You're right, and I definitely prefer to discuss ways of getting fit cleanly. I just think it's better to send this guy off informed than give him the boot without any info. It's kind of like sex ed... abstinence is the only safe sex, but kids gotta know about condoms... Great advice. See how far you can go naturally, and if you decide that's not enough, *THEN* consider steroids. I feel the same way about all supplements actually, expect protein. No creatine for me until I feel I "need" it. As long as I'm making good gains naturally, I'm happy.