Brien Taylor come to mind) Coincidently, I can't even name the last Met who came up through the system and was a big contributor for them. So from the Mets perspective they took the sure thing and I can't say I blame them.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pookie23 Posted August 5 Author Report Share Posted August 5 It really depends on your perspective. Benson & Zambrano are solid back end of the rotation pitchers... nothing more, nothing less. Kazmir has the chance to be something special but you just never know with prospects... (A certain ex Yankee phenom Brien Taylor come to mind) Coincidently, I can't even name the last Met who came up through the system and was a big contributor for them. So from the Mets perspective they took the sure thing and I can't say I blame them....But that's the thing...they aren't "sure" things...Benson isn't even a .500 pitcher!! Zambrano is BARELY about that...Peterson isn't gonna make them Cy Young winners...The Mets are thinking these two will be their #1 and #2 starters soon...sadly mistaken!last met that has come through the system...Reyes, Alfonzo and Wigginton to name a few....and proabably Kazmir Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kfitz73 Posted August 5 Report Share Posted August 5 But that's the thing...they aren't "sure" things...Benson isn't even a .500 pitcher!! Zambrano is BARELY about that...Peterson isn't gonna make them Cy Young winners...The Mets are thinking these two will be their #1 and #2 starters soon...sadly mistaken!last met that has come through the system...Reyes, Alfonzo and Wigginton to name a few....and proabably Kazmir1) They came from the Pirates & Devil Rays respectively.... Randy Johnson & Pedro Martinez would have a hard time being .500 pitchers at these places. The Mets have no intentions of these guys being their #1 & #2 starters. These guys are more like 3-5 starters and in that role they will be fine. 2) Reyes, Alfonzo, & Wiggington.... This is exactly my point. Reyes is an unknown. Let him play a full healthy season and then we can see if he'll be any good. Alfonzo is playing himself out of a job in SF, and Wiggington is a spare part, nothing more. If this is the type of talent that comes through the Mets farm system, you can understand why they're not so high on their prospects... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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